Struggling with teen daughter and her anxiety

[Sara2000]

I need a safe space to offload. Yes , some of you will tell me what a shit parent I am. But you know what? I'm not, I'm just being honest about how I feel.

Dd aged 15 is under tier 3 CAMHs for anxiety, self harming and suicide ideation. We are paying for counselling and CBT which she says is going well. I am just finding it so hard to live with.

She is rude and hostile pretty much all the time. She spends 90% of her time in her room playing online games. She has a group of online friends and 2 real life school friends. Of course the pandemic hasn't helped, but she never wants to go anywhere. I am at a loss. Her life at the weekend consists of her laptop, coming down for some food and grunting at us, back up to her room.

She has just been diagnosed with a vitamin D deficiency and will be on high strength vitamin D for 2 months, having sat in her dark room for 6 months. .

She hates school and moans about it constantly, even had a short spell of school refusal in september. She does little or no school work despite doing GCSEs.

She wears hoodies and tracksuit bottoms and looks like a teenage boy. I give her money to buy clothes and they sit in her wardrobe. Her room is a tip.

I feel like her staff. I am here to cook, clean and serve but other than that, surplus to requirement. I pick her up from school and she sits staring at her phone like I'm a bloody uber driver. It's just take, take, take. I hate it. Every interaction we have is loaded and ends in an argument. Yes, I am aware that's probably not surprising.

Today I had to coax her out of the house. We were taking the dog for a walk and she started crying because I didn't know exactly where we were going. we bumped into some old friends and she just stood there ignoring my friends daughter who she has known since she was 4.

I am worn down by it. I know she has anxiety and I am sure a vitamin D deficiency doesnt help. But I have no idea how to deal with her, what to say and whether I should be forcing her out of her room. We tried to introduce a weekly film watching session but she refused.

I ask how her counselling is going and what they do and she takes great pleasure in not saying. I don't mean details as clearly that's not my business , but just generally what is done. Its £60 a week and I am shut out of it.

I am so fucked off with it all. I am done with walking on egg shells and biting my tongue. I dont think I have any tongue left to bloody bite. She is unbearable.

How do you get through this delightful stage? Give me a whinger baby or a tantrumming toddler baby day.

I need to hear from those of you with teens with mental health difficulties. Help!

@mrshoho. It is so hard. It really is. I know exactly what you mean about not meeting potential. Your words about the skikey6, happy, chatty girl struck me. It's like DD is a different person. A shadow of herself. Dod your DD have developmental delays? My Dd didnt and that was the reason CAMHs have for not diagnosing her with ASD. I am just curious to know if this is always the case or just due to the test they use. Someone told me the DISCO assessment is better for girls and ASD. In some ways though I'd rather not have a diagnosis as that would mean this is it. I want that lovely girl back.

Thank you @BCBG.

No idea where the strikey6 came from

News to say to everyone - please don't worry about your child's online life! I was like you and horrified about time spent on minectaft or watching you tubers etc but psychiatrist tells me that neurodiverse children actually benefit from their online life; it calms them, helps them focus and process, and occupies their brains - far better than just sitting around or moping. He says it's an essential part of their growing up. And DD is now flying at university where two years ago we didn't think she would even stay at school long enough to get A levels. So there is hope.

My son is 15 and suffers from anxiety (as do I and I sadly feel he has inherited it from me which makes me feel a failure).
3 years ago we were in a very bad place with his anxiety and school refusal, it was an awful 12-15 months of daily battles.
However, although he will always suffer on/off from anxiety as that’s his basic make up he is in a much, much better place.
The two things which were a complete turn around for him was 12 weeks of counselling and CBD oil capsules.
You are doing a great job, it’s such hard work.

I know what you mean about the ASD diagnosis but for us it just helped to understand how she is. I went on a couple of asd parent courses run by a local charity even before her diagnosis and the sensory issues and behaviour traits were so relatable. It was a 4 week course and I think I cried during each one and then also had an individual talk that helped me so much. One piece of advice was that socially dd was probably 2 years behind her peers and to view her more of a 12/13 year old. This helped take the pressure off my expectations and that it was really ok to give extra support rather than think she should be more independent. They also gave me hope that it won't always be like this just that it may take longer for her to reach adulthood.

My dd was a model baby and toddler. No problems at nursery or for the first years of primary. She was the one who was full of confidence and chosen for the singing and speaking roles etc. When she was 8 she suddenly developed eating issues and after counselling we were told it was more anxiety than an eating disorder. That all calmed down and then from about year 6 she became more and more quiet and withdrawn from friends. She now only has 2 good school friends. I think it was around then her differences became noticeable to her peers and her confidence and self esteem were really knocked. Sorry for rambling but hope it helps somewhat.

Thank you BCBG that is really good to hear and what we hope for our dd.

I think this sounds like a really difficult situation and I get you just want to vent. I wonder about autism too? My DD is not ASD but has been a cow bag today so I've retreated and been pleasant but no more, I can't be arsed with the response I get for suggesting she do anything...

I was very like your DD at that age, very very anxious, socially immature, sensory issues, school refusal.

I am 99% certain I am on the autistic spectrum. I probably wouldn't have passed an ADOS at that age either, but I was excellent at masking (which drained the life out of me).

I have an autistic child and all my reading and research around him made me realise that his neurodiversity in all likelihood came from me. I am v high func and would be deemed Aspergers back in the day but now everyone is under the ASD umbrella and I think that is much better and less stigmatising for everyone.

I want you to know that I found my way eventually. I got a hold of my issues enough to do ok at school, though I waited until the last minute. Went to a good uni. Found my niche. Worked in a demanding depression for years before having a family.

Your daughter can come round from this. You are doing the right thing by asking on here about her, it shows you are an excellent mum and open to advice.

@mintyfreshh

I was very like your DD at that age, very very anxious, socially immature, sensory issues, school refusal.

I am 99% certain I am on the autistic spectrum. I probably wouldn't have passed an ADOS at that age either, but I was excellent at masking (which drained the life out of me).

I have an autistic child and all my reading and research around him made me realise that his neurodiversity in all likelihood came from me. I am v high func and would be deemed Aspergers back in the day but now everyone is under the ASD umbrella and I think that is much better and less stigmatising for everyone.

I want you to know that I found my way eventually. I got a hold of my issues enough to do ok at school, though I waited until the last minute. Went to a good uni. Found my niche. Worked in a demanding depression for years before having a family.

Your daughter can come round from this. You are doing the right thing by asking on here about her, it shows you are an excellent mum and open to advice.

PROFESSION, not depression

Another perspective from someone with who suffered from severe mental health difficulties as a teen. It's so all consumingly selfish and self involved. As a depressed teen, I was completely incapable of seeing anyone else's point of view.

At some deep level, i also really wanted my parents to be able to fix me, to read my mind and I just couldn't cope with the fact they couldn't.

They did help me though, by just loving me endlessly and by never giving up on me. I was awful, but I knew how much they loved me and that's what got me through my darkest times.

I get it OP my daughter has severe anxiety & probably depression too laid in bed for two years on her phone dropped out of college twice now and did not a single jot of work for her GCSEs before that so got three.
Sleeps all day and finds food at night like a little mouse. Room like landfill even days after I convince her to let me tidy it.
Luckily for me she's not sullen or horrible to me.

I've started to detach myself from it as I can only do so much (like you everything I can think of and a lot of cash thrown at the issue too) and ultimately it's their life.
I can't empathise as have always had robust good mental health but family members on both her dads and my side are depressed and prone to anxiety.

I managed to totally lower my expectations to zero and get myself to an ambivalent place plus assuming I'll have her living here indefinitely (she's 18)...

It's hard. Keep loving them even when they are unlovable seems to be the collective wisdom.

I’ve got the 14 yr old version - recent ASD diagnosis and didn’t show strong symptoms until 12- and the developmental delay thing sounds very odd. Many girls have no issue with developmental milestones at all ( and like my DC, walk and talk early) and learn to copy social skills and mask until the wheels fall off at secondary , due to the increased social and sensory demands there.

I know exactly what you mean about being ‘staff’. Sometimes I just feel like a taxi-driver, a maid and an emotional punchbag. However, with the help of CAMHS, an autism specialist and school-support, things are slowly improving. In our case, the shock of the autism diagnosis and the suicidal ideation took a lot to come to terms with as parents and I do worry about the future.

One thing I have found useful is to use a book to write down things that my DC needs to hear, rather than me saying them sometimes. It’s very easy to get sidetracked by the rudeness, aggression and hostility sometimes. I have found that this takes some of the emotion and sensory overload away and means that DC can think about it in their own time.

- I know how hard it is and how your own mental health takes a kicking.

There's a huge link between anxiety (and eating issues but don't know if that's relevant in your daughter's case) and undiagnosed ASC in teenage girls.

In terms of the comments abour developmental delays - ASC is a developmental condition so symptoms must be present/function must be affected since childhood. This doesn't have to present itself as missing milestones as such. It's tricky as girls can often mask any difficulties they are experiencing. It can be easy to miss until the teenage years when demands on the young person outstrip their resources and you start to see anxiety often alongside eating and self harm issues. It may be the case that looking back, parents spot things they may have missed at the time.

We completed the ADOS assessment last year and then this year we did a screening worksheet designed to identify early markers of ASD. There were none. She walked and talked early. No regression. Went to nursery at 9 months , normal amount of separation anxiety at stages but not consistent, no issues with playing or sharing or emotional regulation. The only little marker was twice in primary school I had teachers say she preferred to be alone or didnt seem to know how to be with others sometimes. That was in the whole 7 years she was there. Things went wrong from year 6 (she is now year 10) when she had no friends. But until that point she hung out with various groups albeit a bit hit and miss. Although friends say the same. She tells me she first felt anxiety about going into the playground from year 3. She now finds school very difficult but goes in. She has s lovely group of friends but she has little to do with them outside of school.

I have one of these too, diagnosed with ASD at 13 and now suffering anxiety and writing about suicide and self-harm in an online journal. she also says she feels disconnected from everything which seems to be linked to severe abuse (so that has made me feel like the worse mother ever) She sees a school counsellor. The only thing that has improved things slightly is meeting her boyfriend, at least she is doing things with him rather than sitting in her room 24/7

@misselphaba

There's a huge link between anxiety (and eating issues but don't know if that's relevant in your daughter's case) and undiagnosed ASC in teenage girls.

In terms of the comments abour developmental delays - ASC is a developmental condition so symptoms must be present/function must be affected since childhood. This doesn't have to present itself as missing milestones as such. It's tricky as girls can often mask any difficulties they are experiencing. It can be easy to miss until the teenage years when demands on the young person outstrip their resources and you start to see anxiety often alongside eating and self harm issues. It may be the case that looking back, parents spot things they may have missed at the time.

@misselphaba has put it perfectly. My DD struggled with friendships because - and especially as a teen - conversations are fast moving and she finds it hard to contribute, or contributes too much and too dominantly (hyper focus), studies everyone and mimics behaviours and trends but then came across as inauthentic etc - it's a minefield because kids with both conditions can struggle to pick up social clues early enough in their development to let them develop sound friendships - and my DD was very academic and very good at masking her struggles, so school just thought she was a high achiever who put too much pressure on herself. It was only when she reached total meltdown post gcse that we even began to seriously process what was wrong, and it took more than another valuable school year before she was diagnosed and began Ritalin. There are some old threads that chronicle her struggle. But the most important thing is that she is coming through t and your DD will too with help. Incidentally another good piece of advice from our psych was to recognise that when she came back from school she would be absolutely exhausted and that's when they just want to be let be. They know they are being 'rude' but it is their safe space to stop masking. Somewhere there is a 'shake the bottle' analogy I'll see if I can find it.

This puts it really well ... www.kathybrodie.com/guest-post/autism-and-the-delayed-effect/

Thank you all. I know I started this thread like some crazy , uncaring mother. But I really am at the end of my tether. Your kind words , sharing of personal experiences and reassurance have calmed me down and just what I needed. I just had the first decent conversation I have had with DD for days.

The information about needing to be alone after sxhool resonated with me, DD is exhausted when she gets home. It's one of the reasons she's had a blood test recently and when they found the low vitamin D levels. She says she wears a mask when she is out to pretend shes ok. She hates crowds and people.

Re the ASD assessment. I believe (I am not an expert) that the issue was that we dont remember any issues from when she was under 5. She played normally, had friends etc. I even dug other nursery reports to see if there was anything different. I would say her issues with friendships started in primary at year 3, there were fewer invites to parties and she looked different. Very tom boyish and stood out.

Hi I am so sorry you are going through this. I am a single mother and I feel terrible and worried all of the time. Don’t punish yourself for slapping her. We all do it.

I have a nightmare teenage boy who has an answer for everything, stays in his room, eats his meals there and only talks to me when he wants £££ tonight I caught him smoking out of his bedroom window . I can hear him now and I assume he is trying to hide something before I find it tomorrow. He can be extremely unpleasant, rude, obnoxious & patronising . At times I don’t know if I can go on and then he is nice for 2 weeks .

Be calm
Punish but not too much. Short periods
Walk away if she is angry and pick it up later .
Set out behaviours which are acceptable. De pers alias it .

Best wishes !

Dd2 is 17 now and has been taking amitryptilene for almost 2 years. She’s been much better. She’s always had what would be described as an anxiety disorder (from 10ish) but we could usually talk her down. Developed into full blown OCD around 14/15. She’s had great support though - she sees a psych for her prescription and a counsellor every month or so. She’s very good at recognizing when her symptoms start flaring and she needs more support. It’s hard.
She went through the very typical ‘not a girl’ stage (I think she lived in grey hoodies for three years) and really struggled with onset of puberty (full meltdowns around periods etc) but it’s all time, support and agreeing that it’s shit but you learn to get on with it.
These days she’s committed to removing the stigma around mental health and also a fairly robust feminist in that she no longer gives any credence to gender conformity and is entirely comfortable with short hair and boots, and happy to scoff loudly at anyone suggesting that this makes her less female.
She lives reasonably well with anxiety now. It doesn’t stop her doing anything. She won’t let it control her.
Go back and ask for more support. Puberty is EXACTLY when anxiety disorders get worse in girls, and she deserves someone to help her fight it.

My eldest daughter was similar to yours. She's 21 and thriving now and just had her art work exhibited in New York. It turned out she was dyslexic and dyspraxic but her anxiety sort of masked it. Also she was much better being at college. I think that you mustn't feel like she's not going to amount to much because of it. She will change. Just keep up communication and try not to pick battles over little things that annoy and frustrate you ( difficult) but concentrate on the bigger picture of the relationship.

@Sara2000 so glad you had a chat but your poor darling DD I understand that need for a mask so well. She does need to be re-assessed - my DD's ASD is not the main issue the ADHD is. She finds or found life overwhelming at times because of sensory overload and it is a condition that is often hard to spot in girls although great strides are now being g made. Keep the dialogue going gently and just keep loving her the way you are - it's horrible to feel at the end of your tether and I cried many times, but we got through it. Incidentally you may already know this but for most girls the hyperactivity but is missing so it's ADD really (inattentjve type). DD could and did concentrate on lessons but the post lesson exhaustion led to social difficulties with peers and meltdowns at home. I'm sorry to say though that I suspect a private assessment is needed.

Really glad that you managed to have a good conversation and feel better, OP. If she is constantly masking she must be exhausted- and of course that would have an effect on her temper too.

I’m watching this with a mixture of empathy and fear as I can see this is where we’re heading with my 11 year old.
School refusal, meltdowns over clothes, staying in room for hours (reading so on face value something to encourage but she’s spending so much time away from reality)
Not wanting to go out-admittedly the only things on offer at the moment are walks but she was like this pre lockdown too.
Very wearing mixture of not wanting to ‘do’ anything with me during the day but then wanting cuddles and reassurance for hours at bedtime.
Any advice on how to sort things out now before they get worse would be welcome