DD15 behaviour in school

[blueberrymojito]

After a stressful 12 months with my DD 15 I'm at my wits end and just don't know how to best approach the difficulties she is experiencing in school. Last year she was referred for an ADHD assessment by school due to poor concentration, disruption in lessons, impulsive, lack of focus, lateness to lessons, inability to sit down in her seat for the duration of the lesson, silliness outside of lessons around school. We are still waiting for the appointment. The general consensus from staff in school is that she's not rude or malicious to staff and is often remorseful afterwards and will apologise to staff. Last year she ended up in internal exclusion twice and countless afterschool detentions. She's also hard work at home a lot of the time (defiant, argumentative, extremely rude...more so than what I'd consider to be typical teenage behaviour I guess), but I can manage this. Generally she's a good kid in the sense she's not vaping, drinking, hanging around causing trouble in the streets. She's very sporty and active and is engaged with her hobbies in the evenings. I'm 99.9% sure she has ADHD.

This year she has tried really hard to conform to school rules, and the year got off to a better start. However most days she is getting in to trouble in and around school, being in places she shouldn't be, general disruption, not staying in her seat etc. I think teachers are sick of her as admittedly she's probably quite annoying for staff but again she's not malicious. I no longer know how to approach this. She is receiving sanctions from school left right and centre and then coming home crying that she doesn't think about it at the time and essentially her brain is telling her to do this stuff before she has chance to stop it and she cannot conform to school expectations. She cannot explain why she's done it and keeps saying sorry to us and that she wants to be "good".

I'm in constant contact with school, I expect they're sick of my husband and I but I just want wants best for her and I no longer know what that is. The sanctions aren't working, all it does it highlight she can't meet schools expectations and she feels like a failure in school. But at the same time there are consequences in life and I need her to understand this too. We do put consequences and boundaries in at home, however it doesn't work, it just makes us all miserable!

If anyone has been in this situation or can offer some guidance it would be appreciated!

If I were you and I had the money I would pay privately for an assessment and for ADHD medication.

I was your daughter…. I hated rules of the school… another brick on the wall. I was better in college… more freedom

Unfortunately she is going to have to conform to the rules in school, even though she finds them hard. She may well have ADHD, but having a diagnosis won’t change the day to day expectations of school.
What year is she in?

We are actually very close to the clinic appointment now which is the last step of the assessment. I've been told by paediatrics it should be Jan/Feb time and she's had the QB test already. It's more advocating for what's best for her in school, I think she's just seen as a "naughty" kid. She even said she feels because she's a girl, the expectations on her are higher than the boys who misbehave in her lessons. No idea if this is the case but it's her perception. We have always supported the school but I'm starting to feel she's being set up to fail as she just can't seem to conform to expectations and is so impulsive.

It think you should speak to the school senco and ask that she is treated as a child with ADHD and that appropriated things are put in place to help her. Read up on strategies to help those with ADHD, as you'll have some ideas to suggest.

If you get a private diagnosis it may mean that she will not be eligible for a CAMHs assessment, and you/she will have to pay for medication (from what I understand it's not cheap). Do you have any idea how far off an assessment she is?

She's in year 10. We have obviously explained this to her but she is crying at night saying sorry to us and that she can't control it. So I'm left wondering what I can even expect of her anymore. I just don't know what approach to take.

Hi, you working with school will only benefit you and her. It sounds like you really understand what hard work she can be. When are you gonna get the results of the assessment? Ask the sendco to ring them up and see if they are any way down the line. At our place once they hint that it might be a certain diagnosis to start behaving at it

I do sympathise with both you and them

I think we are close to the final part of the assessment now.. she's had the QB test and all Connor's questionnaires were completed months ago. I think the only way she will "conform" is by managing the impulsivity with medication. I will ask for another meeting with the SENCO as all the school sanctions aren't working, it's just highlighting to her that she's a failure (in her view).

Sorry but it's nonsense to say an adhd diagnosis makes no difference to school expectations
Of course it does

She should be on the send register and treated as in need of support if she is on thr pathway for a neurodiversity assessment

You need to have a meeting with the senco and start asking what reasonable adjustments she can have in her day

Medication shouldn't be chosen simply to help her conform
It should only be taken if you think it is the best and only path for her as an individual. Nothing to do with school demands

She could find it easier to confirm if she had a reduced timetable or regular movement breaks etc

Also..she might get less stressed if she is being punished less often.

Definitely speak to the sendco again, she sounds like she needs regular breaks and more understanding from teachers. Detentions and sanctions for something she is unable to control is cruel.

Half the time she genuinely doesn't understand what she's done wrong (I'm sure she has done something, I'm in no way denying that!) because her memory recall of events is so poor and when she's acting on impulse I don't think it even registers half the time. Which is another issue tbh.

When she's rude at home, she genuinely doesn't remember what she said afterwards, and she's often horrified when we tell her. I've read up a lot about ADHD and heard this is common.

Can you have a chat with her and see if she can come up with anything that might help? Ask her if she has any ideas how she might be able to find lessons more manageable?
I think she needs to feel involved in trying to get through this, so she knows people are listening.
Are there any lessons she is less ‘troublesome’ in? If so, can she think of any reasons why this might be the case? Ie room layout, teaching style?

It's not about conforming, it's about her being able to manage the school day without being disruptive. That means putting things in place like movement breaks, seating her so she is where she will be least distracted, school staff giving her a gentle warning and help to refocus before she bounds off to what ever.

Go in and have a meeting with the head of year.

They can all explain what the problems are. She should have a plan.

If I’m struggling on my way to lesson, where will I go, who will support me into that lesson. She cannot wander around causing mayhem with others.

But there should be a plan written down and clear that she needs to conform to that makes sense for her and for school.

Swap "ADHD" for "two broken legs". Would you expect her to still move around school like everybody else, or would you expect support to be put in place so she could access as much of the curriculum with as little disturbance to others as possible?
Would you say she may have two broken legs but she still has to conform and do what everybody else is?

She does work better at the front and teachers are supposed to sit her at the front of the class, ensure she's understood the task etc. But not all teachers do this despite me emailing to remind them. She works better in settled classes and DD said when the teacher has control of the class it's much easier. If there are other disruptions in the lessons that's definitely a catalyst for her. It also helps if that teacher understands her and she has a good relationship with them, she seems to find it easier then.

So go in and have a meeting and repeat all that and make sure that they adapt to her needs. Ask for the sendco to be there and also have a copy of any email or instructions they sent out to staff

I can’t see what help you can get from people who don’t know you, your daughter, or the school. You just need to go and ask for help.

Yes but 2 broken legs are temporary. ADHD is for life. She is going to have to learn to deal with this.
I am autistic, believe me, I get it!

Yes, I’m not sure the broken leg comparison is a useful one and it slightly de-railing

Thank you for all these helpful responses. As I said I am in constant with the school, and whilst they're quick to put in sanctions they're less quick to meet with my husband and I when we request it, and the SENCO is very hard to contact, but I'm going to send an email now stating that I want to meet before the end of term to come up with a plan for how we can best support her moving forwards, as this just isn't working and there seems to be a lack of understanding from school. I just feel so sorry for her as she wants to please people and although she's generally a happy person I think it's starting to affecting her self esteem.

I'm just using this as a sounding block that's all. Ultimately I will decide what's best for her, I'm just looking for opinions from anyone who has been in a similar situation and might have some extra words of advice or if there's anything I might not have thought of

Late diagnosed ADHDer here. Your daughter will want to do well and behave, but the brain usually isn't onboard, leading to impulsivity, apparent not listening, fidgeting etc. It's an awful feeling to know what you should be doing, but you can't actually do it, and you keep getting told off for it.

High pressure situations like school often magnify this as the brain is overstimulated and it can't cope. As a result, it often tunes stuff out (instructions etc) looks for external stimulation (manifests as being disruptive, walking around, shouting out etc) or shuts down

As pp have said, I would have another discussion with the SENCO, does she have a plan in place for support at school? Sitting at the front, having instructions run through or written down would help massively, plus if she's a fidgeter, do school allow any thing to get input - i.e fidget toys, regular breaks etc?

You can't rely on her to do this - sounds awful, but it's just another layer of stuff to remember, which is incredibly difficult. Also worth noting that in kids with ADHD, the emotional maturity of many of them can be 3-5 years behind their peer group, which can also be impactful as they get older and are meant to be able to organise themselves as they get towards exams etc

Thank you I really appreicate your insight.

Interesting as her level of maturity is definitely about three years behind, which has started to cause some friendship issues this year as her friends are maturing and growing up quicker and I think they get fed up with the silliness which I completely understand.

She definately describes her brain as acting before she can even register what she's doing!