It used to be children who were seen and not heard.... now it seems to be the attitude to dogs

[jenniferjane21]

We have an 8 month old collie cross puppy. We are taking her to obedience classes and puppy agility, which she loves. She is full of life, but training well; even her dog walker commented how good her recall is.

So far, so normal. The issue is walking her. We live on the south coast, in a populated area but not a city. When we are walking on the greens and parks round here we keep her on a lead. To walk her off lead, we go to the sea, but I don't think we have had a walk by the sea yet where someone hasn't said she should be on a lead.

The issue seems to be that she is a puppy who runs around. She is not barrelling around knocking into people or dogs, she is not barking, she is not biting, she is not aggressive, she is not chasing. Yet we have had comments like "She's a danger to children" (Really? we have 3 dc so she is more than used to children).

Today an older lady told me she should be on a lead because she had run up to say hello to her small dog. Apparently her dog had been frightened by a large dog when it was a puppy, so I understand her concerns (though her dog didn't look remotely upset to me!) and I put our dog back on the lead immediately, but it annoyed me that she was losing off lead time for simply behaving like a puppy. If she were a difficult dog, I could understand it, but this is NORMAL puppy behaviour. It feels to me like puppy behaviour is not allowed, like children were not allowed to be children years ago.

I know our dog will settle as she matures, but meanwhile, walking her is becoming less and less of a pleasure. The nearest contained dog walking area is 20 mins drive away and open countryside further away, so I'm not sure where to take her for off lead. I can't believe that walking her on an extendi lead at all times will give her the exercise she needs!

This is the first puppy we've had; we've had rescue dogs before, so I guess I'm not used to people's reactions to lively dogs. It's the one thing that makes me think I wouldn't get a puppy again

Excuse me?
What on earth are you talking about.

It sounded like a previous poster was struggling with recall so I politely suggested an easy way to train it.

I voiced my opinion - that is what forums are for no?
I voiced an opinion that unless a dog can be relied upon to return when called they shouldn't really be off lead.
I think you will find a lot of other reasonable people said the same.
Are they all angry trolls aswell?

Reason being that often, dogs are on lead for a good reason, if they don't come back when called they could get in trouble and some people don't like dogs and don't want them bounding up to them.
Why would you have a problem with that..?

Most reasonable people would not let their dog run up to people or leashed dogs.

Your comment is really rude and really out of order.
And quite honestly, has really upset me.
Reminded me loud and clear why I often join forums (to give people helpful advice) and then promptly leave when rude, judgemental people get nasty, for no reason.

Don't be upset Buttholelane, I think Easitoeat must be a bit confused. You haven't made any nasty posts, just helpful ones

I always put my puppy (6 months) onto his lead when we come across other dogs whether they are on lead or off. I used to keep him off lead if he approached another off lead dog, but over the past couple of months he has been attacked by 2 off lead dogs. The first owner had assured me his dog was fine but he went for my puppy and the owner had to hit him around the head with a stick to get him off (I later found out that his dog attacked another dog I know a couple of days later- both times the owner had said his dog was friendly!). The second time, our puppy was out with DH and he was attacked by an off lead black lab. The owner was apologetic, saying she was a rescue dog with issues, but did nothing to call her dog off. DH intervened and ended up picking up our puppy and while in his arms, the lab managed to take a chunk of fur out of our puppy's ear!

So, unless I know the off lead dog or they are OK once we've met, I'm constantly playing spot the dog when out. Our puppy has great recall so long as no other dogs are involved. I spend every walk randomly calling him to me so he never knows if it's a treat recall or a treat then lead recall. . He'll usually come back with reluctance if he spots the other dog first, but every once in a while, especially if the other dog is clearly playing, he's off. Fortunately most of the owners we've come across have been nice and understanding.

I sympathise this the OP, though. It was much easier when I was growing up. I grew up in the country and there was no leash law- this puppy is the first dog I've ever had on a lead! Pretty much everyone's dogs lived outside and they roamed about. Sometimes our dogs were home and sometimes they weren't. I used to take my dog on long walks through the apple orchards and woods and would pick up an assortment of random dogs on the way- they just fancied a walk and would join us and then stop at their houses on the way home. One farm had a big hill and a golden lab who spent his days hoping someone would come wander through his land. I'd get to the big hill at the far side and would see this little speck in the distance as he barrelled over to us saying, "Wait for me! Wait for me!"

I used to have friends who would walk their dogs to school every morning and their dogs would hang about the school until they went home, begging for snacks from the children at lunchtime. 2 of my teachers used to bring their dogs to school- my second grade teacher (when I was 7) had her Old English Sheepdog sit at the back of the classroom and our music teacher ad a black toy poodle who would sit in his office and then come out to greet each new class.

It was heaven for dogs.

If someone complains to dog warden about your dog bear in mind they're likely to be believed even if they exaggerate.
Friend has a lovely friendly springer, when it was 8 months old it used to run up to other people and dogs wanting to play. Someone complained to dog warden and said it was out of control. She was told dog had to be kept on a lead at all times. That was a year or so ago, dog is getting overweight even though she walks it for hours.

I am genuinely stunned at the reaction of people to this thread.
The OP clearly states she keeps puppy on lead in parks / busier areas and is only off lead on the beach.
She also states recall is good.
She has not asked for a lecture in recall - she attends training classes after all.
Her puppy is approaching other dogs to say hello in an open area - I think if other peoples dogs have snags and are so hostile / fear aggressive that any dog interaction is potentially dangerous then it is the responsibility of their owner to seek behavioural help, not have a go at the OP who is just being a normal dog owner.
Where is the joy in dog ownership if we have to keep our pets tethered to us by a lead at all times? I would argue that it is no life for a dog if they can't sprint across the beach or fields on a regular basis.
As for dog wardens - there is a huge gulf between latch key dogs roaming estates and well trained animals having an off lead run on a beach under the supervision of their owner.

I've been pondering this and have re-read your posts jenniferjane.

My youngest dog is only one so I don't have to think too far back to recall puppyish dog on dog interactions. My boy was pretty full on as a 6-9/10 month old - he would often provoke a growl or snappy reaction from other off lead dogs (I would leash him around on lead dogs) when he approached them. To my untutored eye I couldn't see what he was doing 'wrong' but then I'm not fully au fait with dog body language. He still has boundless energy but now when he approaches another dog it is invariably a positive experience - I think with maturity and exposure to other dogs' 'discipline' he has acquired canine good manners. Again - from my human perspective I can't see what he is doing differently and better - but clearly he has learnt dog etiquette

I suppose that some of the negative reactions from other dog owners that you are encountering is because they are apprehensive about the potential of their dog snapping at yours. As other posters have said on this thread - many adult dogs find puppies an irritant. You sound responsible and conscientious about how you are handling your pup, so I think as long as you leash your dog around on lead dogs you should continue as you are with off lead walks on the beach and perhaps just learn to ignore the occasional snippy remark from other dog owners where you are confident that their criticism is unfounded (like the older lady in your op) In time things will improve and your pup will learn the dos and don't for approaching other dogs

To Buttholelane: I am so sorry to be so rude. I was out of order.

Ender that's so sad about your friends Springer.Mine have never gone right up to other peoples dogs,even as young pups.When they see a new dog they just tend to stop and wag tails and wait till they pass.But the thought of them condemned to a life of lead walks only would be awful and shame on that person going to the dog warden so readily if no harm was done.Is it just another sign of how ridiculously risk averse and controlling society has become.I'm not advocating out of control dogs roaming ,and undoubtedly there are some dogs that are very valid cases for dog wardens to persue.But I couldn't express how I feel better than HMC and Sinclair's last posts.

Yes,Snugglepiggy, HMC and Sinclair have said it very well in their latest posts.