Pigletdog is expecting! Any advice?

[Pigletpoglet]

Disclaimer: very careful planned and considered litter, all health and genetic testing done, carefully selected dog, lots of advice from our breeder, etc etc

Pigletdog was scanned yesterday, and it looks like we are expecting a litter of 6-8 puppies on 20th March. It's our first litter, and we are a little terrified! Please could we have any top tips for whelping and puppy care?

I don't think licensing is as simple as 'if they want to inspect, we have nothing to hide', unfortunately!

Am not trying to put the fear of God in you, but some councils are telling hobbyist breeders that they don't need a licence, others are putting in place measures that it is quite difficult for a typical domestic home to meet. There is no saying which yours is until you check, the whole thing is a bit mad at the moment!

You are obviously just the kind of breeder that needs to be able to thrive, so fingers crossed yours is a reasonable one.

Thanks Whitney, it's really good to be aware of the possible issues. I was told to email with all our details, but I think I will try and call again and get more info on what are allowable expenses etc.
It's hard isn't it - I am so keen for them to do as much as possible to stop puppy farming, and to support responsible breeders, but stopping decent hobby breeders from having a single litter a year (which only starts to offset the cost of doing everything responsibly) seems very unfair...

Yes, it's madness and will make little difference to the real issues - most of which were licensed anyway but still operating in very poor conditions!

All made worse by the fact that there is no consistency at all across difference councils, and not enough staff to inspect if they are taking it from the very smallest breeders ...

(It also muddies the waters really too for those looking for a pet puppy - used to be much easier and safer to advise people that unless someone had a demonstrable show/working record, it was better to not touch licensed breeders with a bargepole!)

I have no knowledge or advice, just asking to please post photos so we can all see how cute they are!!!
Definitely this^!!!!! But obviously I was going to mention all the earlier good advice too I think the idea of watching another dog producing lots of cute puppies first is a good one - you'll be so much more confident. Good Luck!!

Whitney, I have been researching madly. Finding it impossible to get guidance from our local council - they have a system of 'email us with any/all information and we will get back to you'. Kennel Club are clear that they won't be asking for licences for anyone breeding under 3 litters a year. There are also some good articles on OurDogs which suggest that as a proper hobby breeder there is no need to get a licence under the 'spirit' of the legislation. (no links as you have to have a subscription)
For anyone interested, Rochdale have very clear guidance about what is involved in being a licenced breeder here: www.rochford.gov.uk/sites/default/files/business_dog_breeding_licence_conditions.pdf
I might have to start a new thread!!

I have had a thought is the stud living with you? If not it might be worth getting some pictures/videos of him for the potential owners to have a look at. I was lucky that my breeder had the dam and stud at her house so I could meet and interact with them. It was very important for me to make sure the parents had a good temperament.

Our puppy pack included a toy and blanket that had been in with the litter so smelt of them (a bit too much really!!), photos of both parents and of our puppy at various stages between birth and 8 weeks, and a copy of the pedigree.

Our council interprets the 'profit' part as not 'making a profit' but 'selling for profit' therefore under our council, if you are selling the pups for any amount of money, even one litter would need to be licensed.

@Pigletpoglet
A single litter a year.
That’s a huge amount. Either they have many many bitches or are breeding repeatedly from the same bitch. Neither are good.

Honestly Wolfiefan, you know I am vehemently opposed to commercial breeders, but a single litter a year is not a huge amount by any measure. Perhaps you are basing it on your own very specialist breed, where litters can be huge and homes are scarce?

There are lots of breeders who own several quality bitches and breed a litter or two every year without in any way breeding commercially or having multiple litters from each bitch.

(I always feel the need to justify myself by saying that no, I don't breed myself any more - and have had a grand total of three litters in my life - but I know many breeders of quality dogs.)

The decent breeders are the people we NEED to keep breeding. If decent pups aren't available for a year, the vast majority of pet people will not wait and will go to commercial breeders.

A litter a year is massive. If a bitch has two seasons a year and not all matings are successful then that must mean they have a lot of bitches or repeatedly breed from the same poor bitch.
Completely unacceptable and clearly commercial and not responsible. I would avoid any breeder simply doing it for the money and that’s what this would be.

I am most disappointed that there are no photos of your dog.....🥴

I respectfully disagree entirely in this instance, Wolfie - I know lots of show kennels who have perhaps half a dozen bitches of various ages.

No individual bitch is having more than one or two litters over their life, but when you have generations of bitches they are always rolling along and coming to that life stage. As long as all are well kept, I see no issue with that at all, and I am as anti-commercial breeding as they come.

Again, where are the well bred puppies going to come from, if not from this type of breeder?

You'll need to include the microchip form too.

Show kennels.
aka commercial breeders.
I don’t want my dog to come from kennels.

One litter a year is tiny! And honestly would suggest the breeder is a one off chancer with not a lot of knowledge. A decent breeder would make breeding their life, and to make that financially viable they would have a few bitches and maybe a stud dog or buy in a suitable stud. They may then choose to keep one or the puppies for themselves to continue the line.
Breeding a family pet is not necessarily a good breeder.

A good breeder will breed when they want to continue the line. That won’t be yearly. They won’t want multiple litters from the same bitch. They won’t have loads of bitches as they wouldn’t have time and money to look after/train/groom etc.
Two seasons a year. That’s all dogs have. To have a litter a year you either breed repeatedly or have far too many bitches to give them proper time and attention and love in the home.
I have high standards when it comes to paying for a dog. All my cats have been rescues and I won’t give money to someone who doesn’t love their dogs, love the breed and want to do the best for both.

I think you need to think critically about any puppy. I'd be skeptical of someone with 6 bitches breeding but that's good as maybe it's a kennel scenario or maybe it's a loving owner carefully breeding loved dogs once or twice in their lives to support the breed. I never experienced breeding but I grew up with five dogs and four children and I can assure you we were all very much loved and cared for. Owning a larger number of dogs doesn't necessarily equate to dodgy breeder with no concern for the dogs. But it may. So view each scenario with a sensible, critical opinion.

Sorry, piglet, that was to address the comments regarding responsible breeding. You sound so enthusiastic and responsible. No one on the pregnancy threads when a woman posts about what to take to hospital for the birth or how many outfits to buy asks if they really should be having a baby or suggesting if they have questions then they shouldn't be doing it! Im going by your online appearance granted, but I think you seem genuine and I wish you and your girl all the best with the pups when they come.

Artykitty, Wolfie and everyone! Thanks for the comments. It's really interesting to read people's opinions about breeding and breeders. There is such a range of practice, and I think mostly people agree on what good practice is: 1 or 2 litters in a lifetime from a bitch; careful selection and health checking; dogs who are much loved and live rich lives as part of the family; puppies that are reared with PC or that level of input and love etc.

I think this can come from a 'show kennel' - we have a KC kennel name and show regularly - does that make us a show kennel? Our 3 DDogs definitely live lives of doggy luxury as members of our family, not in 'kennels'!

I think generally every breeder should be looked at individually - are they really giving their breeding bitch, their other dogs and their puppies everything that they need and lots more?

Adding in the legislation gets even more tricky - how can we legislate for good practice? I found the Rochdale (not my council) guidelines for breeders here: www.rochford.gov.uk/sites/default/files/business_dog_breeding_licence_conditions.pdf
They are obviously carefully written, and the council are obviously committed to good practice. My home wouldn't comply without some serious work - record keeping, a bigger vehicle etc. For example our dogs are confined to one room when in the house - we have an open plan living, dining, kitchen that is about 10m x 6m and is the whole of the downstairs, but this wouldn't be acceptable. But I wouldn't dream of having a puppy from a 'commercial' kennel that meets all their guidelines.

It's a very complex area, and I don't have any answers. We will just do the best we can to make sure our breed and our puppies are happy and healthy dogs with good homes.

Please keep the tips coming - I'm loving ideas for puppy packs. We've started watching puppy culture, and DH has already started work on a play cube etc. I am planning on having a lovely time shopping at Crufts for toys, feeders etc.
Sorry for the essay!

A puppy pack for each puppy can be very useful for the new owners. It can include:

• info on parents, including health screening
• registration documents
• health documents, including vaccination card, growth chart and worming schedule
• usb with photos
• basic training advice, especially habits already formed on toilet training, etc.

Correct early socialisation is very important. For the later stages, especially if you keep the puppies closer to 10 weeks than 8 weeks, exposure to different sounds and events around the house and garden including children and other animals, safe exposure to the world at large (i’ve seen breeders use enclosed buggies or similar to take litters out), visits to the vet, individual handling, petit and starting with grooming, different visitors, etc.

Sorry, forgot to say...colour code the puppy pack to match the collar on each puppy, that way you won’t loose track!

Quick question - in Book of the Bitch, she talks about white polyester fur. Is this Vetbed? (having visions of Pigletdog reclining on white fur in some kind of playboy mansion-esque whelping box...)

Yep!