Dd16 refusing school. What are her options for work/learning?

[Ketzele]

I fear this is going to be a bit long but Im desperate for advice, so please do read if you think you can help!

I'm a single parent to a dd who has just turned 16. Her older sister is away at uni. Dd has struggled with school from day 1 - main reason originally was her difficulty being away from me (important context is that dd, who is adopted, has significant attachment issues and was also exposed to heroin and alcohol in utero).

In primary school she just about managed through ensuring she always had a key adult she could turn to, but secondary school has been a disaster. Her attendance has never risen above 50%. Her learning has always been way behind.

I firmly believe she has ADHD and processing issues. I have been pushing for CAMHS assessment since Y6 but refused due to (a) her not going to school enough and (b) her attachment issues, which CAMHS say have to be resolved first. This despite the private edpsych report I paid for in Y7 which said definite issues, and a CAMHS assessment for depression, after which the psychologist wrote to her own bosses saying please reconsider refusing to assess this child.

Dd has now decided shes not going back to school for her last year (Y11). She is adamant. And I feel there is little point, at this stage, in keeping going with what we've been doing. I did try to design a solution with dd only attending key sessions at school, supplemented with tutoring/online learning, but dd is refusing to go back at all.

I accept that qualifications are out of the picture for now (she got straight Us in mocks); my concern now is the soft skills of self-discipline, work ethics, responsibility etc, and helping her find her path.

I know she has to be in some kind of education or training till 18. Would she find any apprenticeships at this age? Is she allowed to work part time? Could she, for example, work 4 days pw in social care, then be tutored for Maths and English GCSE on the fifth day?

The good news is that she is great with people - makes friends easily, funny and kind, quite charismatic. Bad news is that she is impulsive, quick to anger, and lives in the moment. She has private therapy for her attachment issues. She has huge mood swings, and often restricts her eating - she is getting very thin.

I am at a loss. Would be grateful for any advice.

Does DD have an EHCP? That will affect the options available.

Is alternative provision in place?

With some exceptions for things like performers, CSA children are not allowed to work during school hours. That applies even if EHE. She could do things like work experience, though.

Hi, do you mean you plan on de registering her from school to home educator? Then no she can get a job at this age , There are rules around child employment including for home educated children, they can not work during what would be school hours and the hours outside of school hours are limited. She would also be unable to start an apprenticeship until she would have officially finished year 11, which is the last Friday in June.

Hi OP
Please have a look at Section 19 which will explain options.
Some students are able
To receive an EOTAS package etc

I presume youre in England where the gov.uk web page says:

EnglandYou can leave school on the last Friday in June if you’ll be 16 by the end of the summer holidays.
You must then do one of the following until you’re 18:

• stay in full-time education, for example at a college
• start an apprenticeship
• spend 20 hours or more a week working or volunteering, while in part-time education or training

Have the school applied for an EHCP? If not ask them to do so immediately. If they refuse, apply yourself.

Speak to your local SENDIASS and SEND parent carer group for advice and support.

Do not de-register her from school at this point but speak to the SEND team and the attendance team at the LA. You may be able to access temporary EOTAS under section 19 of the Education Act while she is being assessed for an EHCP.

If they agree to provide it, focus on English and Maths if you can and helping her with her attachment issues.

From next September she will be able to apply for a paid apprenticeship - but they often require a minimum of English and Maths GCSEs.

A non-paid college apprenticeship / BTECH will help her to get her maths and English if she doesn't manage it this year.

But she would likely struggle with both if her attachment issues aren't sorted.

Are you able to pay for private ADHD and psych assessments? Most councils will accept these now as part of the EHCP process (but not always automatically which is why SENDIASS support and advocacy is crucial).

Also - if she is adopted, speak to your adoption support worker as they also may be able to pull some internal levers to get additional support.

To add re: adoption support. The LA can apply to the Adoption and Special Guardianship Support Fund for up to £3000 towards therapy and / or specialist assessment BUT it is not retrospective, so don't arrange the therapy and then ask for the assessment.

They may also be able to ensure she is prioritised in the EHCP process as most LAs will have internal processes that prioritise Cared for, previously cared for and adopted children.

Be careful with SENDIASS. Some are good but too many repeat the LA’s unlawful policies. IPSEA and SOSSSEN are better sources of accurate information.

LAs with a blanket policy of refusing to accept independent assessments because they are independent are acting unlawfully. And SENDIST certainly considers all evidence.

No EHCP, no formal alternative provision because there is no CAMHS diagnosis. (The school says they need LA sign-off for any alternative provision over 6 weeks, the LA EWO says her hands are tied without a CAMHS diagnosis.)

The school (especially Pastoral and the HT) have tried really hard to make school a welcoming place for dd, and have provided lots of pastoral provision, but nothing academic.

Thanks, I don't really have a plan as yet. I would prefer to keep her on roll, even if she only sttends PT, but she is still saying she won't go at all.

Thanks irts, sorry for being ignorant but section 19 of what? And what is EOITAS?

I used to work in a college and we had a 14-16 programme for youngsters who hadn’t managed school. It didn’t work for everyone, I’m not going to lie, but some found it worked well - less rigid than school, no uniform, could have piercings visible and dyed hair etc. might be worth looking into.

Without maths and English options will be limited in future.

Can you negotiate a reduced timetable for the core subjects with the school? Even a few grade 2 or 3s will open up courses at college.

You can get a college course with no quals but it's often a generalized life skills type course aimed at lower ability students with send.

Request an EHCNA. On their website, IPSEA has a model letter you can use.

Also request alternative provision from the LA. Under section 19 of the Education Act 1996, it is ultimately the LA’s responsibility to ensure DD still receives a suitable full-time education. This is sometimes known as section 19 (or s19) provision. You do not need a diagnosis for this. IPSEA also has a model letter or this that you can use. If the LA refuses, post back here for the next steps to enforce provision.

EOTAS is Education Otherwise Than At School. You may also see it with an I (for In) instead of an A. Or with a C on the end for College. EOTAS/EOTIS packages via an EHCP are bespoke packages of education for DC for whom it is inappropriate for provision to be made in a school.

You don’t need a Camhs diagnosis for alternative provision. Ewo is being economical with the actualite.

well, diagnosis wise have you looked at FAS? Very similar to adhd. You’ll probably find lots of places both nhs and private will refuse to assess for adhd if there are known attachment issues as the differential diagnosis between adhd and attachment disorder is tricky.

officially anyone under 18 has to be in education, training or a job. However no-one checks up on it and there are no consequences. (My DD was NEET (not in education, employment or training for a couple of years and about all it did was bump us up the nhs waiting lists).

if she’s getting U’s in mocks, is that due to ability or exam related issues like anxiety?

many students with your DD’s profile do skills for life type courses at FE college which incorporate work related skills. They can also do entry level qualifications which are easier than GCSEs.

Thanks BloominNora, this is really helpful. I'm realising now that I have been rather naive in accepting everything the school and EWO told me. I asked years ago about an EHCP but told they were only for kids diagnosed SEN - is that right? School have said throughout they can't assess her learning needs until her attendance is improved.

The post-adoption support in this area (probably everywhere) is too over-stretched to give individual advice. We do however get funding through the ASF for private attachment therapy.

Dd has been having this, with planned breaks, for some years now. It has been very helpful but the reality is that she will always have attachment issues - its a lifelong issue to be managed, but I don't think it can be cured. Unfortunately, as well as losing her biological parents and foster carers, dd's other adoptive mother (my ex) developed Alzheimers at a relatively young age and is now in a care home. So a lot of loss.

Good idea, Ill do that. Thank you.

Thank you, I feel embarrassed I didnt know all this already. Thanks so much.

It is not correct that an EHCP is only for kids with diagnosed SEN.

quite apart from anything else quite a lot of severely disabled kids they don’t know what it is (SWAN or Syndrome Withoyt A Name) but it’s bleeding obvious that if the kid can’t walk or talk they need an EHCP.

if your DD was exposed to drugs and alcohol in utero then at a minimum Fetal Alcohol syndrome is quite likely.

attachment disorder is also a diagnosis in it’s own right.

You have nothing to be embarrassed about.

You don’t need a diagnosis for an EHCP. They are based on needs, not diagnosis. You don’t need the school or the LA to agree, either. You also don’t need DD’s attendance to improve first.

You should check what DD’s absences are being recorded as. They should be coded as I on the register. If they aren’t post back on the thread.

Have you spoken to her virtual head? She should receive pupil premium plus and there should be a virtual head who is responsible for her. They may be able to access support that is not otherwise available may be able to give the LA a kick on your behalf.

Thanks Octavia, yes I'm aware ADHD and attachment symptoms are easily confused, that's the basis on which CAMHS refused to assess her (along with her not being in school). However, as there no established 'cure' for attachment disorder, or way of establishing that it has been cured, I couldn't see a way past this. It felt to me close to saying they wouldn't see her because shes adopted.

Also, I believe its very hard to conclusively diagnose FAS. She doesn't have FAS features, but I know her birth mum was alternating between staying dry and relapsing into binge drinking at different stages of pregnancy, and so we don't know which developmental stages may have been affected. She was definitely born addicted to heroin, and had a nasty prolonged withdrawal, but there's no way of diagnosing what damage that may have caused.

To add to the many things we don't know, the scanty information I have of her many half-siblings includes a range of issues such as ADHD, Tourettes, bipolar etc.

So I accept the difficulty of coming up with a 'clean' and certain diagnosis, but I find it hard to forgive CAMHS that this has been used to justify not letting her in the door.

Thank you all for being so kind. I did try to challenge CAMHS at the time, even taking it to my MP who apparently has a special interest in SEN, but it got me nowhere.

I'm going to check on the virtual head. There was one appointed who came to a meeting of the adoptive parents group we had running at primary school. I have rarely met a more unpleasant woman! She had the face of Reece Witherspoon and the personality of Dolores Umbridge, and it soon became clear that her agenda was to stop the parents at our school having a say in the spending of the Pupil Premium Plus, which she wanted to claw back to pay for staff for her team, who would run awareness training. The HT also attended, and his agenda was to use the money to set up a wellbeing room for the school. So the meeting ended up in a three way row, which was very unedifying. But maybe she has a successor by now!

Thanks again for being kind. I can't get over that I have worked so long and so hard and yet utterly failed to get my dd the support she needs. It got so bad I had to quit my fancy job because I had to spend half my time at the school. My only excuse is that I was also fighting the system to get the right care for my ex, who had a psychotic mental illness masking Alzheimers, and who couldn't be assessed for that because she was 'too young'. I was just worn out and worn down.

Fellow adopter here.
My DD also missed all of y11 (in pandemic, MH issues).

I found our local Post Adoption Support were the ones who stepped up for us when I waved a load of flags asking for help when DD did not return to school after the first lockdown.

I would apply for an EHCNA. (I only did this in y12). You can do this yourself. The SEN board here on MN will advise you on how you need to word your request.

I would look at tutoring for Maths / English Language.
Privately if you can afford it but try to get the LA to fund.
Even if it is 'just' level 1 functional skills to start with. Local Home Ed groups may be able to point you at tutors.

Look into Foundation units at your local colleges. These are for kids working at lower than GCSE grade 1. Some of these have 14-16 provision.
Above foundation units there are level 1 courses which are GCSE grade1-3 equivalent, and then level 2 GCSE grade 4+ equivalent.

She maybe doesn't sound well/able enough to work regularly, but how about some charity shop volunteering, would that be feasible?

My DD is now doing a Supported Internship which is hopefully a programme to give support into work. But it is only available to those with an EHCP.

Don't be hard on yourself, you have been dealing with a lot. Any single one of the things you have dealt with from adoption, potential SEN and your ex partners issues would be enough for anyone to struggle.

The system is not set up to be easy to navigate, even though it should be, and while the majority of staff working in the sector want what's best for children, there are unfortunately some (like the virtual head you encountered) that are not well suited to the job they are doing.

You have not failed your daughter at all. You can't know what you don't know and you have worked hard for her in very difficult circumstances.

There is a lot of good advice on this thread about different people to contact. Don't be put off by the services saying they can't do something, if it is something that they absolutely should be doing.

As an adopted child / care leaver, your daughter should be absolutely at the front of the queue for any additional support that's needed.

If you don't get anywhere with adoption support / virtual head / school / SEN team / attendance support team, do not hesitate to go directly to the director for education and DCS. By adopting her rather than fostering, you have saved the LA hundreds of thousands of £. Do not be afraid to point that out to them if you have to escalate!

I've sent you a PM - but feel free to ignore if you would prefer to keep things on the public forum 😊

You haven’t failed. It is services and professionals who have failed DD. You haven’t.

Another person you could contact is the Designated Clinical Officer/Designated Medical Officer. Different areas call them different things.