Struggling with teen daughter and her anxiety

[Sara2000]

I need a safe space to offload. Yes , some of you will tell me what a shit parent I am. But you know what? I'm not, I'm just being honest about how I feel.

Dd aged 15 is under tier 3 CAMHs for anxiety, self harming and suicide ideation. We are paying for counselling and CBT which she says is going well. I am just finding it so hard to live with.

She is rude and hostile pretty much all the time. She spends 90% of her time in her room playing online games. She has a group of online friends and 2 real life school friends. Of course the pandemic hasn't helped, but she never wants to go anywhere. I am at a loss. Her life at the weekend consists of her laptop, coming down for some food and grunting at us, back up to her room.

She has just been diagnosed with a vitamin D deficiency and will be on high strength vitamin D for 2 months, having sat in her dark room for 6 months. .

She hates school and moans about it constantly, even had a short spell of school refusal in september. She does little or no school work despite doing GCSEs.

She wears hoodies and tracksuit bottoms and looks like a teenage boy. I give her money to buy clothes and they sit in her wardrobe. Her room is a tip.

I feel like her staff. I am here to cook, clean and serve but other than that, surplus to requirement. I pick her up from school and she sits staring at her phone like I'm a bloody uber driver. It's just take, take, take. I hate it. Every interaction we have is loaded and ends in an argument. Yes, I am aware that's probably not surprising.

Today I had to coax her out of the house. We were taking the dog for a walk and she started crying because I didn't know exactly where we were going. we bumped into some old friends and she just stood there ignoring my friends daughter who she has known since she was 4.

I am worn down by it. I know she has anxiety and I am sure a vitamin D deficiency doesnt help. But I have no idea how to deal with her, what to say and whether I should be forcing her out of her room. We tried to introduce a weekly film watching session but she refused.

I ask how her counselling is going and what they do and she takes great pleasure in not saying. I don't mean details as clearly that's not my business , but just generally what is done. Its £60 a week and I am shut out of it.

I am so fucked off with it all. I am done with walking on egg shells and biting my tongue. I dont think I have any tongue left to bloody bite. She is unbearable.

How do you get through this delightful stage? Give me a whinger baby or a tantrumming toddler baby day.

I need to hear from those of you with teens with mental health difficulties. Help!

That sounds great that you could connect a little.

I haven't read this book and it is American but I've heard the author do other things and she seems good www.amazon.co.uk/New-Adolescence-Raising-Successful-Distraction/dp/1948836548?tag=mumsnetforu03-21

I totally get what you are going through OP as do most of the other posters on this thread (which is such a change to RL where lots of friends and family just think you have a stroppy dd who needs to pull herself together )

It is emotionally exhausting caring for a teenager with mental health issues. My dd has debilitating severe anxiety, particularly social anxiety. It first manifested in Year 9 when she was 13 years old. She's now 18. We had periods of school refusal and again at Sixth form college. Given her dyslexia and anxiety she got commendable GCSE and A level results - but it was a struggle and she had to dig deep

Sadly she dropped out of her first year of Uni this October - a perfect storm of anxiety, and Covid restrictions made it untenable. She hopes to return in a year or two when she has done - as she puts it - more 'adulting'. Presently she is working one day per week on a sweet packing production line (it took a herculean effort and an understanding employer to get her through the door) and painting animal portraits for money. Its a case of slowly, slowly - once she has developed more confidence from working outside the home in that very basic role, I am hoping that she will feel ready for a slighly more rewarding job

I relate to the 'bad' behaviour, the meltdowns, the spiky aggressive verbal attacks etc. The fear of new places or crowded spaces. Like you we got private counselling for dd because CAMHS were so unhelpful / long waiting lists. She is currently on citralopram having previously tried sertraline which didn't suit her.

Over the years we have both learned what triggers her and how to manage situations more effectively. Essentially she can't take too much on at once. I have learnt to accept that the most important consideration is that she is calm and happy - so she might not get the most stellar job in the future if it comes with too much attendant stress.

During the darkest times when her anxiety first manifested I spent ages encouraging her to talk things through, or just sitting with her if she didn't want to talk and trying to reassure her.

With reference to ASD - we are considering private assessment at the Lorna Wing Centre

I realise that I have banged on about my dd and her situation in detail - but really only did this to see if there is commonality between your experience with your dd and my experience with mine. Also to show you where things might go....

There's a lot of support and listening ears on here whenever you need to vent

Sending solidarity to you Sara and to all the parents dealing with these issues. It's uplifting to hear the positive outcomes but I'm also realistic that there is no magic fix. Like others have said even just making sure home is their safe place and accepting how they are choosing to spend their time here will help in the long run. I used to (still do at times) think I needed to keep pushing and encouraging dd to be more social as I thought so much isolation would make her more depressed. I'm hoping with time and CBT there will be change.

@Spongebobsbob Have you spoken to your GP? The one thing I would say is better to act now if you are concerned as waiting lists for referrals can be long and painful.

It’s tough. My DD also has anxiety and we have now gone down the medication route at 18.
Lockdown was the worst time for her and I can relate to a lot of what you are describing- she did/does have friends now but it took her ages to find a group she bonded with (tended to be slightly geeky and/or alternative).
Even pre-lockdown when she was going out to parties etc the anxiety was still there and in lockdown it just seemed to intensify as she was ‘in her head’ too much and would barely leave the house.
Annoyingly she thought medication would be a magic bullet but we’re 3 months in and it’s not making much difference. CBT has never worked w her, but I think she may need the right therapist.

JustDanceAddict - some meds work and some don't. Sertraline was awful for my dd but citalopram is helping. Might be worth going back to your GP

LimitIsUp yes she’s on 75mg of sertraline and not doing anything yet! She had horrid side effects transferring from 50-75, she’s at uni too away from home so I wasn’t even around to help.
She’s got an appt at end of term w GP to either go up too 100mg (she’ll be back at home then), or change the meds.
I will also be here to remind her to ask to be referred to the MH team - all therapy so far has been through our private health insurance and has not worked.

Sertraline reduced my dd's anxiety but it dampened down all emotion and feeling, so she felt - in her words - like a zombie. Citalopram has been better and has reduced her anxiety but without that zombie side effect

Some people do fine on it but others don't. It would be worth discussing it with her GP if it isn't suiting her

@Spongebobsbob. I see your DD is only 11.i would suggest either getting CAMHs to assess if you need to wait , or if you can afford it to find a psychologist to do CBT or counselling. Your info about needing to reassure your DD at bedtime really stuck out to me as my DD was like that at that age. Bedtime used to take about an hour every night. I would also suggest you consider ASD.

@Limitisup. That sounds so tough but your right to say it's about accepting the limits these kids have. Dd is so capable , but I am dreading the next 18 months whilst she finishes her Gcses. I have looked at the Lorna Winge before. I believe they have a service where they assess your application prior to actually doing an ASD assessment.i might send them her ADOS report and see what they think.

I dont know about anyone else, but lockdown has really not helped. DD loved the period when the schools were closed. But it deepened tbe pattern of isolating herself in her room.

@JustDanceAddict. Dds anxiety defintley intensified during lockdown. I have seen it happen again with this one even though she is in school.For DD school is a massive trigger so there is a part of me that hopes she will improve when she leaves school.

Other people dont get it so I dont bother to talk about in RL. I was talking to a friend about anxiety in general terms the other day and she scoffed that it just wasnt a thing when she was young. That's true to some extent , I wonder what happened to all of those people who had it back then. Or is it something about life today?

I just wish there was more help for parents. I spent 2 hours with a CAMHS psychologist getting DD assessed to then end up on a 4 month waiting list. Not once did he say anything to help me to help her other than here's a number for the crisis team. It's so blinkered. Why don't they produce a fact sheet or something on a guide to looking after a teen with anxiety ,or whatever mental illness.

@Sara2000
I’ve never been through camhs for DD but did for DS when younger and they were very good. He is fine now thankfully though - puberty seemed to improve things for him - plus it was more around a specific issue whereas DD’s is more generalised and she was resistant to help.
Anxiety was def a ‘thing’ but people didn’t seek help for it. My father had it for sure and I’m quite an anxious person but wouldn’t say I had anxiety per se. I can’t pretend to know what having it as a medical condition is like but I can only see what it does to someone.

I haven’t read your full thread OP just your opening post but please don’t beat yourself up about this or try not to. I have a dd also15 and this could have been written about her. At school the only criticism her teachers have of her is that she is too quiet in the classroom, no behaviour issues, work done on time. She has a small group of friends but rarely sees them out of school.

Things escalated in lockdown 1 (staying in her room for hours and only comes out for food), also lives in hoodies tracksuit bottoms and won’t entertain the idea of new clothes. Bedroom a complete tip dirty underwear, half eaten food, wet towels etc,

We have no idea whats wrong with her as she refuses to talk to us. She is very angry about the way her year group missed out on so much last year and how they are affected this year but other than that she just closes down. She swears is aggressive over reacts and calls me by my christian name, is rude, mocking, never apologises etc.

I started a thread about her earlier (she isn’t seeing a counsellor as she refuses to go to GP or counsellor).

Like you I just want my happy loving daughter back. Take care OP 💐 🍷 💐

@Sara2000 of COURSE anxiety etc 'was a thing' way back when - I am a survivor of a decade and a half between -1975 and 1990. It nearly killed me. Now I can see that I am probably autistic too, but back then I was just left to struggle on and it was my 40s before I stopped caring what others thought of me, stopped panicking. Remarks like that are not helpful to you and not reality either.

I just popped on to say thanks for posting this. Me and my dp felt not alone for first time in a while. Since 2020 it’s like we are living with a stranger. And reading all these replies has been so valuable and supportive. So thanks but also I hope your daughters anxiety improves and you find some coping strategies:-)

Relieved to read I am not alone, but very sorry we all seem to be in the boat. Does anyone else's daughter suffer with disassociation? I keep reading it's linked to severe trauma and abuse, but I'm convinced it's linked to her ASD which wasn't diagnosed until she was 13. The school counsellor has said she has OCD, and I know she also suffers with emetophobia (as do I) So another thing to feel guilty about

I had to check twice to see if I had written that.... my dd is 14 exactly the same even down to the vit d deficiency iron tablets for 3 months starting last week.

My dd is autistic, as is her siblings so we have different challenges. I try to cling onto the rare good moments, she has just started new medication (mood stabilisers) and today she came and played mariokart with the rest of us and even laughed.
Tbh its was helpful to me to read that to know we are not alone. I try to remain hopefull that tomorrow could be better, it helps me get through the day.

Really glad to find this thread.
DD is only 10, but has developed increasing anxiety over the last few years, initially school related in connection with dyslexia and dyscalculia, but of late more generalised. I too share the feeling of foreboding a pp referred to, wondering what'll be coming over the hill in the next few years. I love her so much and feel ill when I imagine what the future may have in store for her. I just want everything to stop; DD loved the "everything's stopped" aspect of lock down.
Just had frustrated exchange with DP this evening, DD has started seeing a private psychotherapist, as CAMHS referral was turned down, despite significant regular stress related self harming at school (lots of blood), and asked to access secondary support services, in order to be reconsidered for CAHMS. I feel like we are just as well off bypassing the referral circus / waiting game and seeing a private therapist (whom DD enjoys seeing and we're lucky to be able to pay for at the moment following the cancellation of a holiday in the summer), but DP is adamant we need to pursue CAMHS as some kind of holy grail, imagining that they have some special kind of 'magic' that will make it all go away.
Is anyone else finding that managing their DC's anxiety is wreaking havoc in their relationships or co-parenting arrangements? DP, also an anxious type, finds DD's anxiety very upsetting and triggering, and really struggles to regulate himself when DD is flaring, so defers to me a lot, but also blames me in equal measure; I've been too soft, I've been inconsistent, I'm not pushing hard enough for services and interventions. But I feel like there is literally nothing I do which isn't with DD in mind or in direct support of her. Gah!

My heart goes out to all of you on this thread, and your children.

@Sara2000 I could have written your first post word for word, we went through the most awful time with DD1 (eating disorder, anxiety, school refusal) culminating in a private ASD diagnosis (like you, too long a wait for CAMHS). She was 17 when she got her diagnosis; DD2 was 18 when she got her ASD diagnosis - neither daughter had any developmental issues, at all.

For DD1 the diagnosis was a weight off her mind, she felt it explained so much for her. The diagnosis was folllowed by months of private therapy - which was what has helped DD1 the most. The therapist did talk to me on the phone (without going into specifics) and reassured me about some aspects of DD1's progress, so that was helpful for me & DH.

We did qualify for CAMHS family therapy, in which both daughters refused to participate, but that was still helpful because it managed to give us parents a space to vent (as you're doing on this thread) and to teach us to think about the MH issues in an easier-to-accept perspective, adjust our thinking. It made a noticeable, positive difference for DD1.

Have you broached ASD with your daughter? Has she ever raised it with you? It may not be the answer for her, there may never be an answer. But I honestly think therapy is key to management and recovery for mental health issues, for the sufferer as well as those supporting them.

With regards to medication, is there a CAMHS duty clinician that you can call up and speak with? Describe your DD's situation and how it's not getting any better, ask for access to the psychologist who would be able to prescribe any medication because she can't wait for a whole course of CBT to effect some possible improvement, before then moving on to consider medication.

I'm so sorry that you (and others on this thread) and your daughter are going through this right now

Morning all. I am so glad this thread in all its candid detail is helping. There is another thread on MN asking why there is so much MH issues for children and young people. Its fully of accusations and pointy fingers at parents. Theres even someone supposedly from CAMHS who is blaming parents! It is truly vile and I don't believe any other type of illnesses would be explained in the same way. It encapsulated perfectly the issues at stake, the lack of practical help and the feeling you are to blame.

@AdultHumanFemale. I am a parent, not an expert but do you think your daughter may have ASD? Anxiety if often a sign in girls. I would suggest you ask your gp for a referral. As for CAMHs, I think their service is under too much pressure but I found it helps to have a letter from them stating the obvious after their assessment (I am yet to come away from one of their assessments and feel i found out anything i didnt work out for myself.) . The school certainly seems to take their reports more seriously than a private report.

@GooseberryTart our daughters sound the same.. I think lockdown has been a disaster as it's made getting her out so much more difficult. At one point she was staying up all night for weeks on end, I was getting up for work at 7 and making her go to bed.

@Bagfull. That's really interesting to see your daughters were diagnosed with ASD eithiut developmental issues. Do you mind me asking, when they were assessed did you recall any issues with friendships, social skills etc when they were under 5? Did the assessor use DISCO or ADOS to assess? I have a niggling feeling that dd has ASD and she has had an ADOS assessemnt via CAMHs abiut 2 years ago. Her scores were over the diagnosis threshold. But we had to complete a form asking stuff like , did she have friends when she was very young or separation anxiety etc, I answered honestly and said no,but she defintley had issues from primary school; few friends, mostly boys but by year 6 none at all.. She now has a group of friends at school but she is very much on the outside , loads of sensory issues, obssessiveky plays online games.

Re: meds. CAMHs told me they follow NICE guidelines which say CBT has to be completed before medication. She has had 4 sessions so far so we will see.

Just to add, her scores were over the diagnosis threshold for ASD. However, when we were interviewed they came back down. Basically because she didnt have issues associated with ASD from an early age. The earliest was around year 3 when I noticed friend invites were less than others and she didnt have a set group of friends. From year 5 onwards she had fewer friends as the boys and girls played together less and she had previously relied on the boys. By year 6 she had no one. She has never liked noise but not to a great extent, no meltdowns, always had sensory issues it used to be socks and tights but now its if you touch her arm as well. She says when shes stressed she feels her senses going crazy all over. Sounds are louder etc. I have thought about an OT assessment , but I am cynical about sensory intergration therapy having gone through it with DS.

Omg @Sara2000 DD also mainly played with boys too. I assumed it was because she had a brother. Then at some point in primary the mainstream girls then the boys turned on her too. She was in a small class of with only about 12 or 13 girls and I noticed she was excluded from some parties and sleepovers. Dd was an extremely quick talker, embarrassingly so. She would talk in whole sentences and use humour when other kids her age could barely sound out half a dozen isolated words. But I knew she had dyslexia in year 1 school refused to acknowledge this so we got her tested privately at a neighbouring LEA.

She was always quite clingy and extremely cuddly as a little girl. Now we aren’t allowed to touch her, show any affection or if we smile or look at her she goes mad.
She also would only ever wear soft comfortable clothes from when younger she couldn’t tolerate anything itchy or slightly uncomfortable.

I have to rush out but I could've written that five years ago. My dd, 15, had anxiety and was fucking AWFUL to me. Hit me, swore at me .. hoped I'd die etc. I HATED her behaviour. Now? After help she is LOVELY! You will survive this. Rant away.

Following with interest as my Dd having similar issues, thanks for starting this post

Crossstitch- can I ask what sort of help you got? Was it through CAMHS and did she receive any formal diagnosis?

@Sara2000 they followed the ADOS form for their diagnoses. No, I didn't recall any social issues under 5. Some friendship difficulties in primary school but nothing out of the ordinary IMO. We did have a period of temper tantrums (from one daughter), lots of frustration. Both mine engaged in imaginary play at a young age, role playing, stuff people would describe as "normal". I don't know enough about ASD, certainly less when my DDs were young, so I couldn't look back through their childhood and say "oh, that was a symptom of ASD".

We have sensory issues too, primarily sound - noise cancelling headphones have been super helpful for my DDs. And they sleep a lot, which I guess isn't indicative of anything per se, but they say it's because they're so tired and overwhelmed by social interaction.

And there's no touching in our house. Kids were cuddly as children but once in secondary school, hugs vanished and now there's no touching unless they initiate it, no hugs unless they offer one or we ask before we approach - which they mostly turn down anyways... I'm a very tactile person and in some ways this has been one of my greatest losses, not being able to hug my children as much as I would like. My mum and I were frequent huggers, I loved that physical connection.

Re meds, ok, different health trusts may have different rules but DD1 was prescribed Fluoxetine (prozac) after 1 session with a CAMHS psychologist (she had had maybe 4 sessions with a CAMHS clinician/nurse at this point, who most definitely did not deliver CBT, who caused more damage than anything to DD1 in the course of this "treatment").

It may be that DD1 was seen relatively quickly because she also presented with an eating disorder.

As your DD is still under 18, would her therapist not share anything with you? With your daughter's consent, no details just progress? Could you ask for a session together with the therapist? It would be uncomfortable for your DD, but may give you some reassurance that she is receiving the help she needs.

My dd got free, charity counselling. Then when we called social services because we couldn't keep her safe, and were at end of our rope, we got more help. She got CAMHS and a weekly visit from a SS worker, for 6 weeks. We got SS support calls and I went on a Barnardos course (Talk 2 Teens I think it was.) I think the course helped me the most and her CAMHS. Time also. She does not suffer with anxiety now, failed all her GCSES, but is able to hold down a job and has friends.