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The doghouse

If you're worried about your pet's health, please speak to a vet or qualified professional.

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Original poster

Puppy hurt dd

78 replies

Charliebradbury · 12/05/2021 06:05

We have a 19 week old border collie puppy. He is generally good, the only issue we have is he jumps up at the children and pulls on their clothes. We decided to get a dog trainer in to help us with this. They came round for the first time last night. Now the puppy is normally really good with the children, he has never bitten anybody, he plays with my dd (6) and is gentle, every morning he gets so excited to see her and greets her with face licking and tongue wagging. He will happily just lay across her and sleep.
Yesterday the trainer gave her a bowl of food to hold, puppy saw this and jumped up to get it, the trainer pulled the food away when the puppy had his face in the bowl, he followed the food and caught my dds hand with his teeth in the process. Now she isn't badly hurt or anything just a couple of small scratches and it wasn't a purposeful bite. The trainer then dragged my puppy away by the collar causing it to growl. Later on she asked my daughter to stand and call him to her, the puppy tried to run to her but the trainer had him by a lead so he couldn't get anywhere. He then started to get frustrated and was kind of growling but more in a frustrated way (somewhere between a growl and a whine).
The trainer has now told us we can't have the kids and the puppy together when the puppy has food, that the puppy shouldn't be fed from a bowl and they are concerned about his aggression towards the children.
The thing is he isn't normally at all aggressive, he has never growled before, the kids have hand fed him from the day we got him and he has never bitten them. After they left last night and the puppy had calmed down the first thing he did was go and sit next to my dd and fall asleep.
I suffer terribly from anxiety and have hardly slept all night worrying about what I have done wrong. The trainer went on about how he was aggressive and might need a muzzle but he has never growled or bitten anyone before last night. He loves getting attention from people, he is very excitable whenever he sees people and he is very good with other dogs. In the hour the trainer was there he growled twice, once when she pulled him by the collar and once when our cat came up behind him when she was giving him treats, but when he realised it was the cat he stopped growling and ignored it.
The image they have given is totally the opposite of the reality of day to day with him. I don't know what to do, my dd loves interacting with him and to be told they shouldn't do it really upset her last night. I will point out we never leave them alone at all.

OP posts:

SimonJT · 12/05/2021 06:09

The ‘trainer’ is an idiot, why did the trainer choose excite him over food?

Puppies bite, it isn’t aggression, its just what they do. Dogs growl, it isn’t agression, its the dogs way of saying “leave me alone” after other physical signs such as tense body, whale eye etc has been ignored.

LEMtheoriginal · 12/05/2021 06:16

Sack the trainer. How would you feel if someone whipped your dinner away from you while you were eating? Seriously, im dumbfounded by what yhe trainer has done. The dog now associates your dd with removal of food and rough treatment. Great job

Welshcakes03 · 12/05/2021 06:18

Get a new trainer. She sounds like she was being cruel.
Otherwise give the puppy too me
Photos please.

weaselwords · 12/05/2021 06:23

This isn’t the trainer for your family. Find one who is really experienced with Border Collies, as they are very bright and learn bad habits as quickly as good ones.

ChessIsASport · 12/05/2021 06:31

The trainer sounds awful. If you want to start working on being able to approach the dogs food while they are eating. The first thing to do is add food to the bowl or get the dog to pause eating for a high value treat. Not just snatch the bowl away!

Guarding behaviour in dogs has shot up over lockdown. I really don’t know why, so it is important to ensure your dog doesn’t develop it but, in my opinion, the trainer is not going about it in the correct way.

Original poster

Charliebradbury · 12/05/2021 06:41

Thanks all. We have never had an issue with him and the kids in the whole time we have had him other than the excited jumping up. The trainer told us to stop using a food bowl all together but I'm not sure how this will help. I am also concerned that he will now associate my dd with having food taken away from him so I don't know whether I should just ignore some of the advice and let her hand feed him some treats like she normally does before school.

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Original poster

Charliebradbury · 12/05/2021 06:42

Picture.

OP posts:

somethinginthewater · 12/05/2021 06:44

That's the worst bit of 'training' I've ever heard. Your poor puppy. Please never let this person near her again.
The jumping up is entirely normal and can be solved so easily by your kids turning their back or by separating the puppy behind a stairgate if she's too overexcited.,
Have a look at the puppy resources on the FB group Dog Training Advice and Support.

Motorina · 12/05/2021 06:44

Fire the trainer. Carry on what you’re doing.

ineedaholidaynow · 12/05/2021 06:46

I’m not getting the link between taking the food bowl away and teaching a dog not to jump up.

Temp023 · 12/05/2021 06:48

Dog Trainer strikes me as one of those jobs that a lot of people might think they can do because;there are a lot of new dogs about in the lockdown; they’ve lost their old job and they’ve had a few dogs in their lives who haven’t actually bitten them.
I imagine there are a fair few more out there than there used to be and a lot of them probably have no real experience or clue what they are doing.

ineedaholidaynow · 12/05/2021 06:50

Who recommended the dog trainer? Might be an idea to ask your vet if they know anyone.

Original poster

Charliebradbury · 12/05/2021 06:50

If I want to stop guarding behaviour I'm presuming he should have food in a bowl then? She wants us to use up his food in training, put it in kongs and scatter it for finding games.

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thesunwillout · 12/05/2021 06:50

Diabolical

I'd forget anything they said and rebuild some trust between you all.
Using food like that. To your dog, a stranger came in and began a ridiculous situation.

somethinginthewater · 12/05/2021 06:52

Please ignore everything that 'trainer' said, for everyone's sake. Please.

Original poster

Charliebradbury · 12/05/2021 06:53

We got the card from the vets haha. She has over 10 years experience, I don't know if it was just an error of judgement. The rest of her advice seemed to be good but this bit struck me as a bit off. He was very excited when she gave dd the food as she was new, she had a pouch full of cheese and ham and she had a bag full of toys. So I don't know if he was just too excited to calmly take food off my dd. We don't normally allow them to be together if he is very over excited because he is so young still.

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PacifyLulu · 12/05/2021 06:53

The trainer is awful - there’s a Facebook group called Dog Training Advice and Support. They have loads of practical advice and can guide you towards a suitable trainer.

Crazydoglady1980 · 12/05/2021 06:58

Using Kongs and scatter games are good ways of occupying puppies with their food and working for it but it won’t make any difference to guarding behaviours, if that is what he has.
It sounds like the trainer was winding your puppy up and then using his reactions as a sign of aggression rather than frustration.
It doesn’t sound like your Dog bit your DD, rather she was caught while the dog bowl was being removed. If you want a dog trainer, talk to your vet and ask for a recommendation. The wrong trainer can cause more problems than they solve and as PP have said, anyone can claim to be a trainer. A good trainer will help you reward good behaviour and ignore the negative

ineedaholidaynow · 12/05/2021 07:01

Did the vet actually recommend them or did they just have a card in reception?

Did the dog have a problem with resource guarding before the trainer came on the scene?

Wolfiefan · 12/05/2021 07:02

Dog training advice and support is awesome.
Ignore this trainer.
Puppies often jump up. Look at four on the floor to teach them not to.
Biting clothes? My last one did that. Always have an alternative. Tuggy toy or knotted tea towels. Or I would ask for a different behaviour. A sit. Or a hand follow.
Very very cute puppy BTW!!

Original poster

Charliebradbury · 12/05/2021 07:02

He definitely didn't bite her. She has 3 small scratches on the back of hand no puncture wounds and nothing on her palm etc. He was definitely over excited to begin with although he did calm down as time went on. We try not to do any training when he starts to get too over excited normally.

OP posts:

Original poster

Charliebradbury · 12/05/2021 07:04

He has growled at the cats a couple of times but we take toys away without any issues, we have never actively taken food away but we have sat with him while he eats before and he let's us put our hands on him while he eats.

OP posts:

Clearlyneedwine · 12/05/2021 07:05

I have a collie pup too, and really the jumping up is best resolved by turning your back as others have said. If they nip anyone or go to mouth you giving a “yelp” will cause them to stop (the more high pitch the better - it mimics a fellow pup or mum telling them to stop). Get a trainer if you must, but use someone different - preferably one who knows the breed. I think winding a dog up over food is just plain daft - ensuring they sit and wait for you to release them to get their food if more than sufficient. For this breed (I have several), training them is key - they love rules, and pick them up really quick. It’s really important to start with simple ones such as sit and wait to go out the house for example - as it develop the relationship where they will look to you for instruction. There are some fab sites online for teaching dogs great behaviours through games (absolute dogs is just one) and there are also lots of trick training ideas for this very gorgeous but prone to do their own thing breed! Love them - fantastic dogs, yours is a beaut!

Original poster

Charliebradbury · 12/05/2021 07:08

The thing is he is normally very good with his food so when we get it in his bowl, he goes and sits where we feed him and waits for it. He doesn't jump at us or anything.

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Welshcakes03 · 12/05/2021 07:14

@Charliebradbury

Picture.

Beautiful young pup. I hate when people give the dog food and then take it away... How would you react. The nipping... The dog is a puppy all pups nip especially if excited. My first collie dragged my son down the garden by his trousers I was mortified. Border Collie is working dog they are so clever and easily trainable. Out of interest why did you choose a Border Collie?

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