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Teenagers

Parenting teenagers has its ups and downs. Get advice from Mumsnetters here.

Original poster

DS (15) is getting grade 7s in his GCSE mocks with no effort. Says there's no point working any harder to get 9s.

58 replies

MonikerBing · 13/10/2023 18:18

And he says that GCSEs aren't important for anything other than getting into sixth form. So he's not going to work any harder. He did no revision at at for these exams. I know he can get 9s if he worked!

His older sisters who did exams before him did work really hard - they were more motivated by getting top grades - although it's not the grades that really bother me, it's my view that you should try the hardest you can.

Should I be persuading him to aim higher? And if so, how? I told him that as an employer I do look at GCSEs (although I'm not sure I have done). Would GCSE grades count against him for university entry?

OP posts:
noblegiraffe · 13/10/2023 18:28

What subjects is he looking to do at A-level? Just because they let you onto a course with a grade 7, it doesn't mean that it wouldn't be a good idea to get a higher grade by putting some work in, as that would ease the transition to A-level and potentially affect A-level outcomes.

This table shows how GCSE grade impacts maths A-level, for example. If you get a 7 your most likely A-level grade outcome is a C/D, if you get an 8, it's an A/B.

DS (15) is getting grade 7s in his GCSE mocks with no effort. Says there's no point working any harder to get 9s.
Askil · 13/10/2023 18:33

@noblegiraffe Amongst other things.... that table is showing that twice as many who got a 5 in GCSE Maths went on to get an A* in A'level maths than those who a 7 in GCSE Maths???? is that correct?

Sandysandwich · 13/10/2023 18:35

Isn't 7 the equivalent of a low/mid A? Honestly I'd leave him to it, he's achieving good grades that will get him into college if he wants to go.

Starrystarryfight · 13/10/2023 18:35

yeah I’d leave it but he will get a shock at A level

noblegiraffe · 13/10/2023 18:35

Twice the percentage, but if you look at the number who got a 5 it's only 281. It would be exceptionally unusual for a student who got a 5 at GCSE to be allowed onto an A-level course so it's likely that for those students something went wrong in Y11 and they're much more able than the GCSE grade suggests.

KatieKat88 · 13/10/2023 18:37

Askil · 13/10/2023 18:33

@noblegiraffe Amongst other things.... that table is showing that twice as many who got a 5 in GCSE Maths went on to get an A* in A'level maths than those who a 7 in GCSE Maths???? is that correct?

That seems off on the surface, but it could be students who were capable of higher grades in Maths at GCSE but underperformed for whatever reason and then went on to A Level? I would have thought most students who get a 5 in Maths at GCSE would swerve the A Level course!

KatieKat88 · 13/10/2023 18:37

noblegiraffe · 13/10/2023 18:35

Twice the percentage, but if you look at the number who got a 5 it's only 281. It would be exceptionally unusual for a student who got a 5 at GCSE to be allowed onto an A-level course so it's likely that for those students something went wrong in Y11 and they're much more able than the GCSE grade suggests.

Jinx Grin

Askil · 13/10/2023 18:39

@noblegiraffe I agree totally with that, but it doesn't explain the disparity between the achievement of the GCSE grade 5s and the 7s.

HonoriaLucastaDelagardie · 13/10/2023 18:41

yeah I’d leave it but he will get a shock at A level

What I was going to say. People who sail through with minimal effort come unstuck eventually, because they've never learned how to put the hard work in. If not at A Level, then at university.

drinkuptheezider · 13/10/2023 18:45

DS1 did exactly the same, required min 3 X B grades to get in 6th form..got 3xBs and 5 x C...his Headmaster was fuming. He used same logic, only get what you need. He was capable of A* ( nothing above at that point) but saw no point in grades for grades sakes.

Whattodo121 · 13/10/2023 18:49

@noblegiraffe do you have those stats for any other subject? (Really interesting!)

A 9 at gcse is so much better prep for A level than a 7 (very experienced teacher here who works a lot with the 6th form). Also depends on his plans later, oxbridge/medicine/dentistry/veterinary he needs 9s.

Rainsdropskeepfalling · 13/10/2023 18:52

I've got one of those.

He's now yr13 and still does the minimum. When I asked him what he would have done differently in yr11 he said he would have dossed around more if he'd known he could get easier grades.

We don't all work the same. Drives me crazy but he's not me.

Gumbo · 13/10/2023 18:55

My DS was similar... did very well without studying, but I really wanted him to push himself harder. I know it's very much frowned upon here, but I found bribery worked well... No money for anything except grades 8 or 9 - unsurprisingly he suddenly put in more effort and got lots of both those grades!

Obviously you might not agree with doing this, but it's what worked for me...

Oblomov23 · 13/10/2023 18:59

I'm not sure about all of this. It's hard to get the balance right between encouraging them/guiding them/demanding and punishing if they don't make the effort/wanting them to want it for themselves. Ds1 does little and does very well. Drives me mad because I had to work hard to get a B, 35 years ago! Ds2 does little and is just starting GCSE's. I've told him I expect decent marks!

clary · 13/10/2023 19:05

What does he want to do in the future op?

I agree with @Whattodo121 that if that includes Oxford, Cambridge (less do) or medicine/vet sci then GCSE grades will count.

No, despite what you may think from reading MN, not everyone at Oxford has all 9s (would be impossible tbh) but those are the higher ed courses where it matters.

I also agree that a decent work ethic and good grades achieved through that is invaluable for A levels. But you can’t force it imho. Ds2 could have got better than a 6 in Spanish - but he wasn’t fussed and tent need it. Ditto dd in maths.

Both did work hard tho, for the subjects they loved. What are his A levrl
pkans @MonikerBing ? Could he focus on those?

clary · 13/10/2023 19:06

Sorry for typos, hope meaning is clear!

Original poster
MonikerBing · 13/10/2023 19:15

How did your ds do at A Level @drinkuptheezider ?

He thinks he'll do engineering at university. Again, no ambitions to go to Oxbridge but I suspect will want to go to a Russell Group university. It is frustrating. His teachers are also quite pissed off with him, but he appears to have no drive to do better, and isn't competitive (with himself or anyone else) either.

I hadn't thought about the step up to A Level though as a potential lever to him. He probably thinks he will just breeze into them.

OP posts:
BackOfTheMum5net · 13/10/2023 19:15

He’s not wrong! So long as he has good grades for Maths and English, and any subject very relevant to what he wants to study/do in the future, he’ll be ok.

It’s rare to be asked for GCSE grades beyond university, and the usual convention for job applications is to write the quantity of GCSEs above a certain grade.

noblegiraffe · 13/10/2023 19:19

He thinks he'll do engineering at university.

Hah, he's looking at maths then. So many boys who coast their way to a grade 7 at GCSE and then try coasting at A-level find that they are failing horribly, usually around January of Y12.

I'd show him that table, tbh and tell him that if he doesn't get at least an 8, he's going to have to work his arse off in sixth form or he might need to rethink his uni plans.

SabrinaThwaite · 13/10/2023 19:27

As an engineer, I got asked what my O level grades were at a couple of interviews for engineering companies, and that was post degree, 2 years of relevant work and a specialist Masters. Quite possibly unusual but worth bearing in mind perhaps.

noblegiraffe · 13/10/2023 19:31

Whattodo121 · 13/10/2023 18:49

@noblegiraffe do you have those stats for any other subject? (Really interesting!)

A 9 at gcse is so much better prep for A level than a 7 (very experienced teacher here who works a lot with the 6th form). Also depends on his plans later, oxbridge/medicine/dentistry/veterinary he needs 9s.

No, sorry, they were collated by maths teachers I think, who love a bit of data.

However, you could use the government transition matrix tool to look at average GCSE point score versus A-level result in various subjects. It's really clear that kids who do better at GCSE generally get higher results at A-level.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/5e25971940f0b62c45460061/TMs_2019A_live_final.xlsx

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/5e25971940f0b62c45460061/TMs_2019A_live_final.xlsx

DelilahBucket · 13/10/2023 19:33

It depends what college/sixth form he wants to go to. The one DS is looking at, if on paper he is equal with another student, the place will go to the student with the highest average GCSE result. In this case it's in his best interests to get the highest grades he can across all subjects.

Fluffycloudsfloatinginthesky · 13/10/2023 19:37

My daughter has just gone into Y12 and we had a welcome evening. It was made VERY clear that even if you found GCSE's easy A levels require a whole new skill set and very structured study, independent work and motivation.

He could come unstuck.

Changes17 · 13/10/2023 19:39

Mine said that at this stage. He didn’t start revising til Feb half-term really (after getting 9s in mocks with very little effort). He then got lots of 9s for gcse. I like to think not stressing out played a part in that but also probably luck… He’s working hard now (year 12) if that’s any help?

Ilovegardens · 13/10/2023 20:20

Many University courses now ask for specific gcse grades.