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Teenagers

Parenting teenagers has its ups and downs. Get advice from Mumsnetters here.

Original poster

Boy that DD is friendly with and unacceptable behaviour

76 replies

Rollergirl11 · 18/02/2022 09:45

Not really sure what to do with the information I’ve just been given by DD (almost 16)

Background. DD has started to become friends with a boy in her year through mutual music taste and gigs. She happened to bump in to him at a gig that I had taken her to back in November and they went off together for the evening. Then they found out that they are both going to another gig next month with their respective friends so they are going to all join up for the night. Now they have planned to go and see another band together in April. It will just be the two of them. There is no romantic interest on DD’s part and DD doesn’t think there is for him either. He actually has a girlfriend although I understand she doesn’t live locally.

Now the worrying bit. DD has just been told by a friend that there was an incident with this boy last summer at a party. The friend was really drunk, as was the boy. The friend was lying on a sofa kind of out of it and the boy tried to touch her inappropriately underneath her clothing. Another friend saw and pulled the friend away. Apparently the boy apologised afterwards.

Now DD is feeling strange about going to the gig with him. Or even talking to him now. They have both bought their tickets. How should she go about this?

OP posts:
Fantasea · 18/02/2022 15:07

@IdontWanna I was about to suggest your DD using you as an excuse OP! I must also be the worst mum as my DD (now adult) used it in awkward situations.

GirlInACountrySong · 18/02/2022 15:09

@VirginMedium

fka he should be in COURT for what he did, never mind social pariah. makes me so mad, mum's facilitating these abusive sons
mums? how about Dad's input? and i bet his parents didnt even know,' i'd want to know if it was my own son or daughter definitely
Abbsie · 18/02/2022 15:20

@GirlInACountrySong

aware I will be a lone voice here.....but i'm cool with that
I shall stand with you.

An aspect of my job is working with the victims and perpetrators of teen sexual assault. Its not black and white, much as it feels easier for the general public to see it that way.

Both children need safeguarding. To care for the boy does not minimise the needs of the girl. In this case, its very likely the boy will be suffering from some/all of:

  • Shame. Huge, massive, crippling shame.
  • Guilt - for himself, his family, his friends. And of course her.
  • Fear for his safety. Fear of recriminations.
  • Fear for his future.
  • Fear he can never be normal again. Never go to a gig or do normal 15yo things.
  • a desire for the opportunity to show he is a better person than this crime. And cripping disappointment when people don't give him the chance.
  • an expectation that he deserves confidentiality (he's a child. Plus he's not been convicted in a court). But that gossips will gossip.

To recognise and acknowledge the feelings of the boy does not diminish the feelings of the girl

Another aspect that takes deeper thinking is the fact that social services and police do not seek to criminalise this behaviour as a given. They might instead look at ways to educate and change future behaviour (of the perpetrator) rather than create a criminal record.

It is about recognising the fact that this is child on child abuse. Both are children, including the perpetrator, who deserves opportunities to learn and move on purposefully.

The details of this require a lot of in depth, sociotal thinking. The Internet is not a good place for rational discussion on this. Too many black and white thinking alarmists.

Original poster
Rollergirl11 · 18/02/2022 15:23

Good idea ref blaming it all on me! I don’t mind her doing that!

OP posts:
ldontWanna · 18/02/2022 15:30

@Abbsie what about as a mother? Would you be happy with your kid hanging out with a boy like that? Going to gigs? Getting drunk? Going to house parties?

TheOnlyLivingBoyInNewCross · 18/02/2022 15:41

Such a thoughtful post, Abbsie. Absolutely agree with everything you’ve said.

oviraptor21 · 18/02/2022 15:43

I'm with @Abbsie

Of course if she feels uncomfortable or has any misgivings at all then she shouldn't go.

But I don't think we should profile the boy as a predatory sex offender. The opening post says he was drunk.
Clearly he needs to acknowledge his behaviour was inappropriate and to ensure it never happens again.

VirginMedium · 18/02/2022 16:31

whether he continues to be a sexual predator will be for women he comes in to contact with to worry about won't it. keep your daughter safe OP.

VirginMedium · 18/02/2022 16:32

do you all actually believe that being drunk is a reasonable excuse for groping a semi conscious girl??

Soontobe60 · 18/02/2022 17:00

[quote ldontWanna]@Abbsie what about as a mother? Would you be happy with your kid hanging out with a boy like that? Going to gigs? Getting drunk? Going to house parties?[/quote]
Did you actually read what @Abbsie wrote?

Soontobe60 · 18/02/2022 17:03

@VirginMedium

do you all actually believe that being drunk is a reasonable excuse for groping a semi conscious girl??
As has already been said, it’s not so black and white. There is no ‘reasonable excuse’, but there are mitigating circumstances, especially when the ‘groper’ was a boy.
Original poster
Rollergirl11 · 18/02/2022 17:33

but there are mitigating circumstances, especially when the ‘groper’ was a boy.

What do you mean by that?

OP posts:
ldontWanna · 18/02/2022 17:39

@Soontobe60 yes I did.

She gave her professional opinion which largely I understand and I agree with. Professionally i behave and think in a very similar way and I like the kids I work with ,have great bonds with them and want the best for them. As a mother? I wouldn't want DD to be best friends with them, or go to their house for a sleepover or hang out with them alone, because she doesn't have the understanding,skill and tools to deal with it or the protection offered (if there's any) from being an adult at work with them.

So I asked about her opinion as a mother. Because that's what OP is asking. She is her daughter's mother. Not a teacher, not a social worker,not a TA, not the boy's parent. Not someone involved in or responsible for supporting him and his issues and his feelings.

OP is responsible for her daughter . Her issues,her feelings and yes her safety.

lljkk · 18/02/2022 22:09

"The friend was really drunk, as was the boy. The friend was lying on a sofa kind of out of it and the boy tried to touch her inappropriately underneath her clothing."

This is the total of the "incident".
Unless you count his apology afterwards -- but pretty sure most PP think that apology amounts to completely irrelevant. The boy is condemned forever, unforgiveably.

I can't get enough detail out of that account to know whether there was predatory behaviour. What does "kind of out of it" even mean? The girl was dizzy? She was tipsy? When someone can talk to you and seem to understand what's going on around them and flirt heavily maybe but won't remember a thing in the morning?

Usual. MNers weren't there but insist they know exactly everything 100% for sure, from just a few vague words in a 3rd hand account.

Original poster
Rollergirl11 · 18/02/2022 23:20

* When someone can talk to you and seem to understand what's going on around them and flirt heavily maybe but won't remember a thing in the morning?*

What the actual fuck are you talking about?! Are you implying that if she was flirting heavily, and I have no fucking idea where you got this from, then she’s asking to be groped? Prime example of internalised misogyny right there.

OP posts:
RubyRedNails · 18/02/2022 23:30

Lads appreciate direct honesty and they feel mortified when they misread a situation did you read the bit that described the young girl as "out of it" when he sexually assaulted her? He didn't misread anything. He saw an opportunity an took it.

VirginMedium · 18/02/2022 23:37

lljkk. 'condemned forever, unforgiveably', what does this even mean? its just emotive hyperbole. OP just needs to keep her daughter safe. what parent in their right mind is going to advice their daughter, considering this lads feelings/future?? it doesn't matter that he might come good eventually. he has form for taking advantage of unconscious girls. any parent with half a brain cell advises daughter to steer well clear

and there is nothing confusing or 'grey area' about enthusiastic consent

VirginMedium · 18/02/2022 23:38

exactly ruby you don't 'mistake' a girl passed out, as an invitation to feel her tits

oviraptor21 · 18/02/2022 23:59

Where does it say she was passed out?
How drunk was he? What preceded the grope? So much that is not black and white here.

VirginMedium · 19/02/2022 06:39

the answer to none of those questions justifies what he dud

Mo1911 · 19/02/2022 06:45

It's a lesson in not drinking so much that you've no clue what's going on around you. They sound like quite a bunch, I'd be more worried about the type of girls she's hanging about with than him!

TheOnlyLivingBoyInNewCross · 19/02/2022 08:14

@Mo1911

It's a lesson in not drinking so much that you've no clue what's going on around you. They sound like quite a bunch, I'd be more worried about the type of girls she's hanging about with than him!
I agree with everything Abbsie said.

However, that does not mean I believe any kind of victim-blaming is acceptable. A drunk girl is not asking to have her breasts groped any more than a sober one is.

LosingTheWill2022 · 19/02/2022 08:16

I'd be more worried about the type of girls she's hanging about with than him!

So in a scenario where both young men and young women are drinking and one young man attempted to assault a woman, you raise more concerns about the fact that the women were drinking ... Unbelievable.

Sheknowsnodifferent · 19/02/2022 08:27

[quote Rollergirl11]@ldontWanna I don’t think she’s necessarily worried about being around him. I think it is more the principle of it and it has now made her see him in a totally different way. I think it’s important that she follows her instincts but I also don’t want to push her one way or the other. I know that she would still like to go to the gig as she really wants to see the band so I wouldn’t want her to feel guilty if she decided she still wanted to.

@wingscrow and yes I completely agree with what you said and I am also conscious that I don’t want to be seen to be minimising what this boy has done. And therefore would allowing DD to still go with him if she chooses to be doing just that?[/quote]
Well she should be worried. This boy has taken advantage of an intoxicated girl and if he wasn't stopped, who knows what could have happened. Have we not learned anything from Ashling Murphy/Sarah Everard/Angel Lynn? Men, not all, are more dangerous to women than women are to men. Your daughter does NOT owe this boy an explanation as to why she doesn't want to see him again. Fuck hurting his feelings.

Sheknowsnodifferent · 19/02/2022 08:29

@Mo1911

It's a lesson in not drinking so much that you've no clue what's going on around you. They sound like quite a bunch, I'd be more worried about the type of girls she's hanging about with than him!
Wtf??!!! A woman can drink however much SHE wants, just like a man can without feeling like she is at risk of being sexually abused. Talk about victim blaming - your views are patriarchal at best and fucking ludicrous at worst.