Removing male dog (father) from house when bitch is giving birth and after?

[theemmadilemma]

I'm hoping someone with experience might be able to help, as at this point I'm confused by conflicting advice.

I'll give as much detail as I can that might be relevant.

Our male is newly seeing a behaviorist, mainly for attention barking, but also for lead pulling and some dislike of strangers/strange dogs. When she introduced herself to our dogs she did so in a way which I understand her reasoning behind (heavy rain/safety) but it meant she entered our home while we were inside with the dogs on leads. They're of a very protective breed and it set off chaos. In the chaos at one point my female directed slightly against the male dog.

The dogs are well bonded, often sleep close, rough house but never push too far.

Our house is very small and annoying open plan downstairs. It would be difficult to have the puppies and her upstairs in our spare room due to the noise and thin walls to next door (see attention barking issues). We could put a wide child gate between front room and lounge and remove some furniture for extra space, but no door.

The behaviorist has old us we must remove the male for 4 weeks. That having him there would make her stressed and anxious, they he may aggravate her and we will likely end up with dead puppies by stress or either dog. Obviously we sprang in to action.

So I called the kennels she recommended. After speaking with the Owner at length, the Kennel owner told me the opposite. That taking the male away was likely to cause more issues, as he'd be returning to a house with puppies that he's had no awareness of.

I'm worried he'll just jump the gate, be wanting in there all the time anyway.

We are seeking our vets advice also and am waiting on a call tomorrow, but I would so appreciate any experience from owners or breeders or anyone!

Because I hate people who don't update:

9 puppies were born last night, all in good healthy. Mother is doing very well and did a fabulous job. We're so proud of her.

Father was and is still in the house. He was amazing with the mother all through her labor until she took herself away to the whelping box to give birth at which point we closed the gate to seperate. He was so calm and cool all day.

Mother has been down for toilet and a breath of fresh air and they were happy to see each other.

He can clearly hear the babies, but we're following guidelines re introducing him so plan to wait a month.

Massive thank you to those who gave genuine advice.

And 1000% never again, impossible now for us with these two. But it was a wonderful experience and I'm proud of both of our dogs.

I'm glad it has gone well, and I hope that continues.

All the best with finding suitable homes for the puppies.

@theemmadilemma thanks for updating us. I'm glad mum and puppies are doing well . 9 babies, youll be pulling your hair out in a few months . I wish you all the best and enjoy

I wonder how you can find 9 homes for such dogs, especially in these times when they can't be socialised properly?

And the puppies?
No one can visit.
They can’t be socialised.
They come from unhealthtested parents of dubious temperament.
And you’re proud? Jeez.

No one can visit.
They can’t be socialised.
Be fair, Wolfie. NOBODY could have foreseen the shit-show that is present-day life way back in the middle of January when this litter was conceived - I certainly didn't spot it coming.

No, it's true, this litter wasn't ideal, and OP does recognise that, but having a go for something entirely outside her control doesn't help anyone.

It wasn’t outside her control.
Keep an entire male and an in season bitch apart.
Terminate ASAP.
Don’t coo over being proud of the dogs FFS.

Me and all the other people who couldn't possibly have foreseen this at the point pregnancy occurred.

And I've seen people who already have puppies on here concerned. Are they all arseholes for buying a puppy and not foreseeing this?

You can point at my accident/irresponsibility all you want, for which I take responsibility. But you can't fucking wave that stick at me.

@theemmadilemma if you’re on FB have a look for the group ‘Positive Reinforcement Breeder Support’, recently someone posted a link in there to a group set up specifically for breeders raising litters during the pandemic/lockdown. I’d highly recommend trying to find it and joining, there’s a lot of very experienced people coming together to try and give puppies the best possible start despite the current conditions.

Apologies for the lack of a specific link but I can’t find it for you right now, I’ll try and get it for you a bit later though.

@theemmadilemma I've found that link for you; the FB group is Pandemic Puppy Raising Support Group.

@suttercane That's really useful, thank you. I'm in contact with others in the same boat via the breed page, but the more resources the better!

OP controls the pandemic? Wow.

Wolfie there are two issues here:

1. The conception and birth of this litter. A mistake for which OP has consistently accepted responsibility.
2. The pandemic, which going fuck with the socialisation of many, many puppies. That is not OP's fault. Unless of course OP is in fact hunkered down like a Bond villain, controlling it all from her garden shed.

OP I am glad that the pups have been born safely and that all are doing well. You will need to work hard to socialise them as best you can at home but hopefully in a month or so things might look very different with regard to the virus.
Good look and keep asking questions.

OP be aware that's vets will not vaccinate/chip puppies at present and KC are advising not rehoming.

Breeding from a male with behavioural issues is totally irresponsible. Keeping two entire dogs in the se house and expecting them not to breed is idiotic.

Try and redeem yourself and salvage these puppies lives by at least socialising them thoroughly - they'll need it considering their genetic legacy
www.pdsa.org.uk/what-we-do/blog/vet-qa-how-can-i-socialise-my-puppy-during-the-lockdown

One final update.

The puppies were all socialised using The Puppy Plan. We were able to have them microchipped and vaccinated with no issues.

All puppies are now safely in their very loving new homes, doing well with cats and other dogs and settling in nicely from the numerous lovely updates we are getting from all the owners (who are also sharing with each other and hope to do get togethers when possible.)

An amazing experience and one through which I've learned more and bonded even more with my dogs.

Ah lovely to hear. Thanks for the update.

But I expect the usual suspects will be back to give you another pasting soon..

You really got your arse handed to you by the usual suspects here OP. So unnecessary.

I'm glad everything has gone well and the puppies all found good homes

That's good news, a happy ending!

That's good news, a happy ending!

Dogs live for quite a long time. Depending on breed they could live 10-15 years, or longer. It’s far from the end.

I'm glad to hear you've found good homes for them, OP. Thanks for coming back to update us. I hope everything continues to go well.