My dog has bitten DD. Help

[rottielove]

He's never been aggressive to people before, let alone DD. I left them alone for two minute when I went to answer the door, I come back and DD is hysterical as she has been bitten on her arm. I don't think the dog meant it as no skin has been broken and he's a Rottweiler so if he really wanted to hurt her he could have. But like I say he is normally so good with him, I didn't think twice about leaving them for afew seconds. DD is 6, dog is 10., could it be dementia? Not sure where to go from here.

Just for the other side, my family dog bit my brother on the ear insimilar circumstances and drew blood. Never happened again, or anything similar, and dog lived to a ripe old age.
Children need to learn not to leap about on dogs. Don't beat yourself up OP.

@murbblurb

A story or two for *@LadyWhistledownsQuill* who is the usual MN dealer in absolutes, and has poor reading skills. ( Or may be just a nasty piece of work but let's give the benefit of the doubt)

Apart from my partner who has had two attacks from the same out of control dog, for the crime of passing by... I was in a and e one night waiting to be seen. Next to me was a woman yelling down the phone to someone in New Zealand, so it was impossible not to hear. Her husband was being treated for ripped up hands from the family dog who had just gone for him - for the second time. He was looking at months of treatment and she was kicking herself for not having had the dog destroyed the first time.

Hopefully the ops kid won't pay the same penalty. I wish everyone with out of control dogs what they deserve. And the best to all who keep their dogs under control, don't leave them to bark and take the shit home. It is what you signed up for.

You only have the outcome of these dog bites, not the context in which they occurred. Is a dog wrong to bite if it's been abused? Can you blame a dog for biting when it's been sat on an messed with for month after month by an unsupervised young child? (Not suggesting this is the case with the OP). Just because you've overheard a conversation about a dog bite, or experienced one in the family, does not mean you can judge every bite situation the same. I suggest you educate yourself on dog body language and the ladder of aggression- in actual fact aggression is rarely used, and usually after a long period of gradually escalating behaviour which goes unrecognised by the owner. Sudden, out of character aggression is almost always related to an extreme situation or a medical condition.

Definitely agree with the vet. I have the worlds softest cat, you can do anything with him. Stroked his shoulder one day and he threatened to bite me, straight to the vet. Even the vet was struggling to find something but I knew he wasn't right. She picked him up and as she did, a huge hidden abscess exploded and he must have been in agony. She said any other cat would have sunk teeth in at me touching that

@rottielove

My dd was playing on the sofa. Dog was also on sofa but was sleeping. Thanks. I have booked him in to be seen by vet to rule out any medical problem. I am going to get my bf to put the stair gate back up in the kitchen. Will not leave them again. I have had him since a pup.

Good for you OP. Sounds like you're managing this very sensibly.

@TheVolturi

Would be interested to know if the people saying the dog would have hurt the child seriously if it wanted to, have children of their own? If a serious incident happens to the child following this I think you will be held accountable op, after not taking the necessary action to protect your child.

Yes I do have children and OP has taken the necessary steps to protect her child already

Stumbled across this thread and couldn’t read and run. A member of my extended family (can’t say who as would be outing!) is a consultant plastic surgeon. Most of their practice is sadly trying to help children who have been permanently disfigured by dogs. Sadly they know of several children killed by their own pets. The vast majority are family dogs who were “one of the family”, “wouldn’t hurt a fly, “first time he’s ever done something like this” etc - they just snap one day over something you can’t anticipate, or “play” a little too rough, not knowing their own strength. And you can watch them as much as you can, but that’s incredibly stressful and even if you’re in the same room, you may not be quick enough or strong enough to stop it happening. And they’re not all dangerous breeds either.

I’m not saying this to dog bash - I would quite like a dog! But I’m also planning to have a child soon and I’m afraid I couldn’t personally take the risk, knowing what I now know.

It’s a horrible and situation to have to be in though OP, so you have my sympathy.

I can’t believe the number of people who have decided it is the child’s fault.

We had a baby gate at the bottom of the stairs... One evening all 4 ddogs appeared upstairs... I put them back down and reshut the gate.
The press down and pull forward type.. Quite stiff...
Went back up and watched from the top stair our Rotty press with her paw and pull it open. She could open knob door handles and latches.. She was a nightmare.. Sadly missed though.
She once nipped at dd on a walk.

Dd fessed up she had accidentally went over her foot in Heelies.. No mark and justified...

I can’t believe the number of people who have decided it is the child’s fault

I don't think that anyone has suggested that the incident was the child's 'fault'. No one has said that the child did something on purpose. People have suggested that it's possible that something that the child did (like unintentionally hurt or startle the dog) may have been one of the factors that caused the dog to behave in a way that is out of character.

The thread reads very much to me as if everyone has decisively decided the child disturbed the dog.

@bunniesanddaisies

The thread reads very much to me as if everyone has decisively decided the child disturbed the dog.

Because that's very, very likely. It's very unusual for a dog to lash out and bite completely unprovoked.

Leaving a Rottweiler with a child even for a few seconds? What the actual fuck?

She once nipped at dd on a walk. Dd fessed up she had accidentally went over her foot in Heelies.. No mark and justified

If your child accidently runs over an adults foot is it also acceptable for the adult to nip her?

@bunniesanddaisies

The thread reads very much to me as if everyone has decisively decided the child disturbed the dog.

I think people have decided that because if the dog had just taken it upon itself to randomly attack the child then it probably would have done more damage than a bruise . Nobody has suggested that the child has done anything deliberate to upset the dog

I'll never understand why dog haters people who aren't terribly keen on dogs cone to a dog forum..

Why not?

Otherwise you are going to have the suggestions completely skewed by people who like dogs. That is no help. Whatever the question is it really important go get a wide range of people answering to provide a balanced opinion.

If your child accidently runs over an adults foot is it also acceptable for the adult to nip her?

Adults can speak out using their words - the last time I checked, dogs can't speak.

@JellyBabiesFan

I'll never understand why dog haters people who aren't terribly keen on dogs cone to a dog forum..

Why not?

Otherwise you are going to have the suggestions completely skewed by people who like dogs. That is no help. Whatever the question is it really important go get a wide range of people answering to provide a balanced opinion.

What is required on a thread like this is not a like or dislike of dogs, but knowledge of them.

It just so happens that, in all areas of life, those who dislike something rarely go to the trouble of learning much about it.

If I have trouble with my car, I do not approach a mixture of drivers and non-drivers. If I have a health concern, I go to my GP rather than canvassing the opinions of my neighbours.

Uniformed opinions are for topics like what colour you should paint your bathroom, not safety related decisions.

@JellyBabiesFan

She once nipped at dd on a walk. Dd fessed up she had accidentally went over her foot in Heelies.. No mark and justified

If your child accidently runs over an adults foot is it also acceptable for the adult to nip her?

Humans do not naturally use their teeth to express themselves - they use their voice and hands.

An adult who had their foot run over would likely shout, and might even push the child off their foot in the heat of the moment - which are both natural responses to such a situation for our species, just as biting is for dogs.

Dogs also don't have the cognition of an adult - they are equivalent to a 2-3 year old child. If a toddler was hurt by another child and they pushed them off, would you really think it an overreaction?

Now, if the dog decided to repeatedly bite hard, tear or shake, it would be the equivalent of a human repeatedly punching someone in the head for rolling over their foot in a heely. It would be gratuitous violence - but that's not what the PP described.

So the dog is kept away from the child forever. What a life for all.

Whatever the question is it really important go get a wide range of people answering to provide a balanced opinion

That's really not the case.

If I had a health-related query, I'd speak to my GP, not my plumber.
If I was considering moving to France, I'd ask people who'd experienced it themselves, not people who've lived in Australia all their lives.

Like PP said, if you're advising on dog welfare then it's important to know about canine body language and habits. If you hate dogs, why would you know anything about that?

If the vet says there's nothing wrong , ask them if they can refer to a behaviourist who can assess the dog . It might be a random one off because he was startled , or it could be something else.

Your plan in the meantime should keep them both safe, stair gate, his bed in a different place and constant supervision.

We had to put our dog down after many talks with the vet and behaviourist. He was 14, with some health issues (that were being treated and managed) but his real issue was that he hated/was really jealous of DD. He peed on her things, ruined her toys/clothes and nipped her once .They both thought that completely separating them would just make him even more miserable and resentful and rehoming/shelter wouldn't be any good for him either. So that was that.

@turnthebiglightoff

So the dog is kept away from the child forever. What a life for all.

The OP hasn’t said that at all she has said that in future she will make sure the dog is on its bed in the kitchen rather than leave it in the room alone with her child .

@murbblurb

You know what you have to do. And I'd say that if it was a Jack Russel, although that would probably be too small to kill a six year old.

Don't be ridiculous. You don't have a dog PTS for this. He hasn't even really bitten her. If a Rottie meant any harm to her, there would have been blood gushing, not 'no teeth marks'.

@Lowkeyloopy

Stumbled across this thread and couldn’t read and run. A member of my extended family (can’t say who as would be outing!) is a consultant plastic surgeon. Most of their practice is sadly trying to help children who have been permanently disfigured by dogs. Sadly they know of several children killed by their own pets. The vast majority are family dogs who were “one of the family”, “wouldn’t hurt a fly, “first time he’s ever done something like this” etc - they just snap one day over something you can’t anticipate, or “play” a little too rough, not knowing their own strength. And you can watch them as much as you can, but that’s incredibly stressful and even if you’re in the same room, you may not be quick enough or strong enough to stop it happening. And they’re not all dangerous breeds either.

I’m not saying this to dog bash - I would quite like a dog! But I’m also planning to have a child soon and I’m afraid I couldn’t personally take the risk, knowing what I now know.

It’s a horrible and situation to have to be in though OP, so you have my sympathy.

It would be fascinating if there was an academic study done by dog behaviourists as to the circumstances of those bites.

Perhaps pick a sample of 100 bites requiring hospital attendance, interview the owners of the dogs and assess the dogs behaviour professionally.

I'd be fascinated to see the break down of

• dogs that had serious behavioural problems that cause unprovoked aggression and realistically need to be put down
• dogs that have behaviour issues that could be managed by a savvy owner, but perhaps only in a home without young children (eg resource guarding) and so may need rehoming.
• dogs where they're mostly nice but there's been inadequate supervision, the children have been allowed to harass the dog, and the dog has been trying to get the children to leave it alone (walking away, nose licks, up to growling) and has eventually had enough and bitten. I'm thinking of those social media pictures where there's a toddler climbing over a dog who really shouldn't have to put up with such nonsense.
• sudden reactions to unexpected situations - for instance, a visiting child deliberately kicks the dog and the dog bites.

... and other nuances.

Sadly I think a lot of these scenarios have, at their root, an owner who doesn't understand dogs, their behaviour and body language - and someone who just doesn't know how much they don't know.

Dog licencing is one of those things that could be done badly (eg if it's just a case of paying a fee once a year) or well. If everyone was required to take a theory course on behaviour and body language prior to getting a dog, and practical training classes after getting a dog, I'm certain we'd see a reduction in these incidents.

@turnthebiglightoff

So the dog is kept away from the child forever. What a life for all.

Who's said that? You keep them separate unless they can be supervised - that's pretty normal when you have children and dogs in the same home.