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If you're worried about your pet's health, please speak to a vet or qualified professional.

Original poster

Puppy had new heart murmur

37 replies

Bigfoot1 · 23/02/2018 20:51

Just taken 9 week old Pup (from KC registered and inspected breeder) to vets for health check and jabs. Vet said there was a heart murmur. Vet Quite dismissive and not forthcoming with anymore information.
We have certificate of health and KC insurance (5 weeks cover) from breeder but we organised petplan from the date we picked him up.

My friend who is a vet has offered to listen tomorrow and organise scan if necessary.

Has anyone any experience of this?

I’m really worried. We are all so attached to him in less than a week but i’m not sure about taking on a dog with what could prove (if scan confirms a congenital heart defect) to be a life shortening illness. I can’t imagine the awfulness of potentially losing a young dog and I can’t put my children through that.

Sorry

I guess question is who should pay for scan? I assume it will be breeders insurance? I also assume pet plan may now refuse to insure us....

OP posts:
MsHomeSlice · 23/02/2018 20:54

we had a dog with a heart murmur...he was 16 when he died! I wouldn't worry unnecessarily

your vet sound like a tosser though....dismissive and unhelpful would not get any repeat business from me.

tabulahrasa · 23/02/2018 22:33

The heart murmur may cause issues, it may not... it’ll depend what the scan shows, but, a murmur by itself doesn’t actually mean there’s a health issue. A heart murmur can just exist and never cause any problems.

Petplan (if you’re still in the 2 week exclusion period) will not cover this issue, ever, they will cover any illnesses after this still though.

You may be able to carry on with the KC insurance and it’s an existing policy so they can’t exclude it, but, you’ll need to check that out.

Original poster
Bigfoot1 · 23/02/2018 23:19

I can carry on KC insurance and cancel pet plan I guess but it’s not my preferred choice. The breeder set it up as £4K payout per year which is lower cover than I would like....
The breeder is really upset. She trusts her vet so hopefully this will turn out to be a storm in a teacup...
I presume if a second vet gives the all clear pet plan will be happy to carry on with insurance... with no exclusions...

Pup is currently tearing around the kitchen.... doesn’t look like much is wrong with him!

OP posts:
Tamberlane · 24/02/2018 00:44

Its not uncommon for puppies to have heart murmurs and while some can be signs of serious issues others will fade away as the pup ages. Not all mumurs can be heard at 6 weeks so its not that unusual to catch them on the later vaccine health checks.
I'd get your friend vet to grade the murmur and scan if needed to checl the structures of the heart.
But dont fret to much yet. These are more commonly innocent murmurs then serious issues.
What breed is the pup? Certain breeds do have a higher risk for heart issues.

Original poster
Bigfoot1 · 24/02/2018 01:23

Thanks that’s reassuring. He’s a Whippet. He’s totally gorgeous.
I’m mainly really worried for the pup but i’m Also worried that I could be left with an uninsurable pup.... unexpected large vets bills were a high priority for me to avoid hence being so on the ball about insurance and getting it organised from day 1 and prepared to pay for life cover.
I feel a bit like i’ve been cheated out of that by something turning up within the two week pet plan excision period that I have taken every measure to avoid. (Eg buying from reputable breeder with a health check, getting good quality insurance etc etc...)

OP posts:
BiteyShark · 24/02/2018 01:53

I think I would continue with the KC insurance without cancelling pet plan whilst you assess the heart murmur and have chance to talk to pet plan to see what the exclusion actually means. I would also find a better vet who will talk you through all the potential issues with it, remember you pay for vet care which means you simply transfer to another one if you are not happy (my vets always take time to discuss medical issues both now and potentially what it means for the future).

SkeletonSkins · 24/02/2018 09:45

Our dog had a heart murmur as a puppy, but he too grew out of it and our vet said it’s actually quite common in young puppies as it’s to do with the growing heart. Don’t worry too much - I know it’s hard but get the dog checked in a few weeks and see what things are like then.

Lucisky · 24/02/2018 11:22

Like the previous poster, our jrt had a heart murmur as a puppy. The vet was not concerned and said he would likely grow out of it, which he did.

xLeanne128 · 24/02/2018 11:26

My dog had a heart mumur as a pup the vet said it was common and would most likely disappear as the dog got older, no problems yet and she's 5 x

Original poster
Bigfoot1 · 24/02/2018 13:17

UPDATE
So been to a different vet. Grade 4 systolic heart murmur and likely to be either a hole in the heart (PDA) so facing major heart surgery or aortic stenosis (poor prognosis and life long meds). Unlikely to be innocent murmur given the grade.
Heart scan on Tues under sedation.
KC Insurance is crap. We pay £110 excess and 20% of total bill and it’s 4k maximum for the year- which is fine for the scan on Tues but probably not fine if we’re facing major cardiac surgery. Obv not covered by my pet plan policy.
The breeder has been great. She is gutted. Has never had this kind of problem before. She’s offered to take him back and for full refund etc...
I can’t bear the thought of having to part with him. He’s been with us a week. DC love him. He’s practically toilet trained already. He’s the loveliest dog i’ve ever had.... there’s a real sparkle about him....
I can’t stop crying.

Puppy had new heart murmur
OP posts:
BiteyShark · 24/02/2018 13:35

Oh OP so sorry for you and pup Flowers

The question is can you afford treatment not covered by any insurance? Only you know whether you can give him what he needs or whether you need to return him to the breeder.

BiteyShark · 24/02/2018 13:39

And I do understand regarding insurance. I am close to £3k in claims since getting my pup (who is now 16 months old). Whilst I could have afforded it without insurance not everyone can and vet bills easily mount up.

Original poster
Bigfoot1 · 24/02/2018 13:41

This is exactly why I wanted petplan with 7k per year, but we’re still in our initial 2 week’s illness exclusion period.

OP posts:
BiteyShark · 24/02/2018 13:45

If you continue with petplan you could find exactly what would or would not be covered, for example would it be just the heart murmur or any heart issues?

Then after his scan have a frank conversation with the vet for worst case scenario costs now and in the future.

NorthernLurker · 24/02/2018 13:50

I think you should return the pup I'm afraid. I know you are very attached to this little dog but you went to a breeder and did everything right exactly so you didn't put your milk through the stress of a sick animal. Don't guilt yourself in to signing up for a long and expensive good bye. He's a beautiful dog but he's not the family pet you needed.

Lucisky · 24/02/2018 14:28

What a shame. I think you should return the pup as well, the breeder is doing the right thing. Okay, so you will be sad and upset now, but keeping him may give you prolonged heartbreak.

Chippyway · 24/02/2018 14:40

No! Please don’t return the pup!

If you were adopting a child and it turned out the child was less than perfect you wouldn’t sent it back to the adoption home.

Okay so I know it’s slightly different for dogs. But nothing would make me return a dog. Even if he was completely fine and healthy now there’s nothing to say he’ll be okay in 3 years time. My last dog was fine and healthy only saw a vet once in her life for her puppy jabs but she passed away with cancer at just 5 years old.

Please don’t return him Sad

I can’t believe so many people get dogs only if they’re perfectly healthy. Your dog would love you regardless of illness/disability. I think we could all learn a thing or two from dogs..

Shambolical1 · 24/02/2018 15:01

It's not unusual for whippets to have a heart murmur but I'm extremely surprised the breeder's vet apparently missed it, if it's really a grade 4.

Some will have a murmur only at the vets, with it showing at times of stress.

I'd be inclined to postpone any decision until after the result of the heart scan is known. The vet should show you the scan images and explain what the findings mean.

I had a dog diagnosed with a grade 4 murmur, unexpectedly, at his annual health check. He was 12 and carried on till he was 16. It wasn't the heart condition that took him in the end.

NorthernLurker · 24/02/2018 15:25

Chippy the op has had the pup a week and can't afford this situation. She had taken pains to ensure she could afford any problems that came up but as it turns out the animal she has been sold wasn't fit for sale at the point of sale and the breeder clearly acknowledges that and is willing to assume responsibility, as she should.

Original poster
Bigfoot1 · 24/02/2018 16:20

It’s just an awful situation for everyone. We’re not doing anything until the outcome from Tues scan is known.

OP posts:
knockknockknock · 24/02/2018 16:29

Personally I'd have to return the pup. Medical expenses can get out of control and a limit that low will easily get used up.

It's hard but not as hard as having an ill pup then dog with spiralling costs and you can easily get another dog who will be equally loved.

To the poster who says you wouldn't return a child - it's such a different scenario for a start you get NHS cover.

AvocadosBeforeMortgages · 24/02/2018 16:37

If the breeder is willing to take the pup back (and presumably pay for treatment) would they be willing to pay for / go halves on treatment? Don't ask don't get...

BiteyShark · 24/02/2018 18:34

Good point AvocadosBeforeMortgages. OP it sounds like you have really bonded but are understandably concerned about health costs given the lack of good insurance for that condition. Perhaps when you know the full extent of it then you can weigh up keeping him but with a refund from the breeder to mitigate the health costs versus simply returning him to the breeder.

Greyhorses · 25/02/2018 06:50

Subject close to my heart as I sadly lost my 2 year old dog to a serious heart defect (PRAA) despite surgery.

I don’t regret taking her however it was a difficult and expensive 2 years.

I would see a specialist and ask prognosis and what treatment options are available. I believe dogs with a PDA can be ‘fixed’ to an extent?

Would the breeder contribute to surgery?

Ylvamoon · 25/02/2018 09:09

I think you should have a good chat with the breeder. You should also have a sales contract that covers exactly your situation... you need to be realistic in your ability to take a this dog on.
It's nobody's fault, often, when puppies go to get for first check up at the vets (initiated by the breeder) its a bit manic things can be missed. That's why you need to take pup to vets for a 2nd check.

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