SCD#3

[Fiderer]

Thought about mentioning Halloween Hell in the title but it's a Sunday morning and some of us may be feeling delicate enough.

Legs googke both

Just did MrsJ

Lots about shoulders and chests. And "... also styles created and named by prominent tango figures in the Tango world, such as Todaro style, Pulpo style, Gavito's Style" which makes me think it's like ordering coffee today and just wanting that, not a doublefrothwhipalmondskinnytall-thing.

Am dim and not much wiser. This is why I want a succinct "Wot this dance is all abaht" bit from the judges.

I wikied Argentine Tango they take it very seriously

The Waltz vs Viennese Waltz is easier. The Google tells me the VW is 4 times faster. Stuff about bars and beats but so far, so comprehensible.

The vienesse waltz is lovely very swishy and twirly (technical terms)

I wikied Argentine Tango they take it very seriously

I have no idea why but the above made me giggle :)

I too don't know anything about dance - I often wonder which of the pros are good. I mean obviously they're all good but some must be better than others. Would quite like the judges to critique the pros but can see that might lead to a high turnover!

Why is James Jordan so unpopular? I get all the calendar stuff but it seems he was widely disliked before that?

I never used to think that Anton was as bad as he is but with a good sleb he's been shown up something rotten!

I think that Natalie is the best female pro perhaps because she has the height, dances beautifully and is sensitive to the needs of the slebs. That is the most important aspect of the pros IMO.

JJ has a bad reputation!!!! Someone who's watched it before I started will be able to answer better than me Juan.

I do too. Wonder about the pros I mean. A while ago, it may have been in the dark Alesha days, there was a bit on ITT where the judges would critique the choreography.

I loathed her but I enjoyed learning about the dos & don'ts.

Here you go:

A striking difference between Argentine tango and ballroom tango is in the shape and feel of the embrace. Ballroom technique dictates that partners arch their upper bodies away from each other, while maintaining contact at the hip, in an offset frame

Simple

But This article seems to explain it in relatively simple terms.

I think the AT is smoother and bouncier (rather than stop-start), they tangle their legs a bit and gurn less [explanation according to Maryz]

I love that I read that in ballroom tango (or is it AT?) the woman holds her head away from the male armpit because it was originally danced by smelly cowboys\guachos or something

About the pros - I've been watching this for years with very little understandng of the finer points

Originally it was all traditional ballroom and latin. I remember when Brendan came along, and he was much more mobile, he'd move with the music, relax a lot more, the choreography was much more varied and interesting. Then all the eastern European dancers arrived with again more varied and non-traditional moves.

Now the younger contingent (Kevin and Janette for example) have relaxed it even more. You can still see the traditional steps, but the choreography, the music, the costumes are all much more contemporary and cross the genres a bit, so the traditional bit of the dances seems to be mostly in the steps - the rest is much more variable, if that makes sense.

Of course the addition of the Charleston, and the fact that there are some quick dances in every show (jive, quickstep, etc) has made it much more interesting for those of us who know very little about the right way to dance. We just like the "show".

Its so true about Anton. His cha cha routine for Katie was such utter rubbish. He seemed to take the criticism on the chin but then came out with a crap salsa this week! He just cannot do Latin and is openly disparaging of all the Latin dances. Such a shame for Katie, she's really doing well and deserves a better partner.

Hi Lotta What did you think about the lifts that Anton attempted to do with poor Katie? They were terrible I thought.

TheAnimated I remember Come Dancing (old gimmer emoticom) where the pros\contestants danced in formation; think a V formation of waltzing marshmallows , it was sometimes hilarious

I don't know why Anton can't get some help with the latin choreography and technique. They have help with stuff like the charleston and the AT from experts - someone who has already gone out of the competition could work with him. Ola could lend a hand - she's not doing anything (apart from watching James pimping her calendar round the internet)

Anton was clumsy with her and I felt cross that HE was not picked up on his errors. Judges seemed to be pussyfooting round him....

I guess then that when Strictly first started it was sort of Come Dancing glammed up to appeal to a wider public? And gradually over the years more dances, and different, more contemporary styles, have been incorporated? How many pros and couples were there in the first series?

Criticism of Anton and his latin dancing seems pretty widespread. How does he get away with it I wonder - has he been there since the beginning?

Yes true about the judges ScentedJasmine they're weird

With the absence of the waltzing marshmallows and gauchos' armpits, no wonder the show is such a hit now

You're v philosophical, MZed. And you're right, I've been flinging blame at the BBC producers but the dancers and the dahhhnce evolve too.

(I was flinging "balm" at them to start with but, although that would be soothing for them, I'm not of a mind to soothe them, what with Tess being still there & all)

ppeatfruit my abiding memory as a small child and seeing those formation dances on the original Come Dancing was those awful dresses, all that frou frou lace making the skirt stick out and then two spindly legs from the knee down out of the bottom - they looked like chickens about to lay an egg and, of course, the immortal line 'she sewed all the sequins on herself'..

For those asking about the differences between Ballroom and Argentine Tango, my take on it is that Ballroom is more formal and structured whereas Argentine is more free-flowing but incorporates more intricate footwork and lifts. The hold is also very different.

Perhaps some other lovely poster could link some examples.

IIW Katie I'd've kicked him in the goolies !!!! She's very too sweet natured.

Yes I agree ppeatfruit - terrible lifts, total cringe. Why set her up to do ridiculous things like that - just give her a proper flaming salsa routine, you donut!

Yes Juan, I've watched SCD since the very beginning (god help me) and Anton's Latin has indeed always been crap. His professional partner Erin was the same - a goddess at ballroom, really not very hot on Latin. All the other pros seem to be fab at both and use really interesting and inventive choreography. Maybe time for Anton to be moved on? Mind you, no idea how he survived the racist language incident with Laila Rouass a few years ago - he probably should have gone then.....

MrsJayy PA has also got a peculiar head.

Anton and Brendan have been at Strictly since it started, Brendan won the first series with Natasha Kaplinsky.

The way to look at Argentine Tango and Ballroom Tango is that BT is a "sanitised" version of the AT. When the AT first arrived in Europe it was scandalous so the more shocking aspects (close hold, leg decorations, etc) were done away with to create the more formal BT we recognise today.

Remember the Waltz was considered a scandal when it first appeared, so can you imagine the reaction to the AT - a dance born out of the brothels of Buenos Aires!

With regards to the pro dancers, I think it's a shame they moved so far away from the traditional roots. When they first started all the pros were current competitors on the UK circuit and all were well known within the ballroom/latin world. Now, most of them either come from a stage type background or are those that couldn't cut it at the top level in this country (Kevin and Ola for example).

Joanne is probably the only pro involved that comes from a true ballroom/Latin background in that she was competing until very recently (end 2013 I think). Even Brendan and Anton, who were masters in their day, haven't competed in a very long time.