His Dark Materials

[AllGoodDogs]

New BBC adaptation, looks so good, can't wait trailer here -

m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10162256439035553&id=683285552&sfnsn=mo

Re: adapting a novel for TV....

DH has been listening to Neil Gaiman podcasts where he's been talking about how the structure of storytelling has to change to fit with the episodic audience experience of a dramatisation. Mini climaxes, developments and resolutions have to be worked into each episode to create a mini journey for viewers along with essential details for the wider story arc. He says an adaptation can never slavishly follow the same structure as a novel as it simply wouldn't satisfy the audience. I found that fascinating; it's not something I'd ever considered before!

Although ... and I’m sorry I can’t quote directly, have forgotten the source, maybe Den of Geek ... I read earlier today that one reason for the inclusion of material from earlier or later books was that because of the restrictions on children’s working hours Lyra couldn’t appear in every scene.

Interesting Little. I suppose something that was written as a serial (eg Dickens) might be easier, but a lot of books don't have that chapter structure.

@SurpriseSparDay ah that's even more intriguing! I'm not bothered if there are different details in the adaptation, as long as the essence of the story is honoured. I think so far so good!

@PolkadotsAndMoonbeams I agree about Dickens, he was so theatrical too. I think he would be a screenwriter if around today.

I wasn’t keen on this episode at all. I found it dragged, with nothing much happening. There was a lot of hanging around, with characters having no real plan. I haven’t read the books for a couple of years but I thought the Gyptians followed Mrs Coulter to the north? She had a very clear plan and was determined and driven and in the books seemed to be acting alone. You really didn’t know till later whose side she was on. In this episode she still seemed to be hanging around in her apartment waiting to be told what to do by the Magisterium.

As for the Gyptian boys breaking into the apartment to steal the plans, I don’t recall that at all. Who was the character who threw himself down the lift shaft rather than get caught? Seemed to be done solely for dramatic effect, which I didn’t care for. We haven’t had time enough to get to know that character enough to be moved by his self-sacrifice. I’m also waiting to see if Tony Makarios/Costa ends up being selparated from his daemon or not, and how it happens.

Ma Costa is growing on me. She is different from my imagination but in a way that’s not detrimental to the character.

Not keen on the Parry introduction so early although I can see why they maybe did it for the TV adaptation.

And yes, where are the witches? Thought they were around by now? I wasn’t sure if I saw a flock of geese following the boats at one point, did anyone else notice?

It is in the book that Benjamin deReuter is mortally wounded while spying and Lyra picks it up on the alethiometer before the news comes back which is how it becomes clear that she can use it without books and years of study.

As for the Gyptian boys breaking into the apartment to steal the plans, I don’t recall that at all. Who was the character who threw himself down the lift shaft rather than get caught?

That was a slight adaptation of an event in the books. The young man who died is Benjamin de Ruyter from book one. When deciding how to tackle the missing children problem, John Faa appoints Benjamin as the spy master and Ben sets about finding out as much about the Gobblers as possible. He leads a group into a Gobbler hideout in which they are ambushed and Ben dies. Lyra almost reads the outcome of the raid on the alethiometer but she is distracted and doesn't realise what she was seeing until after she heard the news about Ben from Tony Costa when he returns from the raid to report Ben's death. They've adapted the situation slightly to involve Mrs Coulter in the scene and made it a breakthrough moment for Lyra with the Alethioneter, for storytelling purposes. It is all based on source material though.

^^ I hope that made sense

The witches don't come into it until after they've been to Trollesund and recruited Lee Scoresby and Iorek Byrnison. They speak to the witch consul in Trollesund but Serafina didn't come along until after. Certainly not before.

Who knows how they'll adapt the timeline for the series though.

Thanks, Tialys, I don’t recall Benjamin at all, how funny!

I'm feeling slightly dim, because until this episode I didn't realise Belacqua was pronounced "Bellakwa". In my head, it was always "Bellacka".

Also it shows what happens to a daemon when their person dies.

I think they showed that scene with Benjamin to highlight the effect of hurting the daemons. He knew his Daemon couldn't escape and that he wouldn't be able to bear seeing his Daemon tortured so killed himself to avoid being forced to tell her what he knew.

And the preponderance of men in the magisterium and colleges I saw as a deliberate decision. It's why Mrs Coulter is so appealing to Lyra, she's a woman with power and a woman who has gone exploring. It has to be unusual in order to draw Lyra in and make her feel that if she becomes like her, then she can do what Mrs Coulter has done.

I'm enjoying it, it's not quite what I expected but it feels like it's been adapted by someone who cares about the source material and wants to do it justice. It will never be the same as the books, but I'm trying not to compare too directly.

The revelation about Grumman being Parry and what means to Will is HUGE for me in the books. Such a big moment. To casually slip it in during this episode has ruined a big moment.

They need to get on and find Iorek.

Even looking at it as just a TV show I'm not enthralled. Undecided on opening titles!

You don’t really learn about who Grumman is in the books until The Subtle Knife. I guess for TV if the only reference was to show a skull and for it not to be him, then not give any background it wouldn’t make much sense to a non book reader.
I’m slowly beginning to accept it isn’t going to be a faithful adaptation, but for good reasons. Lord Boreal is totally different to how I imagined but I actually really like the on screen interpretation.

Still think they could have held back on some of the big reveals though. And it’s a bit slow In places, setting up for what’s happening next.

The revelation about Grumman being Parry and what means to Will is HUGE ...

True. I can accept most of the changes, but it does seem a shame that we won’t set out on Will’s quest with him. It was such an edge of one’s seat strand of the books; I still remember the dawning realisation of who this man was and how they were essentially falling towards each other across worlds and time.

Is there confirmation that there are three seasons of this? Yes there are definitely 3 seasons.

Lot of negative stuff on here ( not read fully as avoiding spoilers) but I am enjoying the series .

I've not read the books but DD has - and is enjoying, the only thing she's said about it is that the monkey is proper sinister in the books but in this he is rather cute.

Isn't there a bit in the books where someone is talking about the (5?) alethiometers in the world and how one in particular is a very beautiful object but Lyra's one is less fancy.

While the revelations from TSK are annoying when watching with a child who has read NL but not the rest of the series I can see how it makes sense. And if you were to begin series 2 with Will without knowing more it would be very confusing. I did love that in the book though.

Lord Beautiful love his new name. I'm really enjoying his depiction actually, the kick of the wheel clamp was far more enjoyable to watch than it should have been.

Yes, the monkey is far more scary in the books.

Is the monkey ever named in the books? I don't remember seeing it but could have missed it. I find it interesting that, as the parents' daemons name the daemon of a child, the monkey must have been at least partly responsible for coming up with Pantalaimon.

Is the monkey ever named in the books?

ALL monkeys are called "Gerroff-me-you-shit-flinging-bastard".

They're nasty . . .

Haha, you sound just like my dad. He's terrified of them. Something to do with a traumatising visit to a travelling circus when he was a boy - he refuses to go into detail.

Lord Boreal still just too beautiful.

I seem to recall that in the books, he is older and not so attractive - he is in a sexual thrall to Mrs Coulter which allows her to manipulate him. Can't see Lord Beautiful falling for that...

It works better IMO for Boreal to be younger and attractive, rather than an old sleaze.