Right I need some strategies ds1 is driving me..

[Beetroot]

1. He is 14 in year 10 start of GCSE year

1. expects to do what ever he wants when ever he wants

1. Wants to play on xbox, talk to mates, eat shit

1. Lies about homework

1. Wants to do homework with msn on

1. Rushes homework

1. Is rude

1. Changed - just not interested in being interested IYKWIM

1. Leaves his stuff everywhere

How do I stop having a go at him all the time but also don't let him get away with being a selfish git?

We have always done homework on sunday mornings but tbh this year am thinking of getting him to do a bit each night as sometimes our whole sunday was ruined with the homework dominating everything.

The rule here is h/w gets done on the night it's given out. That way it's fresh in his mind.

The only exception is Friday nights, he's allowed to do that on Saturday mornings.

Previously, he'd let it stack up then the whole weekend would be me nagging him to do it, & him being faced with a massive mountain (he typically gets 1.5 hours every night).

I love your thing about keeping the XBox controller in a locked filing cabinet, Mumblechum. I think that's definitely in our future.
I don't have teens yet, so am unqualified to otherwise comment, although we already have a problem with my 8yo DS leaving socks everywhere.
Must admit I would probably give up on the homework completely if I were in Beety's situation. I never did homework until I nearly failed a class (I was 14, too!!), and suddenly I realised I had to make an effort at school after all -- flunking out was just too embarrassing a prospect. I became a top student very quickly after that.
My parents who rarely agreed on anything both said that age 14 was the worst for a parent.

Is he too self-centred to agree to the following: two set days a week he doesn't buy pop/sweets, but instead will not buy after school junk, and will sit down and eat a proper meal with the family in the evenings? You can even let him have some choice in what meal is. In return, you won't ask him about what he eats on other days? It's better than nothing, perhaps?

Interesting today

Called from work and asked ds to put dinner on and I would be back in 20 mins.

Came in he had not bothered apart form bare minumum

called twice

went up turned xbox off at mains to loads of how dare you we are in themiddle of a match lalalalalala.

told him no more xbox

he came helped, and ate adn chatted.

taken his school bag to do homework now

So although I am laying off, I also expect him to do as I ask.

He does eat with the family, - just sometimes he has stuffed himself with sugar so is not as hungry as he should.

He is a good kid, just finding his boundaries after a regimented regime at choir (extra 21 hours on top of school per week) and we are finding our feet with a child who has opinions.

Beety - I haven't read all of this. Of what I have read, particualrly girlnextdoor's posts have me nodding my head.

My mantra is 'pick your battles' if it's not illegal, immoral or annoying the neighbours I don't nag. I tend to withdraw labour to make a point - stop giving lifts, stop cooking and only enter their rooms if absolutely necessary. If they have no clothes to wear or damp beds from dumped wet towels then tis tough. I have been known to lose the plot occasionally and dump any left out items (including dirty plates) in their beds. Sounds peevish but sometimes serious action is needed.

As you say he's basically a good kid - just testing a bit as they do at that age and being the centre of their own universe.

He'll be back from the wilderness around 18 or so.

Have you thought that in 4 short years, your ds will be able to do exactly as he pleases anyway, and you will legally have absolutely no control whatsoever!!
Trouble with nagging and being on their case too much is a) they will really start to resent you - they may go along with what you say but will probably leave home at 18 and never want to come home! and b) it doesnt encourage real independence c) they may just learn to lie to cover up what they've done/havent done, which IMO is the worst thing of all. GND gives some very good advice. At some point, you arent going to be there to cook dinner, wash clothes and monitor the homework. I'm sure lots of us have come across people at university who had sailed through school, achieved high grades and then screwed up at uni because they had absolutely no self regulation skills. they were completely dependant on someone else telling them what to do, when to do it etc. a bright teenager will either IME drift for a while but then knuckle down when they realise they actually need to pass their exams, or as GND says, possibly mess up and have to retake exams, which is a pain but quite frankly not the end of the world, and better to learn the lesson at GCSE or A level not uni, or messing up in their career.
Keep the lines of communication open. it is worrying if he is lying about homework and stuff. my ds drove me mad at this stage, but have to say he never lied, he was always honest about the fact he hadnt done his homework etc! is he afraid to be upfront and honest about things? I think that is the bit to get sorted first. It is a VERY challenging stage though, you have been bringing up a child and suddenly you realise they are on their way to being an adult with their own thoughts and opinions. But of course, its absolutely right that they should be their own person.

am taking it all on board - great advice from many

I agree about just dumping stuff in his room/not washing it.

This is what happens with me. If it's in the washing bin, it'll get washed, parents will ask if I've got stuff, and if I remember, it goes in. If I don't it doesn't. They've stopped nagging about my room, they mention it, but eventually, it gets to my limit of untidy and I clean it myself.

There's only so much messyness a person can take. Just set a rule that if the smell penetrates the door, you have the right to sort it out, to your standard.

I have learnt over the years not to keep going on about homework. Ask him about once a week if his homework is up to date then leave him to it. The school will ler you know if he is behind with course work.
DD1 now 21 and DD2 now 18 used to do homework with msn on. DD2 often seemed behind with coursework and homework. But she got 2 A's and a C in her A levels and DD 1 had a first in her degree. So chatting and doing homework worked out fine in the end.
I cook the same meal for all the family and unless they are going out to eat with friends they have to eat with us.
Don't worry if his room is untidy.

My two are younger so I have the joys of this to come! I noticed that the OP's DS is specialist at a music school though; my nephew,now 20 was too, at Cheethams, and my SIL went through a similar thing in his teens. She was tearing her hair out at times, feeling that her son had this wonderful opportunity (paid for by government grant too!) and that every now and then he was in danger of chucking it away - missing homework and practice, eating junk, not getting enough sleep etc. She came to the conclusion that it was sensible to make a few rules and stick to them consistently, but let other things go, which is pretty much the advice on here. She also said that when you have a kid who is in this type of fairly unusual situation - training for a specialist career - then there are pressures that most kids don't have. Her son had to follow a very structured routine a lot of the time, he had to maintain a level of focus and commitment; his education was amazing in some ways but also a sacrifice - he could not study a lot of subjects because of the big focus on music, and was basically from a young age having to put all his energies into his music which is lovely and will earn him a living but realistically he will never be well off. MY SIL said she knew she just had to cut him a bit of slack.A lot of kids in this type of pressured situation go under - he knew girls at his school with eating disorders, a lot of stress etc. The boys seemed to fare better, which is interesting isnt it? - maybe the more laid back attitude has something going for it! Her DS wasn't the hardest worker, but he did well enough in exams and is now at music college, and having to manage his own life/practice/work balance, so its maybe a good thing that SIL backed off as he got older and expected him to take more responsibility.
Apart from the specific pressures in this case, I'm sure a lot of this is very normal teenage stuff - testing the boundaries, wanting to express his opinions etc. My own kids are still at the stage where I can control homework, meals, going out etc so I know I have it easy right now, but from friends with older kids I can see how hard it gets. I also think you have to take a longer term viewpoint sometimes. When your DS is an adult, you will be glad that he has formed his own opinions, and learned (maybe the hard way, but hopefully without too much fall-out) that HE is ultimately responsible for his life, how he lives it etc. Nothing worse than an adult who hasnt learned to do this and become their own person. I'm sure it will all work out, nearly all teenagers, however horrid, turn out fine!

bump for custy

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Teenagers are pretty vile from about 14/15 and then become human again in about 4 years time.
You have to rethink the parenting thing cos it's totally different at this stage.
Listening is as important as talking.
Have some basic ground rules and then let him decide how he handles the rest. Once they are 18 you have to let them make their own choices anyway, so better that they've had some practice at it. Main thing is not to alienate them or they WON'T come back nice again at 18/19 wanting to spend time with you.
I know teens at specialist music school and agree with the advice about cutting a bit of slack. These kids have a great opportunity but it doesnt come without pressure. As someone else said, it takes a hell of a commitment to put this energy into something which may provide a career but is never going to make them rich (unless they become an international soloist ). It's a great experience but hard work and means missing out on other things, so accept that kids need down time to balance things out.
Bloody hard though innit?

beetroot - I read your posts with lots of sympathy - and no comparable experience (mine are yet to get there and are also girls so possibly totally different). so forgive me if this is idealistic crap/been tried/overall hopeless advice, but, have you tried a sort of team/family approach to everything ie not just ds. what I mean is a collaborative family plan and set of house rules. start off the conversation with asking what each family member wants/needs out of family life - pocket money, clean clothes, lifts to football, family meals, happy family time, respect - and see if it can come together in the form of a list and then have a conversation about what each person needs to contribute so that family life starts to look like that list of needs/wants. it could help him see he's not an island, it could help him see that there's a shed-load of positive stuff he gets out of the family/household, it could help him realise that there's elements of responsbility he has to start taking on board. and by doing it on a family basis it won't be seen as singling him out/nagging. like I say I have no idea if this is remotely helpful...!

I would suggest that fun stuff and money has to wait until after schoolwork and chores are done - and that general conduct is polite.

Agree that conduct should be polite always squeaky. No excuse for rudeness. That's one thing that really grates with me if my kids are rude. As for the fun stuff ... sure, i wouldnt want to let my kids think they can always have the fun stuff and never get on with school work, but there has to be some give and take. I know too many parents who are regimental about homework, making their teens sit down for XX hours before they can do anything else, and it can backfire. The kid will sit there but won't necessarily work to the best of their ability - they will see it as a chore to be ticked off the list rather than learning for its own sake. My ds can be slapdash with homework at times, and doesnt put in the effort I would like him to show, but on the other hand, when he gets a piece of coursework or task which fires him up, he'll go way beyond the minimum, reading around the subject and spending far LONGER than the minimum. I do think if I was on his case all the time about every piece of work then he probably would have a different attitude - he'd get done what he needed but without any joy or genuine interest. Sometimes you gain more by letting go a bit.

I have a DS(15) just started year 11. He was pretty much the same as yours last year, except for the sweet eating, but also a very keen musician. Msn + homework and coursework became a real problem. This year is much better I think because
1 School stepped in and gave him a 1st class rocketing over school work.
2 We asked for work around the house and garden in exchange for pocket money (£20 a month, same as you).
3 We let him have a bit more freedom- camping ( a bit underage at music festival for instance) BBq for mates. So it wasn't all nagging.
4 We stayed friends with him, especially through shared music.

It is not perfect yet, but then neither are we, but it is much better. I think 13/14/14 is a very difficult age to be.

I really don't think MSN and course work is good

Hat - yes we do sort of do that and more so recently

I

Hat am thinking more about what you are saying and I think we do as a family have this. Ds wants to rebel against it - and I think will find a way to rebel whatever we do - isnt that ab out growing up.

It is us managing it that is the issue.

he has been great the last 24 hours

Agree with last post - they will rebel whatever you do, it is the whole notion of family/family values/rules that they are pushing against at this age. Yes it is part of growing up. Think back to how you were yourself - did you want to fit in with the family? Follow family rules? Did you even like your own parents? - probably not much when you were 14/15! Most kids find their parents embarrassing or annoying at that age and rebel against anything you want them to do. Hang on in and don't expect them to see your pov. I made the mistake of thinking with my eldest that if I explained enough times why I wanted/didn't want her to do something then eventually she would see reason - they won't! They will just get seriously fed up with what they see as nagging and being in their face. You have to let them go a bit, keep the communication open and then you'll have a lovely surprise when they morph again into interesting young adults with their own views and opinions!

how about getting him to write what HE thinks are a good set of family rules and use that as a start point for discussion? Draw up a list of headings - homework/tidyness/money/sweets - and he has to say what he thinks? Many teenagers are surprisingly conservative when actually put on the spot!

findtheriver - my own experience of being a teenager was that I rebelled hideously against anything dictatorial (ie school) but not against collaborative stuff in which I genuinely felt I had a stake (ie home). but the situation was different in that it was just me, mum and my 21 year old brother, we were very close and the three of us formed a united front against other stuff going on around us. and it sounds like Beetroot already does the kind of stuff I was suggesting...I am so not looking forward to the teen years...hope mn is still here when it's my turn!

Beetroot I don't actually think msn and course work are good. But D2 used to keep msn on while she was doing cousse work so she could talk to her friends when she was having a break.