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The doghouse

If you're worried about your pet's health, please speak to a vet or qualified professional.

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Original poster

Labrador Puppy Food <<head thud desk>>

30 replies

AbsolutelyNotHoneyDragon · 06/08/2012 09:53

Right

James Well Beloved gave her the shits

Put her on Burns, fantastic reaction to the food.

Have since been told she is going to be friffing huge and she needs to be on large breed food like Burns extra. Basically she needs the right food for her joints etc.

I notice that the Burns extra states at 6 months to give one meal of extra one one of adult.

If that's the case will it not be better for her and certainly better for my bank balance if I simply switch her to Skinners Field and Trial Puppy till 9 months and then Skinners Field and Trial?

I know it's cheap, but lots of people enthuse about the quality, and it certainly looks like I am not going to have weight issues with her

OP posts:

Original poster

AbsolutelyNotHoneyDragon · 06/08/2012 10:18

oh and exactly how big does big mean?

The vet smirked when he said it

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Gorran · 06/08/2012 11:16

Gosh another thing to worry about! Daisy's currently on Burns but we've also been told she'll be big - it hadn't occurred to me I might need yk switch her food yet (spot the novice dog owner). Will read your thread with interest!!!

Original poster

AbsolutelyNotHoneyDragon · 06/08/2012 11:23

She stayed with her mum for a week, the rescuer by coincidence had the lady who took her sister on. She dwarfed her sister apparently.

The standard burns puppy wasn't enough, vet agreed.

I am hoping people will say Skinners will be just as good as Burns. I don't mind bigger poo as long as they are still nice and firm TMI - sorry

How much Burns is Daisy getting through?

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peggyblackett · 06/08/2012 11:24

Spillers sent my non-working lab bonkers. Seriously. He went from being biddable to flicking me the Vs whenever I tried to recall him. Within a few days of reverting to his old food he was back to his normal self.

We feed him a locally produced pet food called 'Just'. He is a massive lab but very slim and athletic and he looks brilliant on it. The vet said that as a lab he is the full article . He's also won two best condition classes whilst on it. Worth looking up should you be local to the producers.

misdee · 06/08/2012 11:33

Would you consider raw food?

toboldlygo · 06/08/2012 11:55

Even a big lab isn't a large breed and I have my doubts about the split between puppy/adult/large/giant breed foods (and don't get me started on breed-specific foods ).

Best thing for joints is to restrict exercise until at least 12 months, no jumping (esp. in and out of cars, down stairs etc.), no pounding on hard surfaces and so on, just free play and gentle lead walks. And good breeding in the first place!

Skinners is the best 'budget' option dry kibble and better quality than many more expensive foods, IMHO, though I am a raw feeding fan.

daisydotandgertie · 06/08/2012 11:58

Why does the vet say Burns isn't enough? It sounds like a crock to me.

What is his logic? Is she dangerously underweight? The ideal weight gain for a lab puppy is about a pound a week.

It is vital to keep Labrador puppies at a reasonable weight to prevent damage to their joints. Growth that is too fast is one of the most high risk factors in the development of these dogs.

Was he attempting to steer you onto one of those over priced crappy foods sold in practices?

I would advise you continue to feed the very best quality food you can manage at this stage in your puppy's life. By all means economise when all their growing is done, but until then don't run the risk. Burns puppy is a good food. So is fish4dogs puppy food.

Large breed puppy food is a marketing gimmick. Utterly uneccessary and in some cases damaging. It encourages too much growth, too fast and that is not a good thing.

wiggofan · 06/08/2012 12:03

Best not take size predictions as gospel. The vet, and everyone else, told me my lab puppy was going to be ENORMOUS, something to do with the size of his paws apparently . Now he's 2 yrs old and 26kg, not big for a lab, same size as his mother, father was huge.
He's slim and muscular and random strangers come up to say he's a lovely shape . He was on Skinners till 8 months then I changed him to raw which he's been on ever since.

Original poster

AbsolutelyNotHoneyDragon · 06/08/2012 13:14

All this food thing has me tbh. It's 10 years since I had a puppy. I'm sure then it was just Puppy food >Dog Food .Senior Food No marketing scam, vet had commented on her growth rate and said he canine extra had better stuff for joints.

I don't let her on stairs and watch her activity etc, and yes she has some raw. I think the vet was being helpful as if we give her the right amount of Burns for her weight she goes underweight.

Interesting about the size thing, her Mum is big tbf but nothing unusual.

I was going to try her Skinners originally, as the Lady in PAH said Wainwrights was the same as James Wellbeloved so would have the same effect on her stomach, but my local pet shop had Burns so went for that.

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Lizcat · 06/08/2012 13:52

Sorry togoboldly, but as I have posted several things the exer use thing is now know to be bollocks. The most important thing for joints is that your dog is never overweight for the size they are. So the dog should have a waist and ribs should be felt with light pressure.

Lizcat · 06/08/2012 13:53

Sorry obviously exercise is what I meant.

Stoney666 · 06/08/2012 14:20

Hi
Have u tried looking for burns online? I feed fish4dogs, my local stockist charges £62 for 12k bag. I buy from medic animal for £46.90 and free delivery. Could be worth a look

MonsPubis · 06/08/2012 14:29

How about csjk9 . It's brill and not expensive.

Let me linky you to the website. Back in a mo.

MonsPubis · 06/08/2012 14:30

here

toboldlygo · 06/08/2012 14:52

I can't agree, Lizcat, I've known dogs ruined by hard exercise too young and others permanently injured by eg. flinging themselves off an A-frame or wall at a young age.

Agree that weight is crucial and especially so for a walking dustbin lab - you so seldom see a slim one.

Regarding foods marketed as good for joints I've never seen one yet that had more than a token amount of the supposedly helpful additive, if that's something you're interested in it would be more worthwhile to pursue a standalone joint supplement, fish oils etc.

Original poster

AbsolutelyNotHoneyDragon · 06/08/2012 15:45

Hmmmm see this is making me more likely to go for Skinners or similar. And give her fish oil if the vet is concerned about her growth rate. Her weight is good and coat etc lovely, she also has sardines, raw egg and raw chicken too with no ill effects.

With my last Lab the only times she gained weight was when she was on enforced lead only excersise, always due to buggering her shoulder through stupidity.

She is a lovely active little thing, I am dreading the horrid hormonal phase!

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Lizcat · 06/08/2012 16:37

Sorry toboldlygo good well respected studies of large numbers of dogs have now shown that exercise does not play a factor. This is the view held by some of the top veterinary orthopaedic surgeons in the UK now. The joint problems come because the genetics are there not from the exercise. If you have the genetics you can reduce the likelihood of problems by keeping the weight off.

Original poster

AbsolutelyNotHoneyDragon · 06/08/2012 17:17

Our old Lab had a dicky shoulder, that was just genetics / bad luck She didn't care though

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AnotherLoad · 06/08/2012 19:52

wellbeloved went straight through my dog too, she is on natures menu raw food and have no problems with the poo deposits

daisydotandgertie · 06/08/2012 23:23

Especially if your puppy is a fast grower, please don't compromise on the quality of her food for the first year of her life.

Skinners duck/salmon and rice is fine for an adult dog, but their puppy food is not such good quality and neither are their other ranges.

What you put into your dog this year will define the rest of her life. Keep the quality as high as you can manage and keep her lean rather than lardy. It is so important.

I don't think your vet is right. You've not said your pup is underweight.

Lizcat - I've recently seen a series of xrays of labrador hips; taken at 1 day, 8 weeks and 20 weeks.

The change in those joints during that time is phenomenal. At 1 day, there are no hips just a space for them to grow, by 8 weeks the balls are beginning to form on the femurs and pelvic sockets are beginning to form. The pelvic socket is still split into two clear pieces by a gap through the socket at about the same place as the middle of the femoral ball. There is still no wrap around of socket, so the joint is still very unstable. By 20 weeks, the joint is starting to take it's final shape, but even then is still not properly formed.

I know you're a vet and remember you have attended some fascinating conferences about joints and damage - but I just can't comprehend how permitting free exercise, even with a measure of common sense during this period of massive internal physical change doesn't damage these delicate, pliable, developing joints. I'd be fascinated to hear more!

Original poster

AbsolutelyNotHoneyDragon · 06/08/2012 23:47

I was happy with the Burns puppy till 12 months. She was too thin on the amount for her weight but that was remedied by her being fed slightly more and supplementing her diet with fish and raw. She has been thriving.

We are trying the Burns extra now as recommended, but I didn't like the concept of her having to have one adult meal and one extra from 9 months. Which led me to compare adult Burns vs Skinners.

I wanted her on the best food I could whilst she is young, hence feeling a little bit to be told it wasn't good enough.

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daisydotandgertie · 07/08/2012 06:35

OK - she is a far older puppy than I had assumed!

I think I have read that she is over 12 months old in your last post?

If she is, then yes, Burns Extra is exactly what I put one of mine on at that age. They don't need puppy food beyond about 9 or 12 months depending on their growth rate.

You could also try Fish4Dogs which my 4 are all thriving on and need far less food than recommended to keep condition. Burns is very well known for keeping dogs pretty skinny.

Pets at Home do their own brand called Wainwrights which is pretty good, and not wildly expensive. Skinners rice based kibble is OK, the rest of their range is too crappy for me to consider. The premium range (command performance) of CSJ foods is also good, I found that their delivery charges were too high though, and we don't have a local stockist.

Original poster

AbsolutelyNotHoneyDragon · 07/08/2012 08:06

No she is only 5 months sorry. That's why I posted, I think 9 months seems very young to put her on adult food, even if it is only one meal a day.

The vet said to put her on Burns extra now because of her size. She is 20 week and 16k (which looks normal to me). Her shape is good and her ribs are there. This whole thing has me tbh.

Basically the vet has said if I am having to give her the Burns puppy I am at 16.5k she should be on the Extra. But I dislike the pack states it should be used in conjunction with adult food from 9 months, that seems very young.

I am not bothered by the cost of Burns whilst she is a puppy. When she is an adult I was considering a switch to Fish 4 dogs or fish Skinners and a diet supplemented with raw.

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Original poster

AbsolutelyNotHoneyDragon · 07/08/2012 08:07

Although you have reassured me on the 9 months thing

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Lizcat · 07/08/2012 09:26

Daisy the advice on free exercise is coming out of Fitzpatricks

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