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The Handmaid's Tale Vol 3

574 replies

CruCru · 24/07/2017 21:18

Hi all

As the last thread has all but totally filled up, I've started this new one.

Bit shallow - but do you think the Wives are allowed cosmetics? I got the impression that make up is banned but they do all look very polished.

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MsPassepartout · 03/08/2017 11:21

In the episode where the first Ofglen is tried, she's referred to as handmaid 8000 and something. So nationwide there's far more handmaids than we've seen. Not sure how big Gilead is though.

One thing that did surprise me about the last episode - when June is taken away at the end, Serena Joy's protesting loudly about June being taken, the commander's demanding to know what's going on etc - but no one's said once to the men taking June that June's pregnant.

Given how roughly we've seen hamdmaids being treated, and given how keen Serena Joy seems on having a baby via June, you'd think they'd at least have mentioned June's pregnancy to try and ensure that the safety of "their" baby isn't jeopardised.

AnneLovesGilbert · 03/08/2017 12:31

I thought the same MsPassepartout but I wonder if they only knew because Serena has smuggled a HPT in.

Having said that, I don't know how public the handmaid's cycles are, so given the circumstances "stop, she's pregnant" would have done the job. Which Serena did do when June was getting tasered, and it then turned out she wasn't.

AnneLovesGilbert · 03/08/2017 12:32

Also, what the hell was Serena doing telling Fred the baby wasn't his? Wanting to hurt him, while not really risking anything as he needs the baby as much as everyone does so wouldn't tell anyone, maybe.

woodhill · 03/08/2017 12:39

A relative of mine lives in Boston and thinks the district where the handmaids and families are is Cambridge, Boston which is the other side of the river.

I missed the bit when Serena told Fred it wasn't his baby?

NameChange30 · 03/08/2017 12:40

I was really shocked when Serena told Fred the baby isn't his. I got the impression she was saying it to hurt him, but surely she was putting both June and the baby at huge risk by telling him?!

AnneLovesGilbert · 03/08/2017 12:44

She was sitting at his desk when he came in, asked to play scrabble, he said he had a call, she said June was pregnant, can't remember what he said, and then she said "it's not yours, you don't deserve a baby, you're weak" (I paraphrase) and stormed out.

Given it was her idea to get Nick involved she took an enormous risk endangering June, Nick, June, potentially Fred and the baby.

AnneLovesGilbert · 03/08/2017 12:45

A question I had, why was he blaming Serena for his trips to jezebel's? They don't have a sexual relationship do they, so not as though she was refusing and he was getting his kicks elsewhere. Nothing had changed between them from what I saw so why was it her fault?

ElenaGreco123 · 03/08/2017 12:49

After Serena's successful presentation of the Handmaid's to the Mexican ambassador, Fred and Serena had sex on her initiative. That one occasion seems to excuse Fred of all his failings and hypocrisy.

AnneLovesGilbert · 03/08/2017 13:46

I'd forgotten that. I do remember flashbacks to them before, which might have been why.

I'm being dim, but is it the case that as they can't conceive and under the regime sex is only for procreation (barring the hypocrites who frequent Jezebel's) sex between even husbands and wives is forbidden? Therefore she tempted him and he couldn't control himself and had to keep sinning. Chump.

ElenaGreco123 · 03/08/2017 13:48

He was running before with the previous Offred, wasn't he? I am sure it was Serena's fault as well.

ElenaGreco123 · 03/08/2017 13:48

I mean sinning, not running.

AnneLovesGilbert · 03/08/2017 14:06

He was. And between them they fucked her up so badly she had no choice but to hang herself Sad Serena said she'd warned him while they wheeled her body away in the flashback didn't she.

Poor old Fred. No impulse control. Ruled entirely by his urges Hmm

MsPassepartout · 03/08/2017 14:08

is it the case that as they can't conceive and under the regime sex is only for procreation (barring the hypocrites who frequent Jezebel's) sex between even husbands and wives is forbidden?

I wouldn't have thought so. IIRC, there's biblical precedent of women who were believed to be barren bearing a child in their old age (such as Abraham's wife Sarah, and the mother of John the Baptist). Even Rachel, who they refer to during their raping handmaids ceremony, went on to eventually conceive and bear 2 sons to Jacob.
So you'd think a religious regime like that would allow marital sex in case of similar miracles.

AnneLovesGilbert · 03/08/2017 14:18

I didn't know that about Rachel! That's interesting. So then why was she to blame for anything by sleeping with her husband?

Original poster
CruCru · 03/08/2017 14:29

I assumed that the reason Aunt Lydia stopped the guard from attacking Offred / June at the stoning was that she knew she was pregnant. Presumably Serena had to inform her / the authorities as soon as they found out.

Therefore the guards taking June / Offred away would already know - it would be on her file.

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ElenaGreco123 · 03/08/2017 14:41

MsPassepartout It just proves that the whole system is about male power and control, not procreation.

LotisBlue · 03/08/2017 15:13

I thought that Serena told Fred the baby wasn't his to hurt him, but also to show him that he isn't as all powerful as he thinks, and to turn him against June (because she is jealous of their relationship).
I think that he can't do anything with the information - if June is arrested then she will presumably tell them about their unofficial relationship, trips to jezebels etc. I also suspect that he knows that he is infertile, so he would have had his suspicions anyway - the baby would have to be a miracle, or someone else's.

ElenaGreco123 · 03/08/2017 15:20

When he congratulated Offred on her pregnancy, it looked to me Fred knew he was infertile.

AnneLovesGilbert · 03/08/2017 15:49

I was wondering that Cru, but when Janine was pregnant she was kept away from the salvaging and I was waiting for one of the others to congratulate Offred or Aunt Lydia to tell her to stay away from the stoning.

But as no one did and no one outside of the house knew I assumed it wasn't public knowledge.

Original poster
CruCru · 03/08/2017 16:32

The previous salvaging was more physical - the Handmaid's went in there and ripped him up. It's not such hard work to throw one stone.

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MsPassepartout · 03/08/2017 16:46

when Janine was pregnant she was kept away from the salvaging

Do you mean the particicution where the handmaids beat the rapist to death?
With the particicution, they all piled into a big melee with fists and kicking feet everywhere. Easy for a pregnant handmaid to be accidentally elbowed in the stomach or otherwise accidentally hurt there.

Whereas in the stoning, they were all stood in a circle with Janine in the middle. It'd be tricky to accidentally throw your rock at another handmaid in the circle at the stoning, and I suppose the authorities would think it unlikely that a handmaid would deliberately throw a rock at a handmaid other than the one in the centre of the circle.

So anyway, I wouldn't have thought that being in the early stages of pregnancy would be considered a compelling reason for them to stop Offred participating, as her participating would be unlikely to harm her baby. And I'm sure that Aunt Lydia could have instructed the guards to remove Offred gently because she's pregnant.

It looked more like Aunt Lydia had no idea what to do, so told them to go home to avoid some sort of riot, and to get some breathing space she or her superiors figured out how to squash their rebellious behaviour.

morningtoncrescent62 · 03/08/2017 17:02

It looked more like Aunt Lydia had no idea what to do, so told them to go home to avoid some sort of riot, and to get some breathing space she or her superiors figured out how to squash their rebellious behaviour.

Yes, that's how I saw it too. And I thought Aunt Lydia told the guards to back off not because she knew June was pregnant (I don't think she knew) but because a) she's very jealous of the power she has over the handmaids and doesn't want it usurped, and b) she's fond of all of 'her girls' in a warped way, and I think June/Offred is one of her favourites - like Janine, Aunt Lydia tamed June, and there did seem to be a bond between them in the penultimate episode, when June was willing to publicly ask how Janine was, and then later on when Aunt Lydia sends for her and pleads with her to save the child.

LotisBlue · 03/08/2017 17:13

I think that Fred must know he is infertile, how would Serena know if he didn't? I guess they had investigations done in the past (before gilead) and they found out then.

I do wonder why Serena doesn't just shag nick herself, then claim it as a miracle

Original poster
CruCru · 03/08/2017 17:59

Fred also, more or less told June that he wouldn't protect her daughter. After she asked him to, he asked her if the child was his. He knew it wasn't.

He'll protect himself before he protects Hannah. Particularly as this child isn't his.

I thought that Serena really was infertile.

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girlsnames · 03/08/2017 19:13

I thought the handmaids went to the Drs for pregnancy test monthly. I assumed that this time had not come yet, Serena can't tell aunt Lydia or the eyes that she is pregnant as it will hi-light that she was involved with contraband.