Wednesday night, sending your child, aged 8 to boarding school, do tell me about it as i won't be able to watch!!!

[piratecat]

I couldn't even watch the trailer for it without wanting to weep!

By the way, I agree 100% with coffeeaddict's statement that "school is a form of institutionalisation after all". I hate the way schools try to iron out individuality in pupils or they try to label it if they can't iron it out

I've tried so hard to stay away from this, as I know it will only upset me. However,I've been drawn in against my will, and if I can make one person think again it will be worth the personal agitation.

I've not watched the programme, and not read all this thread, as I know it would be painful, so sorry if I repeat what others have already said. I have also named changed so that I can quickly step away from this again.

I was a Forces child, and I will never, ever, forgive my parents for sending me and my siblings away, age 7 for my brother and 9 for my sister and I. The crux of it is that they put my father's career, and my mother's social life, before the well being of their own children.

My brother got into drugs at boarding school (a common problem)and has serious mental health problems to this day. He's been sectioned since before Xmas, and 95% of his problems stem back to boarding school.

Both my sister and I were sexually abused by the father of a school friend who offered us a home for school holidays. My parents were often abroad, and we were forced to take any offers of a roof over our heads for half terms and the shorter holidays, even when we knew the price we would have to pay.

Before the age of 12 I was frightened, miserable and rejected. After the age of 10 I also became angry and suicidal. I was eventually expelled for leaving the boarding house without permission - by jumping from a third floor window, aged 17.

Its not the big things that still hurt so much - my school was very into toughing kids up by such petty things as making you handwash all your own clothes, not allowing phone calls and so on. The memories that still make me curl up today probably still happen, like not having anyone to comfort you when when you've been told off at school, or to care when you feel ill. No one noticing what I ate or didn't (and generally I didn't). No one discussing my O level options with me, the way I have just spent the last couple of weeks helping my DD decide. The inappropriate boyfriends I climbed out of windows to hang out with - the reputation of girls at my school was well deserved as we'd do anything with anyone who showed us affection.

If it weren't for my twin sister, I would not be here today, as she was the only one who I knew would care if I just disappeared.

I don't see much of my parents now I am in my 40s. There's been no big rift, its just that they didn't play much of a role in my childhood, and therefore we don't have much of a relationship in adulthood. I was trying to remember when I last spoke to my mum, and realised it was New Years Eve, not this year but last. You reap what you sow . . .

There is another option for Forces families - change your job!

I still don't understand the operational need to move members of the forces around so much. I get the need when a) it's an overseas posting, as I said earlier, and b) when it's a case of moving to get a promotion because none are available where you are.

What I don't understand is why someone would be posted somewhere for 6 months and then have to move again. Is the job they were doing at an end? If so, there must be a lot of short-term, one-off tasks involved in military work: seems unlikely. Is it that they are changing their day-to-day job to take a different role? If so, why not move them to do that job at their current location? Surely there must be a range of jobs available at each base so that you wouldn't always have to move location to do something new. It just seems like a lot of soldiers are being moved for the sake of being moved, because it's the done thing.

If we were actually at war (and I mean a full-on war defending our own country, rather than the situations in Iraq and Afghanistan, which I know opens up a can of worms...) then it would make more sense, as you might have to meet a sudden and unexpected need for certain kinds of staff in a particular place. But in the way we live in the UK now, it does just come across that thousands of families are being moved from one part of the UK to another, causing distress, incurring expense and creating the need for a lot of unnecessary organising and rearranging.

And what that leads me to wonder is: could it be that this is the forces' way of doing what boarding schools do - breaking the attachments of the people who work for them, so that their primary attachment will be to the force in which they serve, because they don't get the chance to properly attach to places, neighbours, even their families? Is that what all the moving is really about? [brewing conspiracy theory after late decision to open a Friday night beer emoticon]

I'm not really expecting anyone to be able to answer this question, because it's a long-established thing and no doubt decided and maintained way above the level of forces families. But I really am puzzled by the apparent need for it all. Surely there's a better way.

you would hope that it would be different now, but who knows?

my life would have been much much happier had i gone to boarding school - though i agree 8 is too young - sometimes it is the best option for the child

really interesting thought, eightieschick. it does seem counter-intuitive to cause so much upset to one's staff, and to detach them from their kids by putting them in a position where they feel that boarding school is a better life.

i don't dispute that, notanotter, but would you let a child be as distressed as april for months without throwing in the towel?

NFMDC

A very very un-MN hug for you.

My dad also spoke of handwashing his clothes and doing kitchen duty which involved hand-drying mountains of dishes. He never allowed me or my brother to do any household chores because it brought back too many memories for him. I first washed dishes in my student flat at the age of 21!

In an earlier post, I've spoken about how my dad rarely spoke to his siblings or parents. When his dad died, he hadn't spoken to him in 20 months and it didn't bother him. Similarly when he died himself, his siblings showed only nominal grief and buggered off as fast as they could from the funeral.

Not for my dear children too, not for them in a million years.

That is so awful NFMDC.

fwiw I do think that boarding schools are very different now, with massive emphasis on pastoral care. But there are some things they just can't fix, like if you have a bad day at school, you can't leave.

But I felt more stable and protected at school than at home, and home wasn't even that bad. I felt more noticed at school even though there were 600 girls or whatever. I wasn't one of the cool girls or anything. The things you mention, like people noticing what you eat and discussing O levels etc. with you - I got more of that at school than I did at home. The school nurse noticed my poor eating but my parents never did. I was at school only just over 10 years ago though. It was teachers who developed my interests (which my career has followed on from) not my parents. But I don't think my parents would have been able to do that even if I hadn't been at school. It wasn't perfect, but it was definitely the best option for me. I was surrounded by functional adults, and had less exposure to my toxic mother.

If you think/know you are a crap parent, is it better to send your kids away to school? I don't know.

of course not Aitch but maybe that is something that sometimes happens.....lots of children are very unhappy in school and parents leave them there...

I can't judge properly due to editing

8 is too young

Just so cruel, those poor poor babies.
If a career is so important to those fathers why have kids, its about life choices.
Or how about the Father go away & leave the mum a thome with the kids.

Sending the kids away is not essential it is a choice the parents made.

It was like putting the kids in to care & they just did not want to go.

Bloody awful, those parent need a good slap.
But at least she is good at the pub quiz now!

Have just watched the programme and read the entire thread.

The whole idea just doesn't make sense. It surely goes completely against a parent's natural instinct to send their child away from the "nest"? Watching that heartbreaking programme, I just felt in my gut that it was completely wrong.

One of the saddest realisations for me was that for the military children, any idea of a normal, comforting homelife was gone FOR EVER the minute they stepped foot in that school. If the parents are moving around every 2 years, then "going home for the holidays" becomes meaningless. I think someone mentioned this further up, but it's just so upsetting to think of thre being no familiar "refuge" for those kids ever again - the place where they sleep when they go home will simply be that - a room with their bed in it and a few belongings. It won't be "their" room as they will only get to spend a small amount of their life in it. They won't know neighbours and the local vicinity very well etc They wont' even know their siblings that well, FGS, if some of their siblings choose to stay in school at weekends because the alternative is too upsetting.

Their family life has gone forever.

It's soooo wrong.

Brahms, I see what you're saying. But even Social Workers try their hardest to keep children with their true parents as long as there isn't any evidence of abuse/neglect etc. My friend is a care worker, and they take children into fostering under the very extreme circumstances; they prefer to educate the parents in the first instance.

If it is better for a child to be with parents with truly atrocious parenting skills, then surely the parents shown in the programme (and the majority of parents of boarders) are not THAT bad and it is better for the child to stay home.

(Sorryy about grammar/continuity/spelling. It's very late at night)

thesteelfairy, your sister was sent away at 4 . My daughter is 3.5 now, and I just can't imagine...! They are babies until they are 5 or so. Do you have a good relationship with your sister yourself? Please say you do...

I'm still not getting it. Maybe it is different in the army, but as a navy wife even if I upped and moved to the married patch, DH would still be away on a boat for months at a time, so I really can't see the point in following him around, as I would be apart from him a lot anyway! Although just asked DH about it and it seems lots of navy families do send their kids to BS.

Surely there are many jobs where dad has to be away on business trips? I don't really understand how "civvies" can't possibly understand the life of a forces wife. Yes, my DH was in the Gulf throughout my whole pregnancy with ds, and off again when he was 2wks old, but I am lucky enough to have my dc and my dad around, so we coped.

I don't know if it makes a difference whether you see yourself first and foremost as a "forces wife" I don't. I have my own career ,friends and family. I love DH dearly, but I was under no illusions about what life would be like married to someone in the forces. I was independant before I met DH and I think my independance has helped with all the separations. I don't see instability- I see times where he has to be away and we will miss him until he gets home. To our house. My own dad was nothing to do with the forces, but was away reasonably often when I was a child, or working nights/ weekends, whatever- we still have a great relationship.

I wouldn't condemn anyone who chose to send their kids to BS, but to say there really isn't a choice is not true.

As for the day-nursery comparison, I think it is totally different. I have never left an upset child at nursery. If they were upset (rare), I have stayed until they weren't, and my boss has been ok about it (thankfully) If he hadn't been, or my kids had been unhappy at nursery, I would have had no qualms about quitting my job. If my kids were upset at going to school, I would have fixed it so they weren't-whether that meant moving them to another school or home-ed or whatever. I chose to bring these little people into the world, so my choices now have to take them into account (but that is only my personal feeling, don't all jump on me!)

joolyjoolyjoo, Yes I think the women identify with being a "forces wife" above being a mother. I guess in some circles that brings a certain sense of status or whatever.
All the woman has to do to avoid sending her kids away would be to align herself with the kids rather than her husband. Then she could set up home by herself in a permanent place and he could visit her. Easy solution. Of course,as I said before, the marriage would suffer, but I believe you should put your kids before your husband.

Eightieschick that is a fascinating point you made about breaking the family bonds so that the man feels that his job is his family. I think you have hit the nail on the head. Apart from my uncle who was in the RAF, all my other uncles' marriages eventually failed. They kept on working in the army as divorced men. The notion of switching lifestyles and jobs to save their marriages was unthinkable, not even an option.

I would be interested to see a follow-up programme on how the girls are doing after perhaps a year. I doubt this will happen as I'm sure the first few weeks were filmed purely for the observation of the emotions of the girls, and parents. This programme set-out to create a shock value for it's viewers, as the title 'Cutting Edge' suggests...and it succeeded.

My father was in the forces, and we moved everywhere with him. However, when we were posted to Germany, at the time, there were no local military senior schools, so poor elder brother had to go to a military boarding school 3 hours away. He absolutely hated it (the blankets on their beds were from WW2). It has had such a negative affect on him and he is emotionally quite cold, so different from me and my other brother.

I had the opportunity to board at 13 (I wanted to go), but my mother wouldn't hear of it because of how it affected my eldest brother.

We had a wonderful time moving from country to country, and had some great experiences, but, my education suffered quite badly. Moving from school to school (9 in total!) wasn't great, but it made me learn how to make friends quickly, otherwise it would have been a very lonely time. Most of the schools I went to (particularly abroad) were military schools so everyone was in the same boat. They were fantastic schools as well. The problems arose when we had to go to the local state school back home. That's when we felt outsiders.

Staying in one place while our dad moved with his postings was not an option. It was expected that wives moved with their husbands, and your children either moved with you or went to boarding school.

My DH is in the army and will be for the foreseable future and although the vast majority of our friends have sent/are going to send their children to board, we just couln't do it. I let DD stay up and watch the programme with me the other night and she said "mummy, if you accidently sent me off to BS, you would come and take me home if I was that upset wouldn't you?" Not entirely sure how I would send her accidently LOL but she was very emotional about it all. I have friends who have sent their chidlren aged 8 and three of them asked to go. They all love it but the majority of children where they board are all from forces families.
Don't forget, that the forces pay about 90% of the fees as long as the child remains in the same school. That may well be a reason why so many forces go when those people probably wouldn't send their children if they lived in civvie street and had to pay the whole amount.
We are now living in our own home in a lovely town with one of the country's top boarding and private day schools and if we could afford it, we would have sent them as day pupils but never as boarders. Luckily in our town, the three state schools are amazingly good and the A-level results from the comp. equal that of the boarding school.
Some children love the idea of boarding and for others, you can just tell they shouldn't be there but we know a few forces adults who went as children and said what a lonly time they had but didn't tell their parents as they knew they were doing it for them to have stability.

That's about 90% up to a amount.

'up to a certain amount' - still half asleep!

Curlyhairedassassin - that's simply not true about them going home to 'just a room with a few of their belongings' Their parents will most probably have moved during the summer hols (most forces families tend to) when the children would be there. Our friends children all have their own bedrooms whenever they come back for the hols and don't forget they have exeat weekdnds where they can either come home or parents visit them etc.
The home when they back is just that....a home. Forces families adapt very well to moving house and for me, moving house isn't stressful at all. It's normal. Families can quickly get settled in within a day or two and unlike in civvie street where, more often than not, neighbours hardly say hello to each other, forces families just crack on and have an instant social life. The children just become like brother and sisters to one another and are always in and out of each others houses; playing in the garden, having tea etc. Although I wouldn't send our children to board, that doesn't mean I think it's wrong for some people.

"What I don't understand is why someone would be posted somewhere for 6 months and then have to move again. Is the job they were doing at an end? If so, there must be a lot of short-term, one-off tasks involved in military work: seems unlikely. Is it that they are changing their day-to-day job to take a different role? If so, why not move them to do that job at their current location? Surely there must be a range of jobs available at each base so that you wouldn't always have to move location to do something new. It just seems like a lot of soldiers are being moved for the sake of being moved, because it's the done thing."

There aren't a lot of short-term jobs in the Army. The six month tours mentioned are usually operational (Iraq, Kosovo, Afghanistan etc). The normal duration of a posting is two years but it is not uncommon to get moved earlier because of promotion or because another job has come up elsewhere and the Army has decided that you are the one to do it!

To give you a breakdown of a typical career, here's where we've been and for how long:

1st posting - my husband's YO's course. we were there for eight months (five months of the course but I'd moved in three mobth's earler as he was still in Kosovo).

2nd posting - lasted a little over a year. We were given our notice to move, had our address and then it all changed two week's before we had to move and we were sent to another location. My husband was there for a year and then he was informed that they were moving him early to he could be Adjutant of the London-based battalion. We were due to move/start in the January but we were held there for three months longer as he was posted as part of the implementation force in Kabul.

3rd posting - (again short-toured) lasted eighteen months. We were moved because the Army wanted my husband to be an instructor at RMAS.

4th - this posting at RMAS actually lasted a full two years.

5th - nine months - my husband was moved on promotion to do a course at Shrivenham. We had to move with him because there weren't enough quarters at RMAS to allow us to stay on.

6th - three months. My husband was pulled out of that job to move to Scotland to fill a post that became vacant at short notice.

Att his point, we bought our own house (I'm from near Glasgow) and we've remained here since.

7th - the job in Glasgow only lasted a year as my husband was pulled early to go to company command. Luckily, it was in Edinburgh so we could stay in our own home.

8th - comapny command lasted eighteen months and then he was sent to Afghanistan for six months at the end of it.

9th - he's currently in a post in London that (nominally) is supposed to be for two years but I'm not holding my breath as we've only ever had one posting that's lasted as long as it was supposed to!

Plenty of our friends have experienced similar moves, so we're not that unusual.

Regarding doing a different role at the same location, well the easy answer is that for some parts of the Army the different types of jobs are grouped together. So, you have a group of people working together at job A at location A and the people doing job B are at location B etc. Certainly this is the case for my husband's cap badge - they're spread to the four winds and serve as bolt-ons to larger establishments. If you want to gain a broad spectrum of experience across a cap badge, then you have to move around.

He couldn't have stayed in Scotland after his tour in Edinburgh because there were simply no other jobs for his specialism at his rank.

There are a range of jobs at any base but often it's not possible for a soldier to switch between them. On a typical Army barracks, there will be a regiment plus the support elements (logisitics, medics etc). It's simply not possible for an infantry soldier or officer to do a tour within his battalion and then stay at the location and work with the medics/logistics etc - they lack the training.

There are moves to build and develop "super garrisons" where you can have several infantry battalions and their support located around a central area (Salisbury Plain is going to be one), thus allowing soldiers to remain in an area for more than two years at a time and providing more stability. This was first announced about six years ago and is still in development.

There are problems with acquiring the housing needed and the land to build these new garrisons as well as the logisitcs of closing up other bases and moving everyone together. This is a step in the right direction but, especially for officers and for those in a non-infantry role, there will still be a high volume of disturbance.

For those who say a woman should "align herself" - that sounds really confrontational. Not that the poster is being confrontational but that language suggests that a woman has to pick a side and be on it, opposing her husband - surely not a good recipe for any marriage!

Far better is for the parents to decide together what to do - whether that be moving the children, weekly/fortnightly commuting, or boarding school. We're doing the fortnightly commute right now and it's really hard to make it work. My husband is missing out on a lot. When he went to Afganistan, our youngest was only nine months old. He's hardly seen him since then. He missed a lot of firsts and, although he makes a great deal of effort when he is home, it's no substitue for him being home every night and every weekend. I'm pregnant again and it's hard work being a de facto single parent, knowing that I won't get a break unless my Mum can help out (which she does - a great deal). So, I can understand those who don't choose to do this - it's difficult to sustain a marriage when one of you is far away but it is possible. I know some people who've sustained it for many years, so it is possible to make it work.

As I've said before, our hope is that we'll avoid boarding school before secondary age. Right now, I'm planning on remaining in Scotland until my husband finishes his current job. We've had a strong indication from the Army of their plans for him, so we're making tentative plans based on that. We're planning to move back into quarters in three years or so and then look about for a house of our own (probably near Salisbury) that will see us through the next few years. Beyond that, who knows? If we're lucky, we'll move infrequently and our boys will be able to get continuity of education without sending them away. However, my husband still has 19 years left of service so who knows what will happen in that period!

We really want to be near Army patches and Army life because, as luciemule said above, patch life can be really friendly and close - certainly compared to civvie street. Despite living in a small cul-de-sac, I barely know my neighbours!

The documentary missed a trick; they could have looked at difficult choices forces families have to make including the education of their dc, much more complex and interesting.

Then they could have done another documentary looking at boarding school children sent for a variety of reasons. imo (these things are always so shallow, not really looking at anything in real depth, but they do tug at the heart strings).