Giving up 12 week old puppy

[Ridusofyourstupidity]

Please please be kind.

I’ve been quite honest on here about losing my last puppy suddenly to anaphylactic shock and getting our new puppy a few weeks later. Now I’m not sure I can keep her due to her behaviour. It goes beyond anything I’ve experienced. She is 12 weeks old, weighs over 14kg and can reach chest height when she jumps against me.

She is repeatedly attacking me on a near constant basis with seemingly no reason. She will be chewing on a toy, lying down and get up to lunge and jump at me and bite my stomach, legs and arms while growling if I’m standing in the room even if I haven’t moved to draw attention to myself. If I ask for a sit or similar to distract her she’ll snap at me and ignore the request, although she does know ‘Sit’, ‘Down’, ‘Touch’ and will give both paws. When I have to carry her in from the garden she’ll growl and snap at my face. She is a large breed who isn’t meant to do stairs so this is unavoidable.

I can’t enter the room without her attacking me, she’ll bite the backs of my legs or jump up at my side to bite my arm. She’ll try and mount my leg while biting me if I’m still Leaving the room does nothing, she’ll try and block me leaving and she’ll continue when I return, even if calm. Toys do nothing as she will ignore them to jump and continue biting higher. Or she’ll pull my clothing like a tug toy while growling. I’ve tried every kind of toy but she let them go, snarl and dart under them to get back to biting me.

It is either very rough play or something more but it’s unmanageable. I’m now having to leave her alone in the kitchen as I can’t be in there with her, even when calm she will without warning launch at me. I keep trying to go in but it soon becomes too much as she doesn’t stop trying to get to me to bite. 15 mins is the most I’ve lasted with her ignoring toys and being latched on to me.

She’s incredibly difficult to walk even with no distractions as she’ll still attack me and bite me while we’re walking. She refuses all treats on a walk (I’ve tried several) and will pull, be incredibly hyper, running from left to right, and lunge and bite when I stay still.

I’ve done everything we covered in the puppy classes with my last puppy with her from the day we brought her home and none of this has made any difference. She has a marker word and all other commands are the same as before so everyone is on the same page. I’m not sure I’m going to make it through until Friday when I have a private training session booked. I’m utterly miserable and defeated.

Sadly my partner has made the decision that he no longer wants us to keep her, regardless of the behaviourist being involved. He feels that returning her to the breeder would be best for her. He’s going to message them today.

I won’t come back to this thread, I feel too awful, and I’ll never have another dog again.

Ridus you have to do what is best for you and the pup.
Don't blame yourselves though - you have given it your absolute best it seems but she is just not right for you.

Don't make any rash decisions about your future, it sounds like you're both very experienced dog people with a lot to offer - but nobody can get it right every time.

Don’t feel too bad, if you have to return her, it’s not a reflection on your dog owning abilities, and it’s nothing to be ashamed of. Having experience of similar, large breeds, I can understand why you assumed this mix would be manageable for you both. I am an experienced dog owner, the child of a game keeper (dad) and a breeder of a rare large breed (mum), and I was raised around many dogs of all shapes and sizes, but I wouldn’t have been able to take on the challenge you currently find yourself in. The trouble with crosses is, you never know what you’re getting. If you end up getting the least desirable traits from both breeds & those breeds are both big, powerful dogs, it’s going to be entirely different to raising say a mastiff with the less than desirable mastiff breeds.

This doesn’t mean you’re incapable of owning (and raising well!) a dog, even a large breed. It just means this particular dog was too much - and that’s really, really ok! You’re putting the dog’s welfare above your own feelings, because you care. It would have been too much for many, even very experienced owners.

Take time, cry and heal, then reassess. I understand that it feels like the end of the world and it must have been very difficult to read some comments, but you never know how you’ll feel a few years (or even months) down the line.

Good luck, sending virtual support for the task ahead.

This is very sad

You have so much to offer a dog, so much.

Please don't hurt yourself further by shutting the door on any future doggie relationships!

You've had two awful experiences.

I am not going to ask anything of you to report back on here on your thread, but do start talking to other breeders and seeing other litters. It will heal you.

You have done your utmost for this huge and challenging puppy.

I am guessing he must have assessed the pups behaviour as unresolvable. This is for the brewder to manage. These are her speciality and the surroundings will be familiar to your puppy, not like a rehoming.

Please don't give up.

Honestly OP. Its a dog, you havent had it long and its attacking you. If this was a foster child youd assume it wasnt going to work. Noone deserves to be attacked in their own home, and this is well beyond the realms of normal. This puppy needs to go back. You cannot have a large breed dog with this level of aggression. It would be worse to rehome later. The dog doesnt want to be around you and is emotionally damaged. Dont put yourself through this. If he attacked a child he would be put to sleep

You're making the right decision. Badly bred dogs can have really poor/unstable temperaments and this dog doesn't sound right at all. If you do go for another dog go for a breeder who is kennel club assured and knows their line inside and out. Temperament is so important in a big powerful breed. A mix is always more of an unknown.

Oh OP.
To be honest your pup would have been too much for me, and I have lived with dogs of all shapes and sizes for most of my life, including bringing up puppies.

Not every breed or type is a good match for everyone. Don't give up on dog ownership: you are clearly a caring owner who would be fab with the right dog.

My first dog was very problematic and I felt awful for ages as I kept reading things like 'no bad dogs only bad owners'. Having had several dogs since I now am fully confident the dog was born problematic, and that was not my fault.
I will fully admit, had I been a bit more experienced (and not also been distracted by work and childcare) I probably would have handled the situation better and she MAY have turned into a sane dog, but am not convinced.

Oh and she wasn't a cross/mongrel either.
So now am quite confident there are a number of bad dogs around and one has to be an exceptionally good owner to cope with them and it is probably not in anyone's best interest to keep them on, but of course we do because we love them and hope they improve! And usually they also have some good points ( I know mine did), so it's all very difficult. You do have my sympathy, OP.

The mantra of 'no bad dogs only bad owners' is inaccurate and damaging. Yes, much of what goes wrong with dogs is due to varying degrees of neglect, ignorance and poor/no training, but dogs have different temperaments just like other animals do. Good breeders will breed dogs with solid temperaments, but even then things can go wrong. Some dogs are just harder work than others.

Sorry to flounce off and then come back anyway.

I’ve spoken to the breeder, and she’s agreed to take her back, although she’s quite funny about it and seems to be implying I’ve done something wrong. I’m worried she’s going to try and sell her again straight away although I’ve been honest about why she’s coming back. She seems to be taking it quite personally that I’m returning her. It’s made a horrible situation even harder.

One of the things that I noticed was the carrying problem because of the stairs(3 floors)and the jumping up problem. Small breeds have issues of their own, but companion dogs are called that for good reason, they tend to be active but more malleable, and ideally suited to someone at home a lot. We have a poodle of 11 months and he has exhibited many of the stages you are describing, mad biting at 12 weeks, needing to be distracted out into the garden, stubborness, hates being picked up,launching himself at you when he wants attention, getting overtired and needing to be encouraged to calm down. But because he is only 22inches high it doesn't feel frightening to deal with him in this state and we have gone through the stages, living and learning! And he really is a companion dog, he wants to curl up next to a human on the sofa whenever he can.

Please don't lose heart OP. Maybe a different breed would be the answer, or an older dog. I once looked after a young Springer who was full of crazy energy but so placid and docile compared to a poodle in many ways, so different dogs just do have different traits in the house and for family life.

You didn’t flounce. You were understandably upset. I do hope the breeder is reputable and knowledgeable to start to put the problem right and find the specific home that would suit this pup. You’ve done nothing wrong.

How well do you know this breeder?

Of course she is going to just sell her on straight away what do you seriously expect her to do , she doesn’t want the pups she wanted the money .

the breeder can go fuck herself. Shes not the one being aggressed and attacked constantly. I put money on the dog having been returned once already for similar. I dont think you should say no more dogs necessarily. Its not your fault

In all honesty I couldn’t go through all this again. I think I just need to accept that when I lost my boy puppy there was no coming back from that and another dog wouldn’t be right for me. He was it. All this pup’s siblings are fine apparently, so it’s just really bad luck and I just couldn’t take another loss.

Nettleskeins with respect, what you’re describing from your puppy is normal. It’s not normal to have them be chewing a toy and occupied and with no warning full on curl their lip, snarl and jump from across the room to bite your stomach while you’re making toast and not looking at them.

I picked her up at 8 weeks and met her at 6 weeks, there haven’t been other homes. Just us.

Who says the pup’s siblings are fine. The breeder?

I did say apparently they are.

I don't think you particularly flounced either.

Our breed do the same. They are known for being very very bitey and snappy.and launching themselves, grabbing clothes,snapping, and watxhing a litter together youd thinknthey were killing each othrry. Their teeth are sharp, they growl (and scream on the receiving end!). I've seen older pups terrorise dc by leaping on them and attacking their hair pulling and leaping and overpowering (one that came to me for help and dc came to play with my dc).

They are wonderful kind, patient, and emminently trainable clever dogs that are utter arseholes as puppies. I wouldn't take on that nature in a bigger form. They behave like wild crazed things!

I know the breed and its fine, but others don't and have ended up in hospital, literally shredded.

I am not outting which breed, but they do take some handling, but are nevertheless magnificent devoted, kind and intelligent creatures. One works as an assistance dog.

Your breeder will need to take responsibility for checking the behaviour of your pup in relation to the breed X norms and acting appropriately.

I would imagine they are indeed upset and disappointed for all concerned thats its not worked out. If their hearts in the right place, it would cause concern indeed.

Maybe they would be able to keep communicating with you about the outcome for this pup? If thats something you wanted I mean. It may be helpful for you?

Mine did just that, especially when there was toast involved. Except he could only reach my knee cap or ankle..I still have a bruise on my thigh where he nips me when he wants to go out in the garden and I'm not on cue! But he is a poodle not a guard dog, he is a highly intelligent wired dog but not a dog that protects sheep from predators on mountainsides. He is a retriever of sorts, a task orientated fast track foreign office diplomat or when he is in terrier mode he is a ratter. He has the traits of his breed mix (poodle/bichon)

Not a lot else to add OP other than you have made the right decision and I would do the same thing. None of this is your fault and I really feel for you. Sending you a big hug, I can't imagine what you have been through loosing your last pup and then this. X I hope you realise that this is not a reflection on you at all x

Go fuck yourself. Hope that helps you.

I was finding this thread interesting and was sitting on the fence a bit until you were so rude to someone who was giving an honest opinion.

So I'll say my bit. If that dog bites someone else in the way that it bites you, you will really be for the high jump.

I see you've just agreed to return it to the breeder. Which is just as well.

I have two mastiffs, you need help urgently and 1-2-1 training is the best thing for you.

She will be picking up on your fear whether you say you are or not, you'll be giving out a scent, you'll be anxious of the next attack and she'll sense this, but as a pup she won't realise you're fearing her and not something else, so she's on guard and lashing at the wrong thing if that makes sense

Are you on your own with her when this happens ?

Mastiffs are protective and have guarding tendencies and perhaps it's this she is homing in on

I don't know any thing about st bernards and their temperaments

My 6 month old mastiff is now 40kg and still growing - id advise looking at a private training now before she gets too much heavier for you to handle