The White Queen

[ShadeofViolet]

Anyone else ridiculously excited?

I know Philippa Gregory's books tend to be a bit Barbara Cartland in places, and I hope the BBC havent increased it, but I still cannot wait to watch it.

Henry VII later executed Isabel's son, and Henry VIII executed her daughter (who was an old lady by then).

I am loving Margaret Beaufort. And Richard III.

Margaret is getting a better character each week. I thought she was great when she was sending her man off to find her a new husband
I think the actor playing Richard is actually starting to get pretty good now as well. The series has definitely improved from the start.

It seems as if MB is being set up as the one behind the Princes' deaths, doesn't it?

Her husband said something like "Henry would have to walk behind/past 5 coffins..."

And it was as if she thought-oh!-only 5, well that's doable!

What I forgot to ask-is there any truth in Richardlll wanting to marry his niece?

As surely for that he would be in the same position as Henry-needed edward lVs children to be legitimate and therefore the Princes dead?

Hmm....yes Richard...worth watching just for him. Very pretty...

It is amazing, the dispensations they were allowed.
Later on, when Henry VIII was wondering what to do about the succession, the Pope suggested he should marry his illegitimate son Fitzroy to the Princess Mary

Was it acceptable though ? In terms of would the average person at the time have thought that it was ok for an uncle to marry his niece ?

In the books they show Elizabeth's daughter returning Richards feelings ;wonder how they will show it on the series.

Tunip - that is crazy!

was Isabel's daughter margaret pole?

Sorry-for pp I meant illegitimate.

Would he have married her without making her legitimate (& therefore the Princes also)

Of course, he may not have killed them, but there seems to be little evidence of him being outraged/trying to find out what had happened?

Of course, times were different then.

EdwardlV seemingly did nothing after Neville executed his wife's father & brother!

And women on here are told to LTb for much less!

Yes Isabel's daughter was Margaret Pole - I looked it up because I noticed they referred to her name as Margaret in a signficant and meaningful way

Ellisisland - I would love to know. They would certainly be used to rich people getting dispensations from other religious things, eg Lenten fasting, so perhaps they would see it in those terms?
I think their lives would have been so remote from the royals they probably wouldn't have cared much.

This is brilliant: Twelve rules for writing about the house of Lancaster

So Henry V11 AND V111 did away with Isabel's children to keep the throne. Why wouldn't they have done away with the princes as well? Much easier as no-one would find out whereas Isabel's grown up children were publicly executed.
PG defo thinks it's MB though.
In the red queen she has MB thinking she is Joan of Arc reincarnated (or summat like that ).

It was so much darker this week. George going mental, to finish up in a vat of wine. When Duchess Cecily was hanging on to Edward IV's leg she said my precious son - made me think of Gollum and the ring in The Hobbit . They aren't good at showing how much time has passed, Richard going from nice to a bit dark was too much of a change in one programme.

So Edward IV dies next Sunday - should be interesting. Should make Margaret B happy.

I am liking it more now its got darker. I am really interested to see how they will deal with Richard and his niece though.

he does marry his niece in PG's book though doesn't he?

No he doesn't, Elizabeth calls her home I think.

oh okay thanks confuddled...he wants to marry her though does he?

Yes he does and she returns his feelings.

Just a heads up - the Amazon Kindle sale has started, and there are several Philippa Gregory books on it, plus the Rosemary Hawley Jarman books about the same period that LaQueen recommended earlier.

The reasons for the execution of Isabella's children were a bit more complicated than 'to keep the throne' - there were accusations of treason and alleged involvement in plots in both cases (the Perkin Warbeck plot in Edward's case and Cardinal Pole's Catholic conspiracy in Margaret's). If it had just been a matter of getting rid of anyone descended from the Plantagenets, then Isabella's younger son, Geoffrey Pole would have been executed too - instead he was pardoned and went on to have 5 sons.