Getting dog used to being out of the crate

[TheBodyPiercer]

Due to a couple of issues our dog can no longer attend doggy daycare.

There's 3 days a week where we're both at work, we do have a Walker come in for an hour then one of our parents also comes by for an hour.

He's happily crate trained and when in there just sleeps but I feel guilty leaving him in there so long so we're trying to transition him out of it.

He still has access to his crate as well as kitchen and hallway but he just sits behind the front door crying and waiting for someone to come.

He's left with toys, kongs, treats etc. But he won't touch any of them until there's someone with him.

How long is he actually left alone for op?

Today he's been left since 11.15 until about 2.15. He's currently sitting at my front door crying and it's breaking my heart!

We're trying to teach him to stay out and getting a dog door installed as there will be some instances my parents can't come and he might be left for 6 hours or so.

Why can’t he go to daycare anymore as he doesn’t sound like he’s suited to staying home alone . You definitely cannot cage him for all those hours especially if he is still caged overnight but I don’t think a dog door is the answer as he may well then just stand in the garden barking , unless of course you live remotely and have no neighbours to upset . If the latter is true then a dog door , and dog loose in a garden becomes a security issue ( dog theft/ burglary) however secure you feel the garden is .

@Floralnomad

Why can’t he go to daycare anymore as he doesn’t sound like he’s suited to staying home alone . You definitely cannot cage him for all those hours especially if he is still caged overnight but I don’t think a dog door is the answer as he may well then just stand in the garden barking , unless of course you live remotely and have no neighbours to upset . If the latter is true then a dog door , and dog loose in a garden becomes a security issue ( dog theft/ burglary) however secure you feel the garden is .

He has some leash reactivity which was made worse by being left to play all day in daycare.

He's also very boisterous and doesn't take social cues from other dogs so doesn't know when enough is enough.

He is a rescue who had a very rough start.

We've working with a behaviourist who has confirmed that daycare is not the place for him (we've tried 3).

@Floralnomad

Why can’t he go to daycare anymore as he doesn’t sound like he’s suited to staying home alone . You definitely cannot cage him for all those hours especially if he is still caged overnight but I don’t think a dog door is the answer as he may well then just stand in the garden barking , unless of course you live remotely and have no neighbours to upset . If the latter is true then a dog door , and dog loose in a garden becomes a security issue ( dog theft/ burglary) however secure you feel the garden is .

In regards to the outside area we've built a run connected to the back door rather than access to the whole garden.

Unfortunately a run isn’t going to make him safer in your garden and so many dogs are stolen from gardens I personally wouldn’t risk it . Would he settle with access to bedrooms / living rooms so he could lay on a settee / bed , my dog always goes to bed when we are out .

Can you put a cosy bed into his crate for a day or two. Then over time remove the crate and he should relax in his bed in the same area.

You may need a plan B if leaving him for a long period of time.

@Floralnomad

Unfortunately a run isn’t going to make him safer in your garden and so many dogs are stolen from gardens I personally wouldn’t risk it . Would he settle with access to bedrooms / living rooms so he could lay on a settee / bed , my dog always goes to bed when we are out .

Yes I understand however he needs to be able to go toilet if were out. We are like fort knocks and our neighbours are always in (with a very mean looking dog patrolling their drive).

We're going to try leaving him in the living room instead and see if he's any more settled there but I fear he'll do the same but at the window instead.

@PollyRoulson

Can you put a cosy bed into his crate for a day or two. Then over time remove the crate and he should relax in his bed in the same area.

You may need a plan B if leaving him for a long period of time.

His crate is lovely and cosy and he settles in there great but he just doesn't go in it when he's left to roam.

Hopefully with the help of the behaviourist he will be able to start going on the group walks so can then go out multiple times with the walker.

Oh Ok I thought he was happy in his crate when on his own.

Yes I agree you do need the help of the behaviourist as it sounds like he is showing separation anxiety hence he can not settle when on his own.

Although if he sleeps happily in his crate that may what you have to do but of course you can not leave him in there for hours. You may need to get a dog sitter in your home for part of the days when he is left a long time.

@PollyRoulson

Oh Ok I thought he was happy in his crate when on his own.

Yes I agree you do need the help of the behaviourist as it sounds like he is showing separation anxiety hence he can not settle when on his own.

Although if he sleeps happily in his crate that may what you have to do but of course you can not leave him in there for hours. You may need to get a dog sitter in your home for part of the days when he is left a long time.

He's fine in the crate with the door closed but not if it's left open and he can roam.

Obviously if we're gone longer than a couple I don't want to crate him so trying to encourage him to be settled out the crate.

How long are you leaving him in total that it's too long for him to be in a crate?

Have you tried a pen?

@warmfluffytowels

How long are you leaving him in total that it's too long for him to be in a crate?

Have you tried a pen?

At the moment he's not in there more than 4 hours maximum however as mentioned above there may be times where our parents aren't able to check in with him on our work days. Also I'd rather him have the freedom to be out of the crate even if it's just an hour but obviously not if its causing him distress.

Is he in the cage with the door shut at night or does he roam ?

@Floralnomad

Is he in the cage with the door shut at night or does he roam ?

Door shut, same issue he would cry to get to us if out. Sleeps the whole night in the crate.

He's a rescue and was crate trained when we got him.

Honestly, if he's not stressed, I would leave him crated. On the days your parents can't come in, can you not ask the dog walker to do two visits?

I do multiple visits for some of my dogs each day :)

@warmfluffytowels

Honestly, if he's not stressed, I would leave him crated. On the days your parents can't come in, can you not ask the dog walker to do two visits?

I do multiple visits for some of my dogs each day :)

That potentially means that the dog is caged for 6/8 hours during the day as well as overnight so potentially more hours in a cage than out of one , that would be very irresponsible .

don’t understand why people on here are so funny about crates. it’s clear that your dog is more comfortable being in a locked crate than out of it, you’re causing him more distress by getting him out than leaving him in there. my dog is the same so he’s in there at night, and when we have to leave him (3 hours when shopping etc). my boyfriends dogs are the same but for longer, but when they’re not they are left to run around in the garden. they are all very happy healthy dogs.

That's why I'm trying to encourage him to settle out the crate but split stints in the crate with him asleep is surely better than him crying at the front door for the entire time.

Like I say we're working on it. We did have someone come in to sit with him for 2 1/2 hours but they're no longer available.

Our dog walker is amazing and the only one who's worked with us on his issues but unfortunately his Availability for solo walks is limited.

@neroforte , dogs are not caged animals , it’s bad enough that people keep rabbits etc locked in small cages .

YouTube have proper ddoggy music! I used it for dpuppy when we had to start leaving her after a year of a houseful of people last year! Search dog music... Loads of choice!

That potentially means that the dog is caged for 6/8 hours during the day as well as overnight so potentially more hours in a cage than out of one , that would be very irresponsible .

I mean, yes and no.

If the dog is stressed when left uncrated (as OP claims he is) then surely it would be kinder to leave him in a crate where he is happy and settled?

Yes, in an ideal world the dog wouldn't be crated for that long but if it's happier in a crate then I don't see an issue personally.

If the choice is miserable dog outside of a crate vs happy, chilled dog in a crate, why would you pick the option that meant the dog would be miserable and stressed?

@warmfluffytowels if you seriously don’t see any issue with a dog being kept in a cage for potentially 16/18 hours a day then I’m not sure we will ever reach a meeting of minds . Would I want to see the dog stressed - no , but my answer would be to hire a dog sitter not lock it in a cage . @TheBodyPiercer obviously rehomed this dog with the idea of using daycare and is working to fix the issue but the question has to be asked as to whether the rescue would have rehomed the dog to them if they thought it was going to be in a cage for 16/18 hours a day . I’m frankly concerned that a dog walker thinks it is ok for a dog to be caged for that amount of time .

I mean, I don't think it's an ideal
situation @Floralnomad but I do think it's better than the dog being stressed and miserable just for the sake of leaving it out of a crate.

A dog sitter is a nice idea but many do walking too, which means that the dog would still need to be left and therefore put in a crate through the day.

If the sitter was to be there all day, the cost would be £60-80 per day I suspect (that's what I would charge anyway) which is almost £250 per week just for dog care.

OP has explained this only happens when her parents can't come - which isn't everyday or even every week. As for the walker - they may not agree but it's not their place to judge or criticise.

I once walked a dog that was crated when he was alone because he was unwell (he had vestibular disease) and would hurt himself if left free to roam.

I really didn't want this to turn into a crate vs no crate debate.

As mentioned its 3 days a week we work, we're working with a behaviourist to help with his issues in the hope that he can join some pack walks.

This is just preparation for odd situations for example my parents go on holiday. We're both self employed and have both been as flexible with our hours as humanly possible.

He was in one daycare just fine but unfortunately it was a second daycare and a dog Walker who were far less experienced than they made out (or just chose to ignore us) that made his reactivity so much worse. So unfortunately it's not just a case of finding a sitter or another daycare, we've been let down to many times and I'm not risking setting back his behaviour again.