SCD18#10 - The scores are in...and it's Fireworks

[Myimaginarycathasfleas]

New thread when you're ready..

I feel sorry for Ranj. He improved this week and he clearly loved it. Janette spoke very well about him – his amazing real-life job and the spirit of Strictly he epitomises. I sometimes don't think I like her much, but that was very classy.

Charles is earnest and boring but I feel terrible for him. It must just be soul-crushing to be almost permanently in the DO. Karen looked so sad. I LIKE her and think she's genuinely funny and lively rather than attention-seeking. I loved her comment that she's going to name her first child Twenty-Five

Whisky, when the judges say "the most improvement was from dancer..." in the DO, they mean who's improved the most from the first time they did their dance.

Funny how when the series started everyone was praying Charles would leave-now everyone seems to want him to stay!!

I would be delighted for him to be knocked out - if it was on merit!

But it isn't - it's very unfair and I don't like to see anyone picked on - even a sleaze. I think this may have given him a shock. As you say, he's reined in the letching - maybe he had no idea how off-putting it was. Perhaps he thought he was being charming. He may come out of this a better man altogether (or nursing a burning hatred for all of humanity . . . )

or nursing a burning hatred for all of humanity I suspect it will be this. I can see it in his eyes.

I had never heard of Charles before and I don't find him at all attractive. I do feel sorry for him though because it must be awful to realise you are not popular with the public.

I thought Casualty (or is it Holby he is in?) was a popular show? Last year Joe was supposedly getting a lot of support from viewers of whichever show he was in.

I would think this, more than the supposed Strictly curse, is a reason some celebs are reluctant to do the show. I doubt many want to find out how popular or unpopular they are with the public let alone have the public see that too.

He is terrible in Casualty.

I think the general public like someone who is a good dancer without experience. Charles should be the perfect candidate for that but sometimes comes across as just a bit weird.

All that stuff about his dad seemed a bit misplaced. His constant humble bowing of his grateful head just seems a bit fake.

I really like Karen. She really is the most fluid beautiful dancer. Really like how she and Kevin haven’t dragged their personal life on to the show, they seem to be very at ease and normal with each other

All that stuff about his dad seemed a bit misplaced. I thought Graeme's grandparents nonsense was equally nauseating.

i thought Graeme's grandparents nonsense was equally nauseating.

Indeed. In fact anyone’s grandparents who are inevitably wheeled out to the sounds of “we’ll meet again don’t know where don’t know when” to go on about how bleedin’ proud they are of the young scamp who’d displayed zero interest in dancing ever before

But should the DO be judged on who has improved the most since they danced it that afternoon or who danced the best dance? I think the latter but Craig clearly thinks the former...

Choccy, if someone danced the best dance it might well be BECAUSE they've improved the most since they danced it that afternoon...

I do think the criteria for the DO are muddy. Sometimes in the past the judges have clearly voted to keep in the person who they feel has the most talent/potential, even if their DO performance wasn't great. Other times they do seem to go purely for the best performance.

But that's another conversation. I was just answering Whisky's point about the use of the term 'improvement'.

I don't think improvement should have anything to do with the Dance-off criteria: it has to be purely the dance itself, and indeed that is how they normally do it. There are times when someone really good is in the dance-off, and realistically if they got 9s all the way first time round there's not that much they can do to improve. By contrast, the likes of Ann Widdecombe could have improved 100% and still be absolutely terrible.

It’s improvement in the sense that they’ve improved ahead of the other dancer in the dance off

Ie on live day, Charles was better than Ranj
But in dance off, Ranj had improved so much that he was better than Charles so got Craig’s vote

By contrast, the likes of Ann Widdecombe could have improved 100% and still be absolutely terrible. I never watched Strictly in those days.
Just watched Ann and Anton on youtube. So funny.

There are times when someone really good is in the dance-off, and realistically if they got 9s all the way first time round there's not that much they can do to improve.

No, so in that scenario they'd almost certainly be kept in over the other person who got (e.g.) 7s and 6s. UNLESS the other person was, say, Danny JJ doing that quickstep again and on the right foot this time. He'd probably have got 9s and maybe a 10 or two if he'd done it right in the first performance, so if he got it right in the DO he'd be kept in.

That's exactly my point, really, DarlingNikita. If they were being marked solely on the extent to which they've improved, then (for instance) if it had been Ashley v DJ in the dance-off and DJJ got his timing right, Ashley would have to go because at best she could only improve by one mark whereas DJJ might improve by ten.

But improvement isn't the main criteria. It is often commented on if they made a hash of it the first time round, or changed something on the basis of the judges feedback, but it is simply - out of the 2 dances that were danced on the dance off, which was the better one.

Again, that's exactly my point, Alaskan. This discussion arises from the fact that Craig said he based his decision on the one who had improved most.

out of the 2 dances that were danced on the dance off, which was the better one.

Is it though? Do they actually say "which is the best" or is it "who do you want to see go through"? They are different questions.

Miscible, I don't think it's solely about improvement. I'd imagine in that case they'd think about how well Danny did, objectively, in the DO, and how much more improvement/potential he has compared to Ashley.

I think Craig weighed up a lot of factors and because the two dancers were so close in so many aspects, had to use as his casting decision the differing levels of improvement.

And Soup makes a good point: while I like/try to think that the judges decide purely on objective professional grounds, I suspect that personal biases sometimes come into it. Not to mention we don't know what influence the producers have.

I was inspired today to watch this: a Karen-choreographed VW to 'Piano Man'.

Last year Joe was supposedly getting a lot of support from viewers of whichever show he was in.

Ah - but Joe’s masterstroke was getting killed off in his show (Holby City) half way through his time on Strictly. The minute that episode of the show went out, I knew he’d win Strictly.

Charles’ character is not only still boringly alive in Casualty, he hasn’t even been in the last two or three episodes, thus all the viewers have forgotten who he is.

Shecamefrom

That Youtube clip was LOVELY!

Proper dancing really is better than all of this showy crap, isn't it?

SheCame, yes, I thought of that when they used that song this weekend. That VW was gorgeous, as was Karen's frock. God I miss Karen.

I was inspired today to watch this: a Karen-choreographed VW to 'Piano Man'.

Oh, thank you for posting that, SheCame. Mark and Karen are one of my favourite Strictly couples of all time, and that VW was a classic. I watched to the end of the judging - Craig and Bruno look a lot younger and you really see how they've become caricatures of their earlier selves!

Oh no! The Pasha / Bob Mortimer comparison just ruined Pasha for me entirely. I suspect I will enjoy Pashley’s next dance a lot less now!