please help - I am so cast down

[lainiekazan]

Golden retriever aged 6 months. He has been a bit of a challenge, but things were really turning a corner: sleeping through the night, perfectly housetrained, responding very well to a wide range of commands.

But - about two weeks ago he started pulling on the lead - really pulling so that he won't walk on a loose lead for even two seconds. And in the last few days he has started leaping at the lead, becoming very agitated and angry and biting at me to wrench it away. He is quite big and very strong and I just can't manage him. Yesterday he just lay down on the pavement and we had stalemate for ten minutes. No treat will tempt him, no cajouling, angry voice, ignoring - nothing.

He has also started jumping up at passers by, which he never did before. As I said, he is so strong that it takes all my might to hold him back. I have been taking him out at 6.30am to try to avoid pedestrians. He's not too bothered about other dogs - just wants to leap on people.

I have employed all the training techniques recommended for loose lead walking - stopping if he pulls, turning round and walking the other way, etc. I am attending Kennel Club training classes but dog is by far the worst dog there and I'm just getting demoralised.

This morning we didn't even get to the end of the drive as he tried to yank the lead away and went absolutely berserk and knocked me over.

So now I daren't take him out. I just can't think how to move forward.

Sympathies. My pup is now 6 months and in the last few days I have definitely detected the Rise Of The Teenager. He has started ignoring me when I call. This morning, he peed on the rug despite having been clean for weeks. He has also started attacking the lead and dancing about on it. I'm going back to basics, and really enforcing those basic commands. Adolescent dogs are like human 3 year olds; adorable one minute and pure satan the next

Isn't 6 months when they forget all their training and turn bolshy?
I had a Ridgeback who did this at around the same age and I used a halti

It really changed my life. They can't pull because it just pulls their nose round. I used it for at least the first 2-3 years until she grew up a little and remembered her training.

I think I might get a halti. What about a leader type of lead? Or a chain lead? There are as many differing opinions on pulling as there are types of lead and I want to make sure I'm consistent and don't try one thing after another.

He is a teenager. Halti or gentle leader can be very helpful, but use a regular collar at training so that he is still learning how to behave. I find all chain leads do is destroy your hands.
It is like your children his behaviour seems ten times worse to your eyes than it does to other people. Whilst your dog is doing the crazy dog dance at training others have done it in the past and will do it in the future.
I say this as a survivor of the crazy dog dance.

I can sympathise, my goldie was a nightmare to walk between 6 and 9 months. He used to get overexcited and jump and bite at me. I dealt with it by stopping still, crossing my arms and ignoring him till he stopped and then moving on again. It took a while to work but it did in the end.

My boy also did his kangaroo impression when he saw people. I took a 2 prong approach to this. One was see person,get dog to sit (I almost had to sit on him at times), treat and repeat. I used this approach when I walked him on a narrow quite path. Prong 2 was taking him to the beach - lots of people but able to keep our distance. Now he still loves people but is much less likely to jump on them.

I have no advice on the pulling as my boy doesn't but if you could tell me how you got yours not to take much notice of other dogs I'd be forever grateful. My boy LOVES them. But he's so big (he's 16 months now) and bouncing on his back legs people don't want to let their dog say hello even though he's really soppy (he lets PILs dog eat his food and take toys out of his mouth!)

tbh the halti worked for me so I never tried anything else. The ridgeback weighed more than I did so I really did need something to control her pulling otherwise I couldn't have taken her out.

She was perfectly behaved at her training classes but unpredictable when out and about. I used to walk her in out-of-the-way places at dawn and dusk when there were less people about. She just loved people! I used to dream of a dog I could take to the local park and throw a ball to.

It does get better honestly. Just keep up with the training and eventually it all clicks. when she was five!

I'm currently going to a doggie delinquent class run by a behaviourist - it's set up for just exactly combating stuff like that.

There's no point telling you who it is unless you're near Edinburgh, lol, but you could look for something like that near you.

For jumping up you want passerbys who will ignore it and then give him attention when he gets down...I mean you'd need to arrange it with people you know obviously, lol.

The lead - get a long one, if he tries to pull it from you, drop it, stop engaging in the lead fight game stand on the end so he can't escape and just stand there arms crossed ignoring his attention seeking until he stops then give him the attention and repeat for what seems like forever, lol.

Pulling, I've got headcollars, they do work - I'm currently using a front clipping harness, I like that more.

just tried to take him out again; he went mental as usual - biting and jumping vertically. A lady passed by with a golden retriever who was wearing a Red Dingo harness - looked nice and comfortable. She said to get a harness pronto as pulling dogs develop powerful neck muscles which only exacerbate the problem.

Dog greets other dogs so nicely - sniffing and a quick nod. But he lunges at every single human being - and obviously that is not pleasant and leaves me a quivering wreck as I'm apologising to people and hauling him away. As I said earlier, I'm picking times of day to go out when I'm unlikely to encounter anyone, but that is frustrating and impractical really.

Try one of these harnesses dog-games-shop.co.uk/perfect-fit-fleece-dog-harness

That's the harness I've got, I've only had it about a week, but I'm fairly happy with it.

Mine pulls and lunges towards dogs, what I'm practicing doing is walking calmly towards them...my neighbour is dog sitting a completely uninterested in other dogs springer so I'm going to practice with him later today, lol. (I've already practiced in class)

So I walk towards the dog, ignoring a bit of normal (as in mine is a puller at the best of times, we're working on that too) pulling but rewarding any calm behaviour verbally and if he lunges or bounces I go back to where I started and wait for calm and then go again. I walk slowly, literally a couple of steps at a time because the aim is to keep him relaxed and anything he does like look at me (instead of the other dog) or sitting if I stop gets a treat, but the ultimate reward is to get to say hello to the other dog and he only gets there if he does it in a controlled way.

I can't see it being any different with people rather than dogs.

Oh and with harnesses, you want one that you can clip the lead on to the front...otherwise they can just drag you like a wee cart, lol

Dogmatic harness. Brilliant

We have successfully used the halti in the past - really reduced the pulling.

I have always wondered with the harnesses - doesn't it just give them something to lean into and pull against ?

My mother is a dog trainer and even she couldn't get through to my retriever cross lab when she hit the terrible teens. She tried all the normal training things - stopping, turning back the other way, pockets full of treats. We got a halti and haven't looked back. Actually we tried a normal lead a few months ago when she had the cone of shame on and she was a delight on the lead without the halti.

Cone of shame.

"I have always wondered with the harnesses - doesn't it just give them something to lean into and pull against ?"

Ones that fasten at the back can definitely have that effect, weirdly having the lead on their chest makes them walk towards you when they pull. Something about where the weight goes pulls them closer so they shift their weight either right or left instead of forwards.

If you get a harness with a front D ring it helps to stop them from pulling, all that happens when they do is it turns them back towards the owner.

The dogmatic looks promising.

I noted that someone said haltis are not so good for "handy" dogs who can use their paws to remove them. My dog's paws are almost as good as a pair of hands. I wouldn't be surprised if I came across him writing me out a shopping list.

Back to basics. Spend time indoors training the basic commands, sit, down, stand, wait, come, leave, no, off.

Train him to walk beside you indoors off lead & on lead. Have a command for walking beside you, heal, side ... Have an indoor training line on him at all times when in. This will allow you to enforce commands immediately. Make sure he knows the word no. Anytime he pulls say 'no' & stop. Don't do the changing direction thing, he's too smart for that & will realise the walk is still continuing albeit backwards & forwards! Stop & command sit. Do not move until he sits. Be prepared for a long wait! Wait a few minutes before telling him to sit if he does not sit straight away. After 5 mins either guide or lure him into sit position. Always praise & reward when he complies. Then resume the walk. Repeat when he pulls again. This will take a long time so be sure to do this when you have plenty of time. Don't worry if the walk ends up being very short, his brain will be having a major workout. He will get the message. It may be he will get it first day of doing this, maybe a few days or even a couple of weeks. I have found it to be the best method. The word 'no' is very important - do make sure he learns it.

Jumping up. First teach him to jump up on command.... This link www.loveyourdog.com/jumpingup.html

The passive protest... Does he have a crate or bed? Have you trained him to go to these safe places on command? If so, do so. This command can work well in ending passive protests like this! Do you play hide n seek? You could say where's the ball? Find it! This distracts him from non compliance & gets him thinking fun time! Vary the commands you give with pauses in between. Dogs are like kids & can tune out.

Be careful the harness you get. Remember the original idea of a harness was to allow a dog to pull. While he is still learning you are in command of the walk try to stick with a wide collar, once he has learnt to respond to your instructions on lead then get a harness.... more for his safety than anything else, no matter how strong the neck dogs can damage their throats by lunging & being jerked back by the lead. But if you think a harness is needed now, go for it. Try & get one with a handle attached. This will be a great aid to help reduce the jumping up. Julius k9 Power harnesses are expensive but great & you can also get pouches to out on them, great for giving them a job to focus on.

Whichever method you decide, stick with. Consistency is key & will pay off. Be patient, it will happen!

Spider, the harness tabulahrasa are on about is specifically designed to help with pulling. My dog was taught LLW whilst wearing one. I would not recommend a flat collar on a puller, far too much in a dog's neck to damage and could lead to all sorts of problems.

And I that should say.

Thanks for that, spider7. Dog is intelligent, that I concede (obviously he's a MN dog ). His favourite thing to steal is my glasses. He's learnt that with other items I do distraction or wait until he's bored with it, but my glasses always gets me hurtling after him.

He sleeps in a crate and very dutifully goes in at bedtimes. Other times he will not go in. I am ok with this as at least he sleeps nicely at night and I don't want him to get the idea it's a punishment block. I do have to put him in if I go out, but then I leave him with a picnic in a series of boxes etc so he'll sit in it happily for a while.

might try that for my collie then - she hates anything around her collar or face so the halti would likely be a nightmare for her. But she pulls like a complete loon (but only when on the lead with the other dog - on her own she is fine !).

halti round fact - no dog is going to like it immediately - however, if it becomes associated with going out for a walk they'll probably work that out and accept it. Certainly worked with the collie crosses I had ages ago, and same theory works for muzzles too.

Can I ask a bit more about harnesses? Our dog pulled something awful on the lead. A friend gave us a harness (nothing special - not a 'anti-pulling' one, just this one www.vetuk.co.uk/dog-accessories-dog-harnesses-c-628_408/ancol-padded-reflective-dog-harness-blue-p-7169, clips up at the back and that is where the lead attaches). He hasn't pulled since (three weeks) and is a pleasure to walk. But I'm not convinced it's not just because he isn't used to the sensation when he pulls, but over time, he will get used to it and will start pulling like a carthorse.

Are people saying that harnesses per se (even when they clip at the back) will permenantly stop a dog pulling?