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The Nights Watch: GAME OF THRONES SEASON 8 EPISODE 4. May 6th UK. SPOILERS AFTER 2 am.

804 replies

OneInAMillionYou · 05/05/2019 14:33

Hail survivors of The Battle of Winterfell.

The 'mysterious' episode 4 premieres tonight.

Who will be with us at 2am?

I am desperate to find out if Arya's kill is openly discussed and acknowledged, or does Bran take the credit, or does it remain a mystery.

Given Emilia Clarke has said Episode 5 is the one for which we will need 'bigger television screens' what will lead up to it?

OP posts:
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SweetSummerchild · 07/05/2019 20:06

Books will never make Jon legitimate. They have the fAegon storyline for that. My guess is that Jon will learn his parentage, but that’s it.

CaptainBrickbeard · 07/05/2019 20:07

But would Lyanna have been happy to be an additional wife? It sounds like Rhaegar was rebelling against Targ traditions and if he really loved Lyanna, maybe wanted to marry her and renounce his heritage?

SweetSummerchild · 07/05/2019 20:07

Jon - Another targaryan renouncing his name and going north?

Are you suggesting that Jon could become the next Bloodraven? Now that would be an interesting twist.

NotMyPuppy · 07/05/2019 20:14

Totally agree Jaime has to go to KL - wouldn’t be a proper finale if he was in Winterfell and had no reunion/confrontation with Cersei.

Iambuffy · 07/05/2019 20:14

Maester aemon was a targaryan....

SweetSummerchild · 07/05/2019 20:18

Maester aemon was a targaryan....

Yes, but Jon Snow knows nothing...

I like the Bloodraven idea. Wasn’t he sent to the Wall for kinslaying?

Iambuffy · 07/05/2019 20:19

Hmmmm.....

Ontheboardwalk · 07/05/2019 20:50

The stand off with Dany's and Cersei reminded me of Sansa trying to tell Jon how Ramsey's mind works. He ignored her and lost it and nearly the battle over Rickon. Sansa had to come to the rescue then

I reckon Dany's and possibly Grey Worm will lose it over Missandei and make stupid mistakes

Stark sisters all the way for me

ElenadeClermont · 07/05/2019 20:53

merrymouse Thank you for the Brienne clips.

agirlhasnonameX · 07/05/2019 21:09

I like the Bloodraven idea. Wasn’t he sent to the Wall for kinslaying?
Bloodraven had Aenys Blackfyre executed when he made a claim to the throne. Then when Egg becomes King he sent him to the wall for the murder.

Coolcoolcoolcoolcool · 07/05/2019 22:23

In similar vein I'm now not so keen on Tyrion (sorry!)

Agreed, he pissed me off ever since he murdered Shay. She was a penniless whore doing what she had to do to survive. She sold him out because if she hadn't Cersei would've definitely killed her. As for sleeping with Tywin, that is literally her job.

He annoys me even more in the books because he spends all this time wallowing about killing his father and barely even thinks of Shay.

Coolcoolcoolcoolcool · 07/05/2019 22:31

Sorry this is a few pages back but it makes total sense to me that the wildlings go home now. They're whole thing is that they're the free-folk and don't blindly follow kings/lords like the 'kneelers' south of the wall.
They never knelt to Jon and he still let them through the wall because he knew he needed the troops. They don't owe him anything (I know he died because he let them come south but that was only temporary Grin)

I did wonder if tormund and a few others might freely decide to fight with Jon again, but I can't blame them for deciding against it.

ChanklyBore · 07/05/2019 22:40

So if everything is going full circle, with the mad Targaryen, the pretender, the kingslayer (queenslayer) and the ironborn sent disgraced to the iron islands, etc

How about....Cersei’s baby is claimed by Euron (mirrors the argument around her previous children’s parenthood that started the whole thing) and sent to winterfell as a hostage against the iron islands continued cooperation with the North (ring any bells?)

Next up, Jon has to end up North, somehow. What if the children of the forest or some other lore decide they need protectors now the wall is down. And Jon becomes the next protector of the realms of men (night king 2.0 - or however many there have been!)

birdsandroses · 07/05/2019 23:42

The North bent the knee to the iron throne for 300 years until Baretheon died not very long ago. So why is it so important to Sansa the North maintains being a a separate Kingdom which only began v recently? Is it because under Robb Stark the North men and women got a taste of autonomy again and don’t want to revert to being under the rule of the iron throne?

birdsandroses · 07/05/2019 23:44

Agreed, he pissed me off ever since he murdered Shay.

I hadn’t read the books but in the tv version I thought they filmed it that if Tyrion hadn’t killed Shae she would have killed him meaning he had little choice?

merrymouse · 07/05/2019 23:46

The North bent the knee to the iron throne for 300 years until Baretheon died not very long ago

Same reason any of the countries or regions that make up the UK want independence?

birdsandroses · 07/05/2019 23:53

Merry mouse, fair point. I suppose I didn’t get the feel the North had fiercely disliked being under the Iron Throne anymore than the other Kingdoms since the Targeryns’ conquered Westeros 300 years ago? And under Baretheon they even enjoyed a very good relationship as Ned and Baretheon were such good friends? However, the Iron lands/Greyjoys obviously didn’t like being subjects to the iron throne and rebelled.

itswinetime · 07/05/2019 23:56

They way I see it is the North bent the knee but was largely left alone under the warden of the north up doing basically what they want and being ruled by someone who understood then and how they work. Then their warden (Ned) goes south is betrayed and killed and they think enough is enough! The ruling power don't care about us don't respect us why should we bend the knee that happens as a northern lord (Robb) offers an alternative and the northerners see that and the chance to be ruled by Someone with their best interest at heart. Now they want that.

Sansa in particular has witnessed and seen what power means and what having or not having power leads to. I don't believe she wants to bend the knee to anyone. She wants control and power and the safety that comes with it. Which is why I find her character arch the most believable and one of the ones I'm most invested in. Don't really want her with Tyrion though or any political marriage independent and in control or a true love match and there isn't time to convincingly build option 2 in my opinion.

birdsandroses · 08/05/2019 00:06

Itswinetime, thank you for your thoughts. Your analysis makes sense. I wasn’t taking into account how they murdered Ned Stark.

Coolcoolcoolcoolcool · 08/05/2019 01:03

birdsandroses looks like you're right. Well now I feel silly.

I've only read the books once a few years ago, I've checked the wiki and it says he strangled her, but not if it was self defense or not. I've konmaried my copies of the books so don't know. Sorry.

itswinetime · 08/05/2019 04:43

So I rewatched the episode as I'm nocturnal this week, and I think I'm better able to say what is bugging me about it

  1. character regression. This season we have seen Arya start to return to something more than just an assassin with John and Gendry. I get her training and everything meant she was primed to kill the night king but then she does that and it feels like a massive backwards step to then go back to her list and forget the rest even if she left with john but in her own with the hound it feels like a backwards step. Same goes for Bronn it was a backwards step I felt.

  2. Danny, I get the for shadowing I get it's planting the seeds for the future but what has she done wrong? Ok burning the Tarlly's OTT but it was after they fought against her and refused to bend the knee lots have done similar/worst than her but they are fine she is power hungry and mad? She delayed her quest for the throne to free the slaves and up till now she listened to those who said don't burn kings landing, she saved John and the wildlings at the cost of Viserion without any blame. She abandoned her quest to fight the night king and lost half her army! She even listened 1 when the said again don't but Kings landing and 2 bargain with Cersei for Missandei. But she seems to be put into this box of power hungry and obsessed with the throne above everything. She was wrong to ignore Sansa yes but after the way the North and Sansa have treated her i get it! Maybe she is mad but they haven't given us enough to really buy into that.

  3. John and ghost! I'm hoping there is more to come there but if not Angry but in general he is still that same boy north of the wall who knows nothing! Where is his progression why is he this better option for ruler? He doesn't want the throne he has shown zero ability or interest to get politics all he had was the desire to save the living his done that but they aren't moving him forward.

  4. Cersei she has all her enemies and a dragon in reach of her archers and she doesn't act why?

  5. Bran why is he still here? He serves no purpose a traumatic death would have been better!

I'm not saying it's all bad it isn't I like Sansa's arch, I didn't get Brianne's storyline to start with but what people have said here I can see that. Even Jamie I can see he feels he should go and save or deal with Cersei I get why the free folk went north again!

But in this episode I didn't see characters going full circle alway. I saw a show where they know where the characters end but not so much how they get there! Of course there are 2 episodes left and maybe all will be revealed and I hope we are being misled by certain things but so far season 8 is missing the story telling of previous seasons for me! I will be more than happy to be proven wrong though!

Apologies for the super long post Blush

Mrscog · 08/05/2019 07:04

@itswinetime

One of her drivers for freeing the slaves was to get followers herself, it wasn't a wholly altruistic motive!

She's very young, possibly 19 at the most, and expects to be able to swoop in to a land she knows little of, failing to take in to account much of it's history, or politics and expects people to blindly follow her. She's being very naive! And anyone sensible would allow an army to rest a few days after a massive battle before marching them 1000 miles to fight another war. Especially someone who believed so strongly in human rights! Surely if she was so keen on freedom, it wouldn't be bend the knee or die? It would be follow me if you want to.

Although I also think Sansa was badly portayed in the TV show - she would be playing a savvier game than openly disagreeing with the Queen.

Iambuffy · 08/05/2019 07:55

I think so chankly

RJnomore1 · 08/05/2019 08:00

Dany: main failings that I can see are being young and being pretty and being female and acting like a male conqueror - not afraid to refuse to show mercy.

SweetSummerchild · 08/05/2019 08:58

^Dany rode close beside him. "Still," she said, "the common people are waiting for him. Magister Illyrio says they are sewing dragon banners and praying for Viserys to return from across the narrow sea to free them."

"The common people pray for rain, healthy children, and a summer that never ends," Ser Jorah told her. "It is no matter to them if the high lords play their game of thrones, so long as they are left in peace." He gave a shrug. "They never are."

Dany rode along quietly for a time, working his words like a puzzle box. It went against everything that Viserys had ever told her to think that the people could care so little whether a true king or a usurper reigned over them. Yet the more she thought on Jorah's words, the more they rang of truth.^

This is from Daenerys’ third chapter in the books series - so very early on. She had bought into her brother’s fantasies that the seven kingdoms were desperate for the return of the dragons all her life. There are flashes of moments in the books (such as this one) where she questions whether this is truly her ‘destiny’ but she stubbornly holds onto this idea throughout the series.

It’s a great tragedy, really. She built up a huge following in Essos based on what she had achieved to the extent that she reached god-like status, but she’s going to chuck it all away on this abstract notion of her divine destiny to sit the iron throne.

She made a comment that her destiny was to overthrow tyranny whatever the cost. The cost will be her becoming a tyrant.

A young, inexperienced ruler with natural human failings should never have that much raw power of destruction at their disposal. Yes, it can be used to destroy ‘evil’, but at what cost?