Buying a choc lab but is this legit?

[BrexitBingoGenerator]

Hello everyone,

Firstly, thank you all so much for your earlier advice about cockers. Over the weekend, my husbands colleague found out about our search for a dog and has invited us round to see his litter of choc labs. They obviously look ridiculously cute, I mean - ‘stuff them all in the car and steal them all’ cute.

However, from doing so much reading on here, it seems like there may be some red flags to look out for. I don’t want to risk buying a dog who may suffer health problems or play a part in subjecting the mum dog to harm somehow. Essentially, I’m looking for advice about how not to buy a dog from a dodgy backyard breeder.

Dh says his colleague is lovely and they have been v honest and upfront so far, but then- if the dogs are worth £1000, they would be- wouldn’t they?

Any help or advice is much appreciated!

Thank you all

@Gummybear11 I'm sure there are - but lots of rescues still won't rehome to people with young children, or who work full-time A no matter what plans they may have in place to make sure the puppy is looked after.

DH and I were rejected by all the rescues within a 90 minute drive from here - we don't have children but we do have cats and a small garden and we both work.

None of them seemed to think it was relevant that the dog would never be left alone, that we lived in the Lake District with miles of open land for him/her to play in and that our house was set up so the dogs and cats could be kept separate if necessary.

We went to a breeder and I don't regret our choice one bit. Promoting rescues is fine and I think rescuing a dog is a wonderful thing to do but pushing it as the be all and end all of dog ownership doesn't help your agenda really, it just gets people's backs up.

I agree with @BiteyShark too that it's irresponsible owners that are the problem.

Of course rescues need to exist to help dogs, but too many people get a cute puppy on a whim and then struggle when it reaches adolescence and give up.

Adolescence in dogs who you've known since they were small is hard enough - I certainly wouldn't want to deal with an adolescent dog from an unknown background who possibly had little or no training whatsoever. I'm not experienced enough for that.

I would definitely want all the health checks too-we have a red fox lab and despite both her parents having had all the tests coming out well, she has eyesight issues and a very dodgy shoulder and limps so we can no longer take her for long walks bless her-she is only just 8 now and has been suffering for around a year. She’s happy though and well loved and perfect with the children. My brother has a chocolate lab-she’s been a nightmare to train!

I'd be happy to pay a couple of hundred quid for a "casually" bred family pet.
For a grand I'd want papers and health checks and everything done by the book.
Colleague can't have it both ways - he's just seeing these puppies as easy money.

Walk away. Seriously. He’s out to make as much money as he can without having laid the appropriate groundwork.

If you are looking for a family pet puppy, there are plenty in rescues. If you feel you must buy one, then you need to research the breeder properly first.

We did not find there were plenty of dogs in rescues. There are three rescues near us and there were all full of out of control bull terrier types and huskies. (Not saying those breeds are out of control, the ones in the rescue were.) Not suitable for a family home.

@adaline many people turn to the foreign rescues because of this problem with uk rescues. I have two young children and our dogs are rescues from Cyprus who were 'street dogs'. I had a home check but they had no problems with me having young kids. The dogs are amazing with all children and people.

Also rescues are often mongrels which are much less likely to have the hereditary problems so many pedigrees have.

Many tears animal rescue has loads of puppies periodically and the smaller fluffier dog. Lots of their dogs are ex breeders and need to be rehomed with other dogs but they do a good job of matching people and dogs, even to people in flats with no gardens! They have around 300 dogs some in wales but lots in foster around the country, maybe not your answer op but I always like to tell doggy folk they are there!

I understand advocating rescues gets peoples (who have purchased puppies from breeders) backs up. That's a given. I still don't understand how so many will go out and buy a puppy with little thought to the fact that these breeders are producing and profiting from pumping additional dogs into the world when there are so many already who are homeless and being put to sleep.

I am a dog sitter/walker and IME puppies are so much harder than any adult rescue dog I've cared for.

But the puppy stage is temporary - lots of behavioural issues in adults cannot be overcome without a lot money and time, and not everyone has those resources available.

Reactive dogs, for example, can be exhausting to live with and require a lifetime of work to make sure you keep your dog (and others) safe.

I still don't understand how so many will go out and buy a puppy with little thought to the fact that these breeders are producing and profiting from pumping additional dogs into the world when there are so many already who are homeless and being put to sleep.

In my experience some rescues contribute to this problem, though. Too many have extremely strict criteria and stop the dogs getting rehomed to perfectly good homes.

A small garden or working adults shouldn't be reasons to be turned down for rehoming - doggy daycare exists, shift workers exist, and lots of people have family etc. who can be with the dogs.

@adaline I absolutely agree with you, some UK rescues are infuriating and this is why we went to foreign rescue.

I couldn't agree more with @adaline, many rescues here are far too restrictive. I always do a homecheck of course but always look at the people rather than taking a tick box approach. I've seen homes rejected for very spurious reasons and it's easy as a homechecker to develop various prejudices and expect perfection all the time.

I knew of someone rejected because she was considered too old but she lived with her supportive doggy family .... crazy.

Quite agree @Gummybear11. Foreign rescues are bursting with puppies, pedigrees, such a wide variety. I saved a starving sweet cotton de Tulear from the streets and he's as good as gold.

At our rescue we allow people to foster before they proceed with adoption which gives everyone peace of mind.

It's worth remembering that all the breeds have their own breed rescues, usually very well run. Quite a few cockapoo rescues, unsurprisingly, given how fashionable they are at the moment.

A friend has one (from a breeder) and he growls at strangers, doesn't like other dogs and suffers from terrible separation anxiety so you can have problems even when buying from a well researched breeder.

I realise you can see the background on pedigree dogs online and in the paperwork that you are given

BUT how do you know the dog you are looking at is that particular mum or that the sire is the one you are told about?

I mean how do you know that the sire wasn't just a dog that belonged to his mate from the pub?

BUT how do you know the dog you are looking at is that particular mum or that the sire is the one you are told about?

Because ideally you know the breeder before the bitch is even pregnant. Good breeders have waiting lists before they even have a litter available. They allow you to come to their home and meet the bitch - you can often arrange to meet the sire too. You're involved in the pregnancy and the birth - you see the bitch with the pups from when they're very young - ideally 2-3 times before you bring your chosen pup home.

You get to know your breeder, the dogs and the pups before one becomes part of your family.

Health test ( hips and eyes especially) should be done on potential parents beforehand so you can predict likely Health of puppies. I would never buy a puppy without these tests being available for me to see

KC recommend these tests:
What Screening is relevant for the Retriever (Labrador)?
Kennel Club Assured Breeders must use the following screening schemes for sires and dams BVA/KC
• BVA/KC Hip Dysplasia Scheme • Eye testing
Kennel Club Assured Breeders are strongly recommended to use the following screening schemes and/or advice for sires and dams
• BVA/KC Elbow Dysplasia Scheme • DNA test - prcd-PRA
The list above is not necessarily comprehensive. Breed clubs and experienced breeders are useful sources of information on health issues in the breed. All breeds have a Breed Health Coordinator.

Sorry I didn't put that very well

I meant how do you know the dogs on the pedigree information are the same ones as the bitch you are looking at

Even more so with the sire cos you only have his word for it that he is the father

I realise with official breeders who take it seriously their reputation is connected to the puppies but a bloke from DH workplace who hasn't even got the tests done

How do you know the pedigrees belong to the parents of the puppies?

Rather than him just going online and choosing dogs that look like his one and saying they have really long pedigrees

Do the pedigrees have microchip numbers connected to the data?

Do the pedigrees have microchip numbers connected to the data?

Yes, all the paperwork should link up if it's being done correctly.

I mean how do you know that the sire wasn't just a dog that belonged to his mate from the pub?
Because if the puppies are registered with the KC, the owner of the putative sire will notice if his dog is down as fathering a litter he or she knew nothing about.

If you want to be sure about the dam, ask to see her KC registration certificate (you might even be able to see the sire's, too). My dog's gives her DOB, breed and colour as well as her ancestry. No chip number though.

If that isn't enough for you, then do as Adaline suggests and get to know a breeder long before a litter is even planned.

Oke doke thanks for clarification

We are not on the look out for a puppy btw just wondered for the op

My dog’s KC reg document has microchip number on it. Due to change in law that all pups need to be microchipped by (I think it’s) 8 weeks?

I so wouldn't pay £1000 for a pup whose owner couldn't be bothered to get the mother health checked. You are being drawn in by the convenience of it OP!