Help with naughty dogs!

[Ribbon14]

Hi all,

I have 2 male pugs, one has just turned one and the other is nearly 4 months. We also have 3 cats (yes we are mad!).
I do love the dogs but they are driving me mental at the moment. I work from home so am here with them all day while my husband is at work. Basically they are both completely obsessed with food (especially the older one) and will stop at nothing to get it. They also eat everything on the floor... All sorts of random crap they shouldn't have and then I get the blame. The older one barks like a lunatic any time anyone knocks the door, they bite the skirting boards and doors, bark and chase the cats, eat the cats' food despite the fact its in a separate room with a cat flap (older one can headbutt door open!)

I've tried my best to train them but it just isn't working and my husband is in denial saying they behave for him so putting the blame on me. My whole day revolves around managing them. Has anyone got any suggestions?

You're not exercising them enough, especially the older one. An adult dog needs a good hour once or twice a day - I'm afraid 20/30 minutes just isn't enough, even for a pug. They need exercise - it's more than physical, they need to get out and sniff and explore and meet other dogs and people.

Why did you get a second puppy when you already had an older untrained dog?

Are they 'steamed' OP? By this I mean are they getting loads of carbs in their diet? I feed my dogs almost no carbs as it makes such a difference to their day.

Dogs will naturally eat everything they can get and look for more. It's in their nature. They sound steamed and bored to me.

Also with your students can you schedule a 15 minute gap in between to play with them.

As for the walks the younger one won’t need much yet so work on training the older one to walk nicely. Don’t worry about the sniffing DH likes to get billypup on the common to chase balls and she gets tired quite quickly but she stays calm and tired for a lot longer when she’s had a slower less frantic walk where she can sniff and enjoy.

Do you need advice on training to walk nicely?

Puppy training for them both.
Consistency
Puppy proofing - they shouldn’t eat everything because you need to make it so they can’t get it. Toddler type cupboard locks maybe. ?

@HairyString not sure. They both have royal canin biscuits. They get some other treats during the day and maybe some apple but not much else.
@billybagpuss can't easily schedule breaks in between as very busy so often teach 4 back to back in evenings and if I had a break in between each one that's going to make me finish very late. Yes probably need help on walking nicely but don't Realy know where to go. All individual training is really expensive.
@adaline if I try to walk my pug for more than half an hour he will sit down and refuse to walk. We got a second puppy as thought it would be a playmate for older one.
@RatherBeRiding how to we retrain them with crate though? I don't know how to get them to like it. Yes think we need to find a walker

@Helenluvsrobthey eat door frames etc though and it's impossible to physically remove everything from them unless we literally live in a house with nothing in it

If that's the case then you maybe need to take him out 3-4 times a day instead of just once or twice.

They sound exceptionally bored and fed up - plus it sounds as though you haven't puppy proofed your house if they're able to steal food and chew everything.

For the eating of doorframes etc, buy them a few really good chew toys such as deer antlers and buffalo horns. Dogs enjoy chewing - it's the equivalent of human thumb sucking. It self soothes, so not only is it good for the dogs' mental health, it saves your skirting boards.

Mine has never chewed inappropriately apart from a couple of cushions when he was a young pup.

Ok, so they need a nice long walk in the morning to get rid of the pent up energy. Then settle into the kitchen with a treat or chew.
Kongs or lickimats are great, smear them with peanut butter, wet dog food, broth, gravy, cheese etc and freeze overnight to make them last longer.

Another midday walk or active play in the garden.

If they are food orientated then use this to your advantage. Spread out their meals throughout the day using different puzzle feeders. Try to give them at least half their meal not in a normal bowl. Even a 'slow feeder' bowl will draw out meal times and get them to use their heads.

I highly recommend joining the facebook group 'canine enrichment' to see different ways to mentally stimulate your dogs.

To help with the crate - start feeding them in the crates, but leave the door open so they can choose to go in/out. The food and choice should start to build up a positive association.

@Ribbon14 I don’t suppose your in the sw are you, pm me if you like I can recommend some ad hoc courses that if you continue practicing at home, work out very cost effective.

In the meantime some basic training classes will really help, much of it is about training the owners as much as the dog.

Don’t think of it as walking the dog, in the early stages it’s more about play, if they’ve had enough after half an hour just do 20 minutes but make it super interesting. Play training games give them your full focus.

Honestly your DP needs to be told that he HAS to step up and do a lot more of the required work with the puppies or you want them rehomed.

You are unwell, unsure about getting them, work from home and yet it seems to fall to you to sort it out and do all the work.

He is clearly too lazy to own puppies and has dumped all the work on you!

He can take them both out before and after work, he can sort out kongs for them, he can take them to training classes

That still leaves you with an awful lot of work to do to retrain them during the the day plus a daytime walk.

Agree with everyone regarding the fact that your DFP has got these dogs and is abdicating responsibility onto you OP.

Try them on a meat based diet for a month or so. I give my dog Lidl tinned meat only. It has veggies in it and other than that he gets a bit of what we have but hardly any carbs. If I give him dry food or carby food he is a PITA. On the tinned only he is less energetic and more able to concentrate and altogether happier.

@RandomMess thanks I'm glad someone else agrees. My dh literally gets out of bed at 7.45 feeds them and then gets dressed and has his breakfast and leaves for work (15 mins away). I doubt very much he would be bothered to walk them in the morning. He does usually walk them in the evening. But he just doesn't think they need training when I say they are difficult he just says 'they're fine with me' implying it's all my fault

@HairyString thanks for the suggestion re food. I will try that!

www.paws.org/resources/how-to-crate-train-your-dog/

Here's a link to a useful article about crate training. As your dogs now associate the crate with punishment then it will really be completely back to the beginning and will need a lot of patience to overcome the negative associations they must now have with the crates.

It is probably fortunate that they are both so food orientated though!

And it IS possible overcome negative association. My rescue dog was absolutely terrified of getting into a car (the journey home from the kennels was a nightmare!). However, she is extremely greedy and as I had some time at home over Christmas I was able to get her to voluntarily climb into the car in search of treats in just 3 sessions. We have yet to move on to actually going anywhere in the car, but that is a massive step forward for a dog that wouldn't actually go near an open car door!

Patience, perseverance and lots of their favourite treats will overcome the crate issue I'm sure.

@billybagpuss sadly not I'm in London. Yes I definitely think I need training haha

Of course they are fine with him because he can give them undivided attention because he isn't trying to work at the same time.

Are you prepared to give him an ultimatum?

He was supposed to take the older one to classes but "couldn't find the time" what sort of excuse is that???

You really need to take note of all the good advice. Your dogs are telling you that they are unhappy. It is up to you as their owners to work out how to deal with that and then put a plan into place. Get the youngest one into training classes, even if they are telling you that the oldest is too old. The classes will teach you and your partner how to teach basic commands and obedience, they'll give you a foundation to build from. Dog training doesn't happen over 6 weeks at puppy classes though. It's a lifelong commitment.

In the short term, get a dog pen. Much bigger than a crate but you will be able to use it for both of them together and put some toys and things like kongs and snuffle mats in there for the periods when you can't be with them. Not to be used for punishment or to keep them in for hours at a time, but just whilst you put the work on training them not to chew inappropriately and to keep them safe.

Ultimately though, puppies need your time, energy and patience. Leaving them for hours on end whilst you work is not fair on them, or you. If you can't offer what they need then maybe you need to consider rehoming.

@adaline I will try doing more walks but it's hard as I'm ill and feel like my life is taken over completely by the dogs and I'm stressed out.
I'm not sure how to puppy proof the house. Like is said I can't move everything. Older one cna jump everywhere

Unfortunately dogs, especially young dogs, need a lot of work. Mine was a constant commitment when he was young - there's no way I'd have gotten another when he was so young.

Do you really have the time to commit to these dogs?

I don't wish to sound harsh but the dogs need more exercise, regardless of whether or not you feel you can do it. It means nothing to them that you are ill and stressed out, and unfortunately being ill and stressed out doesn't negate their need for more exercise.

If you can't, then you really MUST find a decent, experienced dog walker

Op. It sounds like you have enough on your plate, I can't imagine how you feel taking on a 4 month old puppy also. Do you think that maybe rehoming the younger pup might be the best thing? If you could find a great home where he will get tons of love and attention and then you can concentrated on training and taking on the responsibilities of the older dog?
I don't mean this as an insult, I am just thinking of you, this sounds like a lot as you also have a chronic illness too? X I have a 6 month old puppy and he is such hard work - I can't imagine having 2 with the pressures that you have.

Set an alarm for 7. Kick your DH out of bed and make him interact with the dogs.
A short walk, the young one could spend half of it in a dog carrier.
Interesting breakfast, can you get it to last 15 mins.
A kong and lidl toy in action

Take your younger one and use the techniques on the older one. I think it will really help with socialising and moving your relationship to one of positive reinforcement and not frustrated reactivity.

The key is high value treats - cheese! - and most dogs will be trainable. It’s also a good mental workout for them

Thanks rehoming isn't an option as we love them despite how hard they are. I try my best. Usually they are only on their own in kitchen with their toys and bed etc for max 2hrs before my husband gets home and there isn't a lot I can do about that. I will look into training classes