rehome my pooches

[twinmummy132]

hello ladies im new to mumsnet a few of my friends are on here and told me this was a good place for advice.my problem is i have two dogs a staffie and a alsation x both lovely gentle dogs the only thing is i have to get rid of them as my flat is too small for me two dogs and two 15 month old babies i am at my wits end trying to find them somewhere to go plus my landlord has said that i cant have them i have tried everywhere i know that takes dogs but most of them are full or not any for at least 6 months i need a soultion asap.please help me many thanx.

Yes, this Op did. They don't all get off so lightly though, do they.
We work, in a very small unofficial way, in horse rescue. I know how frustrating it can be. But animal welfare is a bigger issue than just berating stupid buyers. Change the system. The people who come here, and have bought a dog in ignorance, may or may not be the best home for the dog, but they were sold the dog by the breeder who has ultimate responsibility for the destination of their puppies.
The breeders need to be dealt with. The buyers need to be educated about buying a dog, before they buy. The ones that have made the mistake, and come here for help, are naive, stupid, call it what you will, but they have either realised their mistake, and want help, or don't want help and want rid. The latter are not the best place for the dog. The former may not be the best place, but are at least willing to try. Either way, abuse them, and alienate them, and they aren't going to listen! Explain the error of their ways, show them what they did wrong, help them, but the flaming is intimidating And counter productive.
This is a place where I'd like to hang out. I've asked for advice in the past, and received none I would love to chat about my dog, but I won't! Because this place is like hell!

Catpuss, as I said upthread, yeah there's got to be an allowance for finding out about people's difficult circumstances/the lack of choices they may now have that no-one could have forseen. But are we saying then that there should be no negative emotional repercussions for people who make bad decisions about animals and consequently risk them suffering? Should the dog rehomers just smile and say 'no no, it's fine, you made a mistake but I'll solve your problem for you, no need to worry about it any further' and let them skip off feeling OK about themselves? IMO some people should have it on their conscience if they've taken on responsibility for an animal or worse bred from an animal without properly thinking through the ramifications. If people aren't asked to face up to the reality of their abdication of responsibility and the seriousness of the situation then there's even more risk of harm - these are the people who will sell their dog for £50 on Gumtree and delude themselves that it's going to a nice home.

And you have to recognise that the anger vocalised on these threads might have a wider influence than on just the person it's directed at, if that makes sense. What about other readers who might be idly considering getting a nice fluffy puppy and who consequently think things through properly and reconsider? What about the one person who's stopped being deluded, feels properly ashamed of their past behaviour and uses that shame productively to influence others? At the end of the day it shouldn't be socially acceptable to take on animals lightly and pass them on when it no longer suits, and there aren't many public spaces where people are saying loudly 'no it's not alright to do that and you should feel shit about yourself if you do'. I always hear a great deal of care in the voices making these points even if what they are saying is not an easy thing to digest.

Quod, this os a discussion forum, not a vigilante group. If you find something distasteful or abhorrent, that is your personal opinion. No-one has to go on a crusade to change or browbeat others. It is just not done, no matter how just you might perceive your cause to be.

For example, I might be against abortion, but you won't see me ranting to people who are planning to have one, or spouting vitriol against them. I also think it is highly irresponsible to feed children junk food, but I don't get on a high horse about it on threads.

Regarding dogs, I think breeding puppies for money is abhorrent, and that people who buy purebreds simply because of status or looks are actually contributing to more diseases in dogs. I am happy to discuss my beliefs, but in this forum, it seems rational discussion is not encouraged but attacking everyone who acts against the wishes/beliefs of a few is the norm.

If every one made their beliefs a personal crusade, MN would be a pretty unpleasant place.

I agree with Flatbread. This is a topic for people to come for help. She is right when she mentions vigilantes. And that aspect of the Doghouse turns me right off! You sound like hunt sabs sometimes, or religious fundamentalists. I share most of your views, and like to share with others, but there is no need for ranting to spread the word. TBH, if I was thinking of buying a cute fluffy but wholly inappropriate puppy, I'd take one look at this topic, and leave. In which case, your advice would never reach me.

The OP has got plenty of help and been given plenty of good, no kill rescue contacts and also warnings, by those involved in rescue and know about it in great detail, where not to take her dog as these are not no kill rescues and the OP did state she doesn't want her dogs killed.

With respect, having been involved in horse rescue myself, the situation is nowhere near on the same level. Horses are by and large expensive animals and as such seen less as 'disposable' in the way that dogs are and (although I appreciate things have changed somewhat in recent years) most people who get them make sure they know how to look after them and treat them. I just don't feel the two can be compared.

The dog rescue/rehoming situation is an emotive one and brings about strong feelings. When you have tried desperately to ring round to find a place for a perfectly 'good' dog in a rescue so it won't be killed in the pound and chucked in a wheelie bin with dozens of others, when you've helped rescue a dog that was rehomed through the free ads or gum tree and has turned up with severe injuries from dog fighting, when you work in a vets where irresponsible breeders come in and ask for a whole litter of puppies to be put to sleep, or the 4 month old puppy they wanted so much 8 weeks ago put to sleep or simply had to find places for literally hundreds of dogs whose owners either can't be bothered to train them, want a puppy again, are having a baby etc etc it all gets very wearing to say the least.

I have a dog here that causes immense strain on my personal life with his behaviour due to neglect from his previous owner. He is a danger to other dogs because of it and potentially strange people also. Some of it is also attributed to his appalling 'breeder'. It is taking a long time to turn him around, despite being very experienced with dogs. The person I got him from was going to take him back to the pound, in Ireland, where he would have almost certainly been killed. I did feel a bit sorry for her at the time. She didn't know the difference between a pound and a rescue centre and she said getting a dog had been a huge, huge mistake and they weren't suited to getting a dog. Except they've just bought a new puppy. When you see people like that and worse daily you get jaded and very disillusioned.

Have you any idea how many horses are slaughtered, daily in the racing industry? How many colt foals are killed just for being born? I've seen welsh hill farms, who breed 300 foals, just to keep twenty, then get the knacker in for the rest? How many horses are in gypsy herds, nationwide, skin and bone? They are totally comparable, only few people know the plight of thousands and thousands of horses in this country. Dogs are not more emotive, I've seen horses with as many and worse problems, than any rescue dog, but the killer horses die. Without fail.

And what do you think happens to racing Greys?

All animal cruelty is terrible. Horses are more emotive to you because you know more about it and deal with it more often than others. I do the same for dogs. It doesn't mean that one is worse than the other or not as bad as the other. One dog let down/treat cruelly is one too many, in me eyes. The same applies to any living creature.

As it happens I never see horses popping on my FB feed being advertised for sale because some idiot has put their horse with next doors horse to make a bit of cash. Or because someone has gone and bought a horse and then realised it needs exercise and can't be bothered. Or because it no longer matches the sofa.

No. I'm not more emotional about horses. Just about every animal humans keep needs res using in one way or another. Tortoises... Kept in vibrations, fed kale, dog food, dried reptile food. The majority of tortoises kept in this country suffer for years in silent misery. The damage done to them is often only noticed when it's irreversible. Hamaters, gerbils, rabbits, guinea pigs, not to mention. Cows sheep and pigs.
Horses are sold for those reasons every day. Going down and down in price with each sale, till they are knacker fodder. We have a dozen, passed to us for just those reasons.
Dogs aren't the only animals which need to be protected. The others just don't prompt such rabid responses from their supporters!

So is the doghouse a soap box for self-appointed 'animal welfare' activists?

Is the food section, then, a suitable candidate for the health vigilantes? After all obesity is a huge problem, growing among children and we all are paying for it as our tax money pays for nhs resources.

Plus, of course there are those who are passionate about food and fair trade, sustainably produced and against factory farming.

Imagine a thread where a poster asks about recipes for beef stroganoff. And she gets questioned by the health activists on whether her family really needs the calories, a caution on how red meat is bad for you. And probed whether the beef is organic and a lecture on factory farming.

Would the poster be unreasonable to get annoyed and tell people to fuck off, and it is none of their business? Cue for a pious reply 'but, I am a health worker, I have seen so many cases of children suffering from health issues, I am questioning the OP because I care' or 'I work with farmers, and have seen how horribly animals are treated'

Whatever. I think no one has a right to attack people on their food, children or pet decisions, no matter how righteous the cause. There is a huge difference between giving advice/help when requested and being a judgemental busybody on MN.

Well put!

I think MNHQ do a good job of deleting unacceptable posts and it worked well on this thread ...

Or do you want them to have a special rule just for the Doghouse that says 'must apply rose-tinted spectacles before posting'?

totally agree with Flatbread

Lol. Do the inner circle of doghouse fundamentalists get a special course in insinuations and making nasty comments with a nudge-nudge and a wink-wink?

That is how the nastiness continues, because, of course, the OP was not called a numpty, but it was implied. Nor was she called irresponsible and heartless, but it was implied.

If you don't see this, I think you are being deliberately obtuse.

Whew, two people agree with me, it must be my lucky day

IIRC Talk guidelines suggest that direct insults are not allowed. I cannot call you a numpty. but I can say that people like you are numpties, Or that you are behaving like a numpty. It's all in the wording. Innit!

You can call me a numpty if you like. I don't mind ;).

I can't even get the smileys right so I must be a numpty

Hilarious that someone in Flatbreads position is now trying to take the moral high ground....

FWIW, I'm really only interested in the dogs and this thread is yet another example of why people should use responsible, reputable breeders if they do not use a rescue. If that had happened here, this thread wouldn't even exist, the breeder would have taken these dogs back without question and not only the dogs, but their owner, would not be in this very sad situation.

And regardless of anything, the people most able to advise the OP in this case are the ones everyone is critiscising, the ones with all the rescue contacts and who know the inside info on rescues and pounds. Val should be sorely missed here, opinionated she may be, but I have known of plenty of occasions where she has spent hours of her own time and money finding help for owners and rescue or foster places for their unwanted dogs, in one case because it was making their cream carpets dirtying. And that's just on Mumsnet.

Oh, and this forums a walk in the park compared to Champdogs or some of the other dog forums.

Midori, what is your point? My dog had puppies, and I am not selling them to people (and there are many who have asked) and instead giving them to the dogs trust who have a waiting list for these pups. So what exactly is the crime that I have committed that I am not allowed to have any valid opinions on the doghouse?

Oh yes, I forgot this forum is only professional breeders who breed dogs multiple times for money, perpetuate shallow gene pools and diseases in dogs. And the people who buy these puppies from professional breeders. Hey, I got my dog on her way to a rescue, and my pups will be taking business away from people like you. I am so glad for that.

And it is precisely your type of condescending, patronizing attitude that gets people's back's up. No one wants to get abuse, no matter how 'helpful' it is. Lots of people can provide good advice, and they do so in the other sections in MN without being twats about it.

S'true though, what she says about beef stroganoff

I'm well into dogs, I love them and know lots about them but rarely can I be Arsed to wade into the wall of righteous indignation meeting most posts on the dog house

Good luck op, it's a shit situation for you. As a dog owner I can empathise with how hard it must be to be faced with having to give up your dogs

Perhaps you can point out where I've given the OP abuse?

You are, of course, entitled to your opinion. However, on a range of dog related topics you have had a number of people, including vets and qualified and experienced dog behaviourists, tell you you are wrong, yet you still think you're right?

You know absolutely zero about pedigree dog breeding and it's not a discussion when you refuse to even consider anyone else's point of view. The 'professional' breeders you talk about are puppy farmers, responsible breeders are not 'professional' breeders because breeding dogs is a coincidental part of their hobby of showing, working or competing their dogs and one which they do not make money from.

As for 'taking business from me'. Well, breeding my dogs is not a business, so that's impossible, but also, I doubt the people who have been waiting up to 4 years for a puppy from me with specific bloodlines is about to go to the dogs trust for a puppy because I won't be breeding again for some time. Instead, they'll get a puppy of the same lines from one of the breeders I've suggested to them.

Well bred pedigree puppies are actually few and far between. Over 90% of KC registrations are from 'volume breeders' (puppy farmers) and that amounts to around 90,000 dogs a year just counting Labradors and Golden Retrievers.

Anyhoo, the OP got lots of good rescue advice. I do hope she called some of them and her dogs are in the process of being rehomed.

Flatbread - you know full well that midori and others have NEVER advocated indiscriminate dog breeding, with no consideration for the health of the dogs concerned and purely for profit. What they do condemn is backyard breeders who do not check the health and genetic health of the dogs concerned before breeding them, who puppy-farm, and who don't check out the suitability of the homes their puppies go to.

There are posters within the Doghouse who do a lot of work with rescue dogs, and with shelters, and who see firsthand the price paid by dogs for backyard, indiscriminate breeding and selling of puppies. They know how many healthy dogs are put down each year because they cannot be found a home. They know what happens to dogs who are rehomed from unsuitable homes - because they didn't stay cute puppies, and because they were sold to owners who don't have the skills or time or dedication to care for a dog properly - and who sometimes end up in even worse homes, or being used for dog fighting.

I have not experienced these things firsthand, but have read information here and on FB about these things, and I can absolutely understand how anyone who was involved in canine welfare, and who had had to deal with the animal misery caused to so many dogs by careless owners and breeders, would become very heated on the subject of canine welfare. I respect them deeply for the work that they do.

Yes, I miss Val's advice too. She helped a lot of people.

It's entirely possible that some of the rescues suggested on this thread were suggested by Val

She really lurves some of the posters on this thread