Happy Valley, same writer as Scott and Bailey [Poss spoilers - added by MNHQ]

[MorrisZapp]

I thought it was brilliant, although some generational shifts confused me. The lead character played by Sarah Lancashire had a grandson but didn't look old enough.

The company boss had been friends with the accountant's father, that didn't add up did it? Or did I get that wrong.

Great to see the George Costigan and Siobhan Finneran reunited although not onscreen together.

Brilliant writing and simply superb acting I thought, anybody else enjoy it?

If you've just given us a huge spoiler for tonight I'm going to be fucked off Cate. Bog off, would you.

I love autocorrect.

Voile nice

Jane Austen anyone?

I don't think Cate has given any spoilers and I also don't think there is any need to be rude to her or to anyone else. Just Saying....

Cate, you are choosing to put a victim spin on the plot lives of the women:

Catherine chose to raise her grandchild rather than abandon the child to appease her husband. A victim would please the man, not herself. She stands up to the dodgy councillor. A victim would give in to his threats.

Clare has overcome her heroin addiction. Not victim behaviour.

Kev (male) and his father (male) were the victims of Nev's family's shenanigans which meant Kev's family who part invented whatever it is that Nevisons' make do not own the company but are mere employees. It is his victimisation that triggers the whole story.

Kev and Nev are both carers for their disabled or ill wives. Often it is the carer who is seen as the victim, trapped in the monotony of care work. Being ill doesn't make you a victim.

I'm a mother of Sons, I would have been equally upset by scenes of a kidnapped boy and any further abuse.

The boy/ girl debate is irrelevant in a situation where psychopaths are running the show.

Sally writes from a woman's view , we root for the woman as viewer's, we'd do the same for a male captive, agreed?

Why would a male victim make it more agreeable to watch on telly?

If she hadn't I apologise unreservedly.

I am in a grump.

a male victim would NOT make it more agreeable to watch on telly. Just less bloody predictable IMHO

Yes, stop with the fuck offs and bog offs; I'm entitled to give my opinion on a TV programme, the writer and MN's reactions to it. And, I didn't give a spoiler as I have no idea what happens.

I think a male victim would have completely changed the perspective of the last five minutes of episode 4. What you had in that scene was a show of women's strength and solidarity, the dynamic if it had been a male victim fighting back and "rescuing" would have been totally different.

My guess isit wouldn't be so compelling to the majority of people to have a terrified young man sodomised and drugged for your viewing pleasure.

I doubt it. That would be such an unusual story so would make the entire series even more compelling than what it is at the moment.

Damn Damn DP gone to loo and we're on hold. She has to live?

Argh - another week to go!

I guessed the twist about Tommy but then when he talked about his son I thought I was mistaken and that he was going to die after being killed by Lewis but no.

Still predicting Cath to kill him next week.

Tommy is gna kidnap ryan isnt he

In the words of my mum he is an evil bastard.

Cant wait for next week. Hope catherine gets him.

There was violence towards men in it tonight. That should satisfy the ones complaining about violence towards women.

Berating us for watching an incredibly well written drama is a bit much. Maybe we should watch Teletubbies. No doubt there'd be something wrong with that too.

Next weeks episode is going to go off like a barrel full of fireworks. I felt it was almost more mellow this evening in comparison. TLR why the F* is he not dead? How can he still walk around and manage to kill someone else when he has lost so much or appeared to lose so much blood? Once again I'm left waiting in anticipation for the final episode.

I'm guessing he wasn't as injured as he made out...

It really is not a Happy Valley is it?

Gripping tonight.

Tommy is so sadistic and devoid of any decency.....dread to think how next week will end.

Not sure I can bear to watch it next week

I think the cellar scene said so much.
Women saving the life of another. It really got to me.

Yes, me too.

I'd disagree that all the women are shown as victims - I think it realistically shows (in a pretty unrealistic, fictional scenario) women being strong against the crap that some women have to deal with. The violence from men.

I do agree with posters that gratuitous violence against women is dished up on a daily basis as 'titillation' for viewers - CSI, The Fall and so on - but I don't agree that this is an example of it. This is too 'real' to be titillation - I was genuinely shaken after last week's episode. I was shaken by the sheer reality of a strong, violent man being able to overcome easily 3 women in that house. And then escape.

This week's episode alluded to male rape in prison, as well as a very graphic scene of male on male murder. And it was every bit as gripping. Was it gratuitously violent? Maybe. But it could have gratuitously shown the rape in the cellar, and it didn't.

The point about the policewoman who was killed was that she was killed not because she was a woman, but because she was a police officer. That makes her a victim, but not someone singled out to be a victim because she is female.

I really don't think this programme is going in for violence-as-titillation at all. If it were, it would have been much more graphic about the rape which ultimately we were left to infer. Certainly the violence against both policewomen is no different from what we have seen depicted against men on a regular basis on cop shows and the like.