how to stop puppy climbing on the table/sofa

[rhetorician]

she is 5 months old and very naughty! I continually tell her to get down and give her a treat when she does. Also ensure that no food is left on the table after mealtimes etc, and push all chairs in so that she can't climb up. But if I forget, and turn my back for a moment, there she is, standing on the table. Sofa the same - will get off if told (usually) but constantly jumping up on it. Will she just get it eventually, or should I be doing something different. Can distract her with kong/chew for a while...

Surely if you give her a treat when she gets down, all that is doing is reinforcing the behaviour? She has learned that in order to get a treat, all she has to do is jump on the table/sofa, and Bingo! - she gets a treat when she gets down again.

well the treat is for following my command - what's the alternative?

We just went with a very stern voice, and arm movement signalling what you expect them to do. No treats.

She's learnt if she jumps up and then gets off she gets a treat!

OK - I thought I was just extending the principles used at puppy training, e.g. you teach her to sit and come by connecting the command with a reward. I am really not very good at this dog training lark.

Perhaps a short, sharp visit from the smack fairy?

How about tethering her somewhere safely (that you can see easily) with a chew or kong, or crate her when you can't micromanage so she doesn't get to repeat the behaviour? Its hard when you can't constantly police objects you don't want them to jump on!

Maybe it is reinforcing to get excited attention so probably better not to make too much of it when she is on sofa or table.

Maybe teach both 'on', and 'off' extra well - perhaps using some other platform so as not to encourage use of sofa - so they are fluent, and make sure other behaviours are also on cue so you can direct her to do something else if you find her poised to leap...

smack fairy

rhetorician you are doing fine at this dog training....

You have the right idea but just tweak it a bit. Do reward for being on the floor. so drop treats on the floor so the best place to be is on the floor. Do this often. Your puppy will start to prefer and it be more profitable to be on the floor.

If she gets on the table lift off (if she doesn't run away) and put on the floor . do not reward this but distract to prevent her going back onto the table, drop treats on the floor if she stays on the floor.

cheerfulmarybrown that's more or less what I'm doing - she gets the treat once she is down on the floor. Most of the time I lift her off. She does do as I tell her a lot of the time. I do crate her Chrisalice particularly when things get a bit manic, or sometimes I put her in the garden where she potters around in between scrabbling like crazy at the window

Cheerfulmary - er... the 'smack fairy' thing was a joke

actually no it wasn't, nothing wrong with very occasional physical chastisement

rhetoricianI think what I meant but did not make clear is that you should be rewarding and treating for being on the floor before she climbs on the table.

So normal correct behavior is reward for being on the floor. No reward when removing from the table back to the floor. Just remove and side track to prevent immediately going back onto the table.

dodobookends each to their own but I prefer to use brain not pain in training dogs

Haha, I know, so do I, but when all else fails it's something that even the stupidest dog will understand

she is slowly getting it - and will usually get off when asked. I should have been clearer too - I tell her to get down - and if she doesn't she is lifted off and put down (she is only tiny) and once she is on the floor then she gets a treat, so the idea is (in theory) to associate the floor with good things. She is a canny bugger, so easy to train, but also good at finding ways around things

No dogs understand being smacked, I'm confused why you think they do? They stop the behaviour when they've been hit but always do it again. I can't think of a single example of a dog being hit as a correction and its never given that behaviour again.

My neighbours hit their whippet on the nose every time she barks at another dog. I've watched them do it for two years, the dog still barks at other dogs. Clearly the hitting isn't working.

Well thats because the timing is wrong and the dog is associating the presence of the other dog with being hit on the nose, and not the barking.

My neighbour has a total pain of a poodle which likes nothing better than to jump up and try to nip your fingers when you go round their house. Neighbour said "oh she always does that, she won't stop until you make a fuss of her". Bollocks to that. One smack on the nose from me and the dog has never tried it again (does it to other people all the time, just not me).

so dodo you smacked someone else's dog - I got very annoyed when someone kicked out at my puppy when she was jumping up - I know that's irritating behaviour, but she is 4 months old and still being trained

Yeah, cause violence is the answer. We have bigger brains and opposable thumbs, use them.

I think your own comments prove that smacking does not work does it to other people all the time just not me so smacking does not stop the jumping up and you have a dog that is frightened or wary of you. Hmm not how I want my dog to feel around me

Use the command 'off' as opposed to 'down'.
If he's on the couch, the first few times say 'off' in a deep voice and lift him off. You need to show him what your commands mean, he won't automatically know what they mean, you could be saying anything.
My pup is 10 months now and responds well to off, amd knows that 'down' is lying flat with his front legs on the ground.

probably confusing the poor pup by mixing "off" and "down"; she will usually follow if I point at the floor. We are getting there, slowly, I think - all of your tips have been very helpful, and they are much appreciated by this rookie dog owner

Whenever you use a command, use a very deep commanding voice and he'll recognise that he's supposed to be doing something. When he's doing something that you want him to, heel work etc use a high pitched happy tone 'yay yay good boy! Heel! Yay!' Etc.
I'm sure people that hear me think I'm a lunatic but it works.

Most of the time I lift her off. She does do as I tell her a lot of the time.

Unfortunately that will never fully work.
You absolutely need to be 100% consistent.

If you don't want her on the sofa or table, she must never, ever get away with being up there, never. You need to keep her out of that room or put chairs on the sofa or something so that she doesn't hop up when you're not looking. If you see her going to scramble up, you must swoop in instantly and whisk her away/ tell her OFF or whatever, and then I'd suggest immediately telling her to do something else completely and rewarding her for that, so that the game is not "jump on the sofa and then get treats for getting off it".

Obviously everyone in the house needs to be equally consistent and she must not ever be invited up.

The strongest reinforcer of a behaviour is intermittent reward.

Generally, it is difficult to have a "dog sofa," as once an animal is permitted on some furniture it will tend to regard everything at that level as fair game unless rigorously enforced. So it's by far easiest to ban all furniture-ascending. This is also useful if you are bringing your dog to visit other people's houses where they may not appreciate her on their furniture (and obviously allows you to easily keep things out of her reach).

It's also important that your dog never feels she can ignore you. If you tell her to do something you must say it once and only once, and only when you are in a position to ensure that she does what she's told. Otherwise she just learns that she needn't really bother if it doesn't please her.

villainous - yes, there's the rub - it's very very difficult to be consistent with a 6 year old and a 4 year old in the house - I am trying my very best, but with the best will in the world I can't watch the puppy 100% of the time - sometimes I have to attend to combination of child/dinner/something spilled.

I can distract her or get her attention on me. She isn't allowed to sit and sleep on anything except her bed or in her crate. But you're right, she is absolutely exploiting our inconsistencies.

There are many things that she is good about:

• sleeping in crate
• going outside to wee/poo
• doing "sit"
• walking on the lead

Well, yeah there are bigger fish to fry!

And she has a lot of things nailed... the toilet training and lead walking in particular are great and so many dogs are awful about both.

I suppose if she could stay off the table at least...

Does she use a chair to hop up? Could you get the kids to always push their chairs in so she hasn't got a step to climb on? And bring their plates straight to the sink so that she isn't tempted to slurp up their leftovers?

Oh yeah, if I read the OP I'd have seen that you already try to do those things.