17 YO son seems so lonely and confused

[PBS2023]

I have 2 teenagers - a 17 yo son and a 13 yo girl. They are like chalk and cheese. My daughter is super confident. A social butterfly. My son is the complete opposite and it makes me so sad.

He goes to college but has no life outside of it. He literally comes home and sits in his bedroom online. He was bullied terribly in high school and spent most of his final years there alone and being called weird. His hobbies are trains and gaming like FNAF. He was bullied endlessly for being “different”. He has gone to college and although he has classmates that he chats too, he never goes out or does anything. He literally has no confidence and in some ways is incapable of doing simple tasks without guidance. My daughter happily takes herself off to the cinema with her friends on the bus - my son would look at me in horror at such a suggestion. He is quite immature in lots of ways. I would say he would find the company of younger teenagers more preferable than those of his own age. His sister is far more mature than he is and the responsible one out of the two. She has even invited him out with her friends (they are a mixed boy/girl group). I think he would go if he thought he wouldn’t get teased for it.

We have always made him have a part time job since being in college as a way of boosting his confidence and social skills. Wherever he has worked has loved him. He has had a couple of different roles due to them being casual roles. He never seems to make any friendships or anything though. He goes to work at these part time jobs but I know if he could, he would just stay at home.

Similarly , he is learning to drive. I know it’s only because we are paying for lessons. He has no desire to drive. He doesn’t go anywhere.

My husband encourages him to take on more responsibilities to encourage him to mature but he really struggles!

Adults love him. I always get loads of compliments of how kind and well mannered he is. And he is! I always tell him when I am proud of him or he has done a good job but it doesn’t seem to make a difference. He has actually said to me on one occasion “he never feels he is good enough”.

A year ago, he said he was bisexual. We were totally supportive. We just wanted him to be happy. Then he admitted that he wasn’t sure if he was. It was just that a LGBTQ group of kids had befriended him at college so he said it to fit in! We asked if he had a partner. He said “why would anyone want to be with me?” We were bewildered by this so god knows what is going on in his head!

He’s due to finish college next summer. He has no clue what he wants to do. I honestly think he would just live his bedroom.

I love him so much. I want him to see himself as we all see him. A wonderful person. How can I help him without wrapping him in cotton wool.

Is there any club nearby that he could go to that suits his interests? He might find it easier to go to the same place at the same time each week to hang out with a regular crowd of likeminded people. More acquaintances than friends, but also without any of the pressure.

I think my son may be on the autistic spectrum. But 18 months at least for a diagnosis I've been told and we are already under camhs as my son has ocd 😞

Let’s not rush to diagnose over the internet. The effects of bullying are lifelong and devastating.

I have a happier story- family member went through horrible bullying but once they became an adult, everything just fell into place. Got a job, a girlfriend, a few friends, matured a lot. They now say(which I don’t agree with) that the bullying does encourage people to fix whatever they are bullied about- well not always imo. They are thriving.

I see this in my neighbour’s child though, bullied and now stays home alone and is putting on weight. Although he might not want to hang out with my similar age child, we always chat and laugh with him and encourage him to join in with local events. I think sometimes as parents you need to lead by example and show them how to do things.

I'm fearful that my now 12 Yr old girl will be like this at that age too.
Very happy at primary then the bullying started. She was diagnosed with asd and adhd a year ago.
Hasn't been to school now for a month and just wants to sleep and game. She goes to a few clubs but that's it. I can't get her to engage with anything else.
She just hates the world and is angry all the time (prob hormones too) but is slowly becoming a hermit.
I wish I cohkd give her self esteem and her confidence back but the bullying has destroyed her.

I'd love ideas and tips to raise self confidence.
My ds was doing great at college to begin with and then this girl said he looked creepy and he can't stop thinking about it. He's already struggling and now he's overthinking. He said he hates the thought that people think he's 'creepy' By the way there's no reason other than he looks it apparently!?

I’d be interested in a support thread too but my DD is only 5! But she is autistic, has burn out from year 1 & has stopped attending school now. Her confidence is low & we really struggle to get her to leave the house. So even though it’s very different to the teenage years I can relate to a lot of what’s been said.

My husband is, I think, on the spectrum (our daughter is diagnosed with ASD).

He has always related to others through sport: football, rugby, rowing, hockey, cycling. Now he's in his 50s the cycling still and classic cars. He does adore a heritage railway too.

There's a lot to be said for having an "intermediary object" like a bike, car or a train to talk about if you struggle with social communication.

This might be a charity to keep an eye on:

www.theengineshed.org.uk/

My ds is 17 and has autism/adhd. He has plenty of friendly acquaintances in classes but his actual friends from last year have both dropped out of a levels. He used to play loads of football which gave him a great way in with loads of people but has an injury and been told he can’t play for at least the rest of his time at college (has to have an op first). So now he goes to silent study in his own on free lessons. He can’t go to the social hub as he says it is overwhelmingly noisy. It’s a bit shit but I try not to worry too much.

Unfortunately for me, older dd is even more if an introvert and also they really do not get along at all so can’t either be friends to each other or include the other in their social lives. I wish things were different but can’t see how I can change it.

Do you live anywhere near a heritage railway? My DS16 has volunteered for a few years at our local one and has made some really good friends there. It's something he'll be doing for the rest of his life. He doesn't do much else outside of college, but is learning excellent skills doing something he really enjoys. It has really helped his confidence too.

Oh that is so sad. I feel my son might be the same when he's older (he's very shy and struggles with anxiety and low confidence). Heartbreaking, isn't it? I'm sorry but I have no advice. Only empathy. I think many kids like this grow in to happy adults and find friends and activities they enjoy. The teen years are incredibly tough but it gets better.

I mean to add that it may be worth speaking to your son about habits. Trying a new thing, joining a new club, speaking to a new person - these are challenging things for many. But if you can do whatever it is a few times, it becomes a habit and is easier.

Anything with obvious rules and structures is helpful. I think this is why DH gets on with formulaic stuff like bike and car meet ups and football practice so well.

It could be worth watching some or all those recent BBC documentaries about autism that Chris Packham fronted and see if anything resonates with you.

www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episodes/p0bbnh47/inside-our-autistic-minds

Ditto my ex football 2 x week and pub once a week for 15 years. It is a tribe and if you do have social problems takes the pressure off to be life and soul and extroverted.

I can perhaps give you some perspective from a mum a few years on?

my ds is now 20, and dd 17. They exactly fitted your description of the different personalities in their earlier teens, with ds bullied for being different, no friends, whilst dd was capable, outgoing with a large friendship group.

ds is now at uni, and truly living a great life. He has a few (not loads) lovely friends who share his interests and he enjoys travelling, with them and alone, when not studying. He is seeing himself through the eyes of peers who like and respect him, and he is growing. I think he’d have got there without moving away, but it helped in that his confidence grew by overcoming challenges.
btw, he is almost certainly also autistic. He doesn’t want a diagnosis, yet, but every test he fills in he scores off the charts.

dd is now the more insecure one in that she doesn’t know what her next steps will be. She’ll have her issues to sort out, which she will, but it’s interesting to see how their relative fortunes have changed.

I spent years literally, telling him to go out more, be more sociable etc. He resolutely ignored me and I should have’read the room.’

theres no fast track to maturity, it will come. My only advice is to take every opportunity you can to build their confidence in themselves - if they have an innate confidence everything else will come.

Have you thought maybe he’s an introvert?

After a day at school/work and being surrounded by people, I need to retreat by myself to recharge my energy. It also knocked my confidence when I was younger - I felt the pressure to conform to the extrovert ideal and that if you weren’t outgoing, had loads of friends and were always doing stuff then you were boring, weird or antisocial. Being along doesn’t always mean lonely!

Give him time after being with people to be by himself, encourage him to develop one or two close friends and his enjoyment of trains.

Sorry you are going through this, I am going through similar with my DD(17) at present. She only has one friend at school and if this other girl is off she won’t go in, she doesn’t speak to any other pupils doesn’t like any of them (they are chavs, or weirdos) her words !! Her and her friend go out to each others houses or on walks or the cinema but not interested in partying like most young ones her age. Her teachers have said she is really quiet and doesn’t speak, she has just got a PT job in Tesco and starts her first shift on Friday and I know she is dreading it, she went to the induction on Monday and didn’t enjoy it was all older guys with her and didn’t engage with any of them. I am starting to think she may be on the spectrum but if I suggested this to her she would be horrified. Like your son she’s a great girl so caring and kind but no confidence in herself. I have an older daughter of 23 and they are like chalk and cheese she’s a social butterfly and no time for her sister they don’t get on, nothing in common . It’s awful as a parent I feel so frightened for her future and don’t know what to do for the best .

I think it's extremely damaging when we judge others negatively for being themselves.
Not everyone wants to be part of the sheep like mentality. It's a sign of inner strength to be comfortable in your own company and to not have to lean on others. When you look at this forum most of the problems are not about the child, but the parents perception of it.
The best thing you can do without a doubt is to completely allow your child to develop into the person they are meant to be, not your version. That's when they thrive. Acceptance and understanding are the deepest forms of love.

I don't think that is what's happening here.

Have you managed to find out if your son is open to having an ASD assessment, @PBS2023?

My heart goes out to you. And to him. At 17, my son was like this and we were both seriously worried and unhappy about it. You should see him now, aged 21 - he has several groups of friends, has had several girlfriends since meeting his first one, 15 months ago. He has done a LOT of work on himself. He is neurodivergent and just didn't get on at school. Having no friends at school deeply dented his self-esteem.

I would be direct with him but very gentle. Say you see that he is struggling to connect with the world beyond the safety of home, that it's clear he has the qualities he needs (as proved by work and adult friends of yours) but maybe not the confidence to use them to get the most from his life. Say to him that it may be a bit tough but the sooner he learns the necessary skills, the easier the rest of his life will be.

SKILL 1: Genuinely learn to like and accept yourself. Feel confident in your own skin. Don't seek approval for your existence from others and their reactions to you. Do this actively. Choose two ways to take care of your body that get you out of the house - maybe weightlifting and swimming or cycling or running. Maybe join a cycling club or running club or bootcamp. Gradually the people you meet become familiar and friendships might emerge. And find one hobby. DS chose music. He now realises he missed loads of overtures of friendship in his teens from fellow musicians, due to his neurodivergence but he did become a really good musician and now plays in a band. Whatever your son loves - however geeky - get him out into the world with fellow enthusiasts. Online mates are fine. But encourage online friendships to materialise - meet ups at expos, gigs, talks etc. DS met people online in his teens who he eventually met in real life and they are now his closest mates due to shared interests.

SKILL 2: Care less about what others think of you and more about what you think of them. If people are unkind, judge them! Don't try to ingratiate bullies or fickle friends. Coolly assess whether you value and respect such people and respond to them accordingly.

SKILL 3: Embrace all kinds of friendship - especially very casual ones. Neurodivergent people often prize deep connection very highly whereas NT people are happy to hang out and get wary of the intensity of ND people. If he gets on with the LGBT crowd, he could check in with them and see what they are up to after college or at the weekend some time. He doesn't have to be bi to have LGBT friends.

It's also fine to join a hobby club and just see people there and for nothing else to come of it ever. Not to put pressur eon himself to get great friendships from it.That gentle sociability is a form of valuable connection. Bit by bit, these connections slowly grow. (DS had NO friends. He was dangerously lonely. He volunteered at a charity and was befriended by fellow volunteers he felt he had 'nothing in common with'. Four years later, they holiday together, they cross UK to catch up with each other at the weekends. They are still very different from him in their interests but what they have in common is that they are good kind people who like each other and he now hugely values that.

DS learned to embrace all kinds of friendships in his quest to find any friends at all. One of his close acquaintances is a man in his seventies who shares a passion with DS. They meet up for coffee once a month or so, have done some work together and he has been great at helping DS network in his chosen profession.

To help DS gain these skills, we found CBT techniques and worksheets hugely valuable. If there is an adolescent CBT group locally, it might be worth him joining it. DS was extremely resistant to CBT for a long time and said it had no value whatsoever. it did. We saw the changes before he did. He stuck at it in a kind of desperation but now sees that it changed his attitude to life and made him an outgoing, confident and much happier person.

Sorry for long post but we struggled so much and it was such a painful time, so I really worked on it with him and this was the key stuff that emerged as valuable out of a whole load of trials and errors. DS still has a lot of problems from being ND, but loneliness is no longer one of them and it used to be the biggest block in his life. It can be overcome. If he can do it, truly, anyone can.

This is true, but introverted people can also be lonely and really struggle knowing how to make friends. It's not forcing someone to be a sheep to teach them valuable social skills. Whether they use them or not is up to them, but equipping our children with the core skills needed to navigate the workplace, relationships with friends and partners is not manipulative. It's essential.

Is your son happy with his lot?
If so then normalise being a loner. Some people just are.
However, if he is lonely and sad, it's a different story

Are many people happy with having zero confidence and overwhelm at absolutely basic life skills? It's wrong to pathologise introversion but equally unhelpful to encourage our offspring to limit their lives and capabilities at such a young age.

It's important to let him know there's nothing wrong with him, but here are some social and life skills he doesn't yet possess which he can master then use if he chooses. That's empowerment.

@TotalOverhaul what a fantastic post. Thank you for taking the time to write all of that. Extremely useful and helpful. Thank you!

This is such a brilliant post- thank you so much. It is also really encouraging for where we are now- thank you.

So sorry everyone! I got locked out of my mumsnet account and couldn’t get the reset email. I’m going to read them all and reply xxx