This is an AIBU

catinboots21 · 2021-08-14T10:03:19+00:00

Okay my view is somewhat coloured because I foster rescue dogs, but here we go. Family member has been wanting a dog for a long time. She would give one a good home - kids not small, massive garden, PT working, lots of support. No probs there then. She called me today saying she has bought a designer dog. It's a something-poo. Obvs I had to bite my tongue but hey ho each to their own. But on elaboration she explained that she's paying 1k for this pup that would normally cost 3k 😱😱😱😱 On the proviso that SHE PROVIDES THE WOMAN WITH A LITTER OF PUPPIES WITHIN 2 YEARS I have no words. Am I crazy thinking this is abhorrent?

Original poster

catinboots21 · 14/08/2021 11:04

I just need to check that my reaction is not disproportionate as I have a tendency to over react to things.

OP posts:

welshdaisy · 14/08/2021 11:47

Wow. No your reaction is not unreasonable. Just wow

Indecisivelurcher · 14/08/2021 11:49

Argh!!!

AlmostSummer21 · 14/08/2021 11:50

YANBU that's disgusting.

She should have reported the backyard breeder & not bought a puppy from there. Apart from the shameful behaviour, it also means she has no idea of the parents of her puppy!

MayContainNits · 14/08/2021 11:54

Appalling. No words. And the total cost of this dog could include the bitch herself, if the whelping goes badly.

season2 · 14/08/2021 11:56

I don't see a problem as long as the breeder is ethical. It's quite common practice and allows breeding dogs to live a wonderful life with their forever family and only have one or two litters rather than a bitch kept entirely for breeding until no longer viable. What a great way to enjoy a fabulous dog if you can't afford the hefty price tag.

By the way I have an "Oodle". Having had several purebreds previously he's the best dog I've ive ever had. The vet agrees as depending on the mix, you get the best of both worlds and fewer health complications.

Bostonbullsmumma · 14/08/2021 11:59

I remember a neighbour bought a puppy with the same provision but when it come to the time for a litter of puppies she refused (I think having got attached to the dog and not wanting to do it)! I'm not sure whatever happened!

SupermanWithTheGreyHair · 14/08/2021 12:01

Yeah, that’s awful. But so many people see animals as just something to exploit that it’s not surprising. Utter cunts.

season2 · 14/08/2021 12:07

@SupermanWithTheGreyHair

Yeah, that’s awful. But so many people see animals as just something to exploit that it’s not surprising. Utter cunts.

How is allowing a dog to live with a family and have one litter awful? Isn't that a better option better than an unethical breeders relentlessly breeding from the same bitch then ditching them when they're of no value?

By the way my dog is fully desexed and has never been used for breeding but I am very grateful to the "guardian families" who allow their dogs to breed one or two litters as I know his parents come from loving families and are not exploited.

tabulahrasa · 14/08/2021 12:37

“I don't see a problem as long as the breeder is ethical. It's quite common practice and allows breeding dogs to live a wonderful life with their forever family and only have one or two litters rather than a bitch kept entirely for breeding until no longer viable. What a great way to enjoy a fabulous dog if you can't afford the hefty price tag.”

It’s fairly common for bad breeders to do it, but no, not ethical.

Good breeders keep the dog themselves, breed 2 or 3 litters and then keep them as retired pets... overbreeding them and then getting rid of them, isn’t the only alternative.

weaselwords · 14/08/2021 12:40

Is it enforceable?

season2 · 14/08/2021 12:47

@tabulahrasa

“I don't see a problem as long as the breeder is ethical. It's quite common practice and allows breeding dogs to live a wonderful life with their forever family and only have one or two litters rather than a bitch kept entirely for breeding until no longer viable. What a great way to enjoy a fabulous dog if you can't afford the hefty price tag.”

It’s fairly common for bad breeders to do it, but no, not ethical.

Good breeders keep the dog themselves, breed 2 or 3 litters and then keep them as retired pets... overbreeding them and then getting rid of them, isn’t the only alternative.

Rubbish! There is a lot of skill and experience to breeding a good line of healthy dogs. You're telling me that only ethical breeders keep their retired bitches after a couple of litters as retired pets? 3 litters per year they're going to end up with several dozen retired bitches before too long. Of course they would prefer to enlist guardian families, it's win win for both and reduces the breeding burden on a small number of bitches.

Anotherlovelybitofsquirrel · 14/08/2021 13:01

Not enforceable. She'd be an ex friend though.

Mantlemoose · 14/08/2021 13:04

Typical dog breeders. My MIL is one (crufts etc) but it's a business and all her dog friends are the same. They're bred to show, they're not pets and from what I can see bred until they're past their best and then sold on/pets. This is one of many reasons I no longer speak to mil.

Spudlet · 14/08/2021 13:05

Oh blimey. That’s not ideal.

I assume the breeder will be paying for all the health tests, the stud fee and the veterinary expenses… oh wait lololol no, they won’t will they… what a nice little earner for them. And of course they’ll be waiting to see if the bitch matures into a dog worth breeding from in terms of health, temperament and conformation, oh wait, no, I bet they won’t… dear oh dear.

Original poster

catinboots21 · 14/08/2021 13:08

@weaselwords

Is it enforceable?

My question too? What if the dog has a terrible temperament or health problems? What if she gets run over and dies. What if she needs a c-section (£800+?) What if she only has one live puppy.

It's all just so scammy and unethical.

OP posts:

GrumpyMiddleAgedWoman · 14/08/2021 13:25

That's shocking. Not every bitch is suitable for breeding - you want to see how she is an adult in terms of conformation and temperament, and run health checks like hip scores before you any further.

And yes, I know breeders who I would consider ethical who keep all or most of their retired bitches until they die. They tend to have four or five dogs and breed a litter every couple of years, and only have a couple of litters per bitch.

XelaM · 14/08/2021 14:08

I'm with @season2 on this. If proper health checks are carried out, it seems like a much more ethical way to breed

tabulahrasa · 14/08/2021 14:12

“You're telling me that only ethical breeders keep their retired bitches after a couple of litters as retired pets? 3 litters per year they're going to end up with several dozen retired bitches before too long.”

Ethical breeders don’t have 3 litters a year....

Reallyreallyborednow · 14/08/2021 14:12

Is this the puppy version of MLM?

The more downlines you can get providing you with puppy sales the more money you make? Way more than breeding puppies yourself…

Scattyhattie · 14/08/2021 14:25

It's a nice earner for the breeder though £1-2k discount probably won't cover dogs costs of keep till old enough and then potentially makes all the profit on a litter. Are they taking dog back to breeder to whelp or is friend also going to get full-time job caring for puppies & potentially intensive 2 hourly hand rearing feeds and all the pup costs?

I'd want to know who is liable for the pregnancy related vet bills? What happens if the bitch dies or are no surviving pups? my rescue friend helped hand rear a litter where the bitch died and the pups all had some virus & slowly faded away, she also regularly takes in pups with disabilities or cleft palettes.

I imagine if have a good relationship with breeder beforehand and perhaps they are more mentor role it may work out but it's a lot of trust to put into someone else with welfare of own dogs & puppies, will they be properly homed and who will take them back if doesn't work out (like a decent breeder should). There's lot of ddetails/scenarios that need to be set out in a contact.

Powertothepetal · 14/08/2021 14:25

It's quite common practice
No it isn’t...

and allows breeding dogs to live a wonderful life with their forever family and only have one or two litters rather than a bitch kept entirely for breeding until no longer viable
No decent breeder would have a dog ‘entirely for breeding until no longer viable’

What a great way to enjoy a fabulous dog if you can't afford the hefty price tag
No dog is worth ‘the hefty price tag’ currently being charged by some greeders.

dustofneptune · 14/08/2021 19:41

If she means that your friend is to find a stud dog and give her the puppies? That is pretty damn crazy.

Or does she mean that she's become a "guardian" home for a dog that the breeder would like to breed from in the future? i.e. The breeder will "borrow" the dog back for a litter, with a stud of her choosing, all health tested, and so on?

NoSquirrels · 14/08/2021 19:49

The breeder will "borrow" the dog back for a litter, with a stud of her choosing, all health tested, and so on?

But who does the puppy care when they arrive? Does the owner have to do all that - or does your dog have to go and stay with the breeder for 8 weeks or whatever?

All sounds a bit non-ideal, to me.

Suzi888 · 14/08/2021 19:52

@tabulahrasa

“I don't see a problem as long as the breeder is ethical. It's quite common practice and allows breeding dogs to live a wonderful life with their forever family and only have one or two litters rather than a bitch kept entirely for breeding until no longer viable. What a great way to enjoy a fabulous dog if you can't afford the hefty price tag.”

It’s fairly common for bad breeders to do it, but no, not ethical.

Good breeders keep the dog themselves, breed 2 or 3 litters and then keep them as retired pets... overbreeding them and then getting rid of them, isn’t the only alternative.

Really? Literally never heard of it.

Where’s the saving? Who pays for all the health scoring, possible C section for bitch etc
Or do you give your dog back to the breeder for a few weeks/months
I have no words either way.