Just had a row with my mum over my dog

[Fluffyteal272]

We've got a lovely 3 year old, medium sized mixed breed. He's a sweet boy but has always been nervous and after a bad experience when he was younger is particularly nervous of children.

We've worked very hard with him and he's now not reactive at all when we're out although we always have him on lead, don't let children stroke him and tend to stick to quiet walks where he can sniff and explore undisturbed.

He's great at home, very settled but doesn't do well with strangers in the house. Luckily we've got enough room that we can manage this easily and we just shut him away (for brief periods) when needed. He loves my parents and PIL however he is still an anxious dog and his bed is his safe space. I've told my mum time and time again to leave him alone when he's sleeping or in his bed. They've just been for a visit and I had to pop upstairs, I came back down to find my mum practically nose to nose with him, he was lying on his back in his bed (showing his tummy) and my mum was stroking him. He was licking his lips. I told her to leave him alone, she said look-he loves a tummy tickle. I tried to explain his body language and she still wouldn't listen so it turned into a full on argument.

She's also saying how much my niece loves him and wants to see him. Before the bad experience he had which made him anxious of children, he did have a lovely bond with my niece but she's only 5 and I just don't want to put him in a situation that I know he'll find difficult. There's no need for her to see him, she doesn't need a relationship with him, we see plenty of her as she family without the dog.

My mum thinks I'm being dramatic and ridiculous and I should let them meet and see how it goes. This turned into another argument.

Am I doing the right thing? She's left and I'm not questioning myself.

*I'm now questioning myself

You are right.

You are doing the right thing by being proactive.
He is your dog and therefore your responsibility to make sure he is happy and people around him are safe.
Stick to your guns!

Thankyou both. We've spoken to our behaviourist about getting him used to children in the house but unless they are able to strictly follow directions in order to train him then it's not going to work and as I can't even get my 70 year old mother to do as I ask I don't hold out much hope for a 5 year old! It just feels easier and safer to keep him away. My mum thinks I'm making the problem worse and he's missing out of family time because of it. I know he is missing out on experiences but I'd rather do that than risk him biting because that would be game over. He does have a lovely life, he gets lots of lovely walks and time with us.

I'd try explaining to her that what feels like missing out on family time is just a stress-inducing experience for you dog.

And I agree if mum can't follow your sensible boundaries who will teach them to the 5 yr old when you have to pop up stairs?

And he gets his family time with us, we're his family. If DN wants to spend time with a dog then my DB can get her one. That's not my responsibility. The problem with my mum I think is that she's never seen him react, she just sees a lovely, sweet natured dog and she doesn't understand his body language. Lip licking and being submissive mean nothing to her.

I'll stick to my guns and I'll have another conversation with her when the dusts settled d.

You are right. Your mother is out of order. I would be showing her the door!

If she won’t listen to you, do you think she would accept a simple book on the subject of canine body language?

This one by Lili Chin is lovely and suggested by Kikopup in one of her videos. I bought it for a family member last Christmas and they found it really interesting, whereas they wouldn’t read anything that looked more formal or ‘like a dog training book’.

Alternatively, maybe show her the ladder of aggression to help her understand the subtle signs that lead to escalation when they are ignored and explain that you are worried about her safety as well as your dog’s wellbeing.

I know it’s really difficult, my PILs have always had dogs and are still clueless when it comes to training/behaviour. They think I overthink everything as, ‘we’ve never done any of that and our dogs have always been fine’ (they haven’t) and completely ignore anything I say, despite knowing I have a qualification in dog behaviour. In fact sometimes I think that makes them worse, as they feel judged if I say anything. SIL is the same and her dog is a very large breed, with little training and basically a hooligan that has caused all sorts of incidents in the park. As a result, our dogs no longer visit their houses and are put in a different room, where they can feel safe and relaxed, when they come here.

Be blunt, ask her what she and your DB would expect if he bite your niece?

I'm guessing they'd jump to "he needs to be PTS".

If you want him to get more comfortable with kids fine for you to work on that, but not fine for others to force it on him and then he and you have to bear the consequences of their actions.

We have a similar situation. Nervous dog, doesn't like strangers in the house and a MIL whose favourite phrase is "she's fine".
She often isn't. I know her and can read her body language like you can with your dog.
The way I see it is, we have to speak up for them. They can't do it and as owners it's our responsibility.
As someone else said, if he did bite there would be calls for pts. You are protecting him.
@PermanentlyDizzy wow. How do you not scream?? I would be screaming.

Please stick with what you are doing.

I work in rescue and it’s great that you can spot his signs of discomfort.

You're right. Ignore your mum.

My dog 'misses out' on a lot because she is a reactive rescue dog (she doesn't do car rides, playing with other dogs, visits with strangers). I just think that she has a much nicer life with us, tootling around the house and going for walks when all is quiet, and she is in a much better place than wherever she was before. It might not look ideal to other people, but she's happy and safe, and keeping other people and dogs at a distance makes life safer for them too. You know your dog best, and people should respect your rules. If they can't do that, then you need to keep them away from your dog, for everyone's sake.

@Bebeschitt, I’ve given up. Been married for 30 years and if they haven’t changed in that time, they’re not going to now.

We made a conscious decision to keep our dogs separate from them many years ago. They do love dogs, their own is spoiled rotten and luckily came to them as an adult rescue with an incredibly sweet, calm nature (although not before they sent several back after a day for being, too lively, not listening, etc). Unfortunately, they just don’t understand them and don’t want to learn. Used to drive me batshit when I carefully trained my dogs to greet calmly with 4 on the floor and they would always walk in, whip them into a frenzy and encourage them to jump over the dog gate!

Years ago they used to go on about how well trained one of their dogs was, completely neglecting to mention or even acknowledge that it was dh and I that had trained her! Now she is held up as a shining example of their experience/knowledge of dogs/training.

I have had a few difficult rescue dogs over the years, so it has been really important that I only expose them to people who are willing to listen and follow my instructions with them.

Thankyou for all the positive replies, you've made me feel a lot better about it.

I would love to have a dog who is relaxed and happy to meet people and play with kids etc but that's not who he is and we love him so much, I want him to be part of our family for as long as possible and I feel very protective of him. He's my responsibility and if he ever did bite a child I feel like it would be my fault not his and yet he would be the one paying the ultimate sacrifice for it.

PermanentlyDizzy thankyou for the links. I think that would help.

Another one that thinks you're absolutely doing the right thing. Too many people think they understand dogs when they don't have the first clue. As the owner of a reactive dog (or any dog really) you are the only advocate your dog has to keep them safe and away from things that make them uncomfortable and likely to react. My DM is desperate to bring my DNs to stay here and I've just said a blunt no - they are tweens but have absolutely zero experience with dogs, and the eldest is actually afraid of them. She thinks 'it will all be okay' if we just let them 'make friends'. Even if ddog doesn't actually react, she hates it when we have visitors and finds it really stressful, so other than the select few people she knows and likes, and who understand her issues, we just don't invite people round - its her home and she deserves to feel safe here.

You’re right she should leave him alone in his bed.

But having said that, my dog rolled over to show his tummy and licked his lips and it was pure submission and not a precursor to an attack on me. So was that not all that your dog was doing? Sounds like he likes her or he’d have snapped?

@Couchpotato3 exactly! You make a life for the dog you have, not the dog you thought you'd have. Ours is perfectly content being at home with me and DH day in day out, with a daily run round an empty football field, a weekly trip to a secure field, and a trip to a deserted beach every now and again. Quite often she asks to go home halfway through by heading for the car! She doesn't like new places, or busy places, or strangers coming too close. Of course it would be bloody lovely to have a super social friendly dog you could take anywhere, but that's not what we have, so we live our lives accordingly and accept the restrictions that come with having a family member who struggles with a lot of things.

My aunt has a dog she doesn't entirely trust around children and animals he is muzzled brought out to socialise then put in a different room later he will be bought out again but she is extremely careful because he snapped and bit her other dog and had it been a child she would have had him put to sleep

Elieza You're right that it was submission, he's a very submissive dog but it wasn't 'I want you to give me tummy rubs and talk baby an inch from my face' which is what my mum then did.

She should have left him alone as he was just relaxing in his bed with a chew. When I came into the kitchen he clearly looked worried, he was frozen in the belly up position, lip licking. That to me is him scared and not knowing how to get out of the situation. I called him over to me and he instantly relaxed. If it had gone on much longer I'm sure it would have ended in a snap as she was completely misreading his signals.

fruckkkit

You make a life for the dog you have, not the dog you thought you'd have I love this.

@PermanentlyDizzy strange people. Having someone trained in dog behaviour at their disposal but not utilising their knowledge? Can you be my SIL instead please

My parents are similar, we have a rescue and although they don’t have many behavioural issues she’s still quite young, and very excited. Anyone who meets gets instructions for calm voices, no flapping etc and that’s all my parents do despite repeated warnings. My mother shrieks in the the dogs face and although she’s very friendly with people we don’t know the whole past so are still careful. It’s so bloody annoying and just one of many reasons we will never let them dog sit (aside from the fact she needs exercise plus a ton of mental stimulation which I don’t trust them to do). They also ignore requests not to give random treats etc. You are doing the right thing to speak up,

I find the idea of a dog "missing out" quite amusing. It's not like dogs sit there scrolling through doggy social media getting FOMO over all the fun family experiences their doggy friends seem to be having

Why would you have a dog like this! What a stress. There are safer breeds.
You're right to keep it away from everyone though.