My 14yr old dd is lying to me about things, how do we resolve it - CUSTY!!!!!!??????

[Wisteria]

and it's always silly little things to try to 'get away with it' - her words. Last night she was trying to explain why she had misled me about her activities at the weekend and then, as soon as she realised that I wasn't going to allow her to go to something I'd previously agreed to (because the situation has changed from what I was told when I agreed), she tried to make out that she didn't know the full facts when she'd asked me, which was patently untrue.

I have tried to impress upon her the importance of trust and the fact that as she grows up we need to know that she is truthful so we know where she is, who with etc in case anything happens. At present I don't trust her at all and it breaks my heart.

I'm furious with myself because last night I lost my temper with her over it and shouted at her. We only had the same convo 3 weeks ago over something else and she was grounded for a week but I'm aware that grounding is not such an effective punishment in the winter as it gets dark so quickly that they don't tend to go out as much.
How can I regain the trust between us because at present I feel as though I am losing her and I'm not coping with it terribly well.

BB, I don't think that Wisteria is being too strict, she has clearly said that she is in the situation of building trust back up with her daughter after a series of events, not that this is the case all the time.

At least If you let her do things, she'll tell you where she is, I sugest if you make this volintary. Like if I were to go out i'd say-

Dad i'm going out with X to Z then staying at Q's house, can you please pick me up in the morning.

or

Dad i'm going out to the park to meet Q i'll be back at such a time if i'm late or staying round a friends i'll call.

In the end it was just I'm going out i'll see you later call me if you need me.

The thing is because i was honest and i set the boundries he always knew where i was who i was with when i would be home et. If the plans changed i'd give a quick call just to keep him informed. He never worried and i never got in trouble. Also I had a loads of fun!

Otherwise she will go behind your back and sneaking off saying she'll be one place but be in anther etc. If she does this and does get into a sticky situation you wont have a clue where she is.

I think your daughter lies because she feels its the only way she'll be able to do the same activities as her peers. If she told the truth you'd just say no. If you weren't as strict she wouldn't feel that she had to hide things from you.

BB I think the difference there is that you were honest with your dad. Wisteria's dd is not being honest. I'm sure that if her dd said what you'd said and Wisteria was sure she could be trusted, she'd let her go. But her dd has proved that she is prepared to lie and be deceptive in order to do what she wants (regardless of whether she feels her mum would let her or not) so Wisteria can't just accept her word.

Wisteria, I don't think you are being too strict. I have a 13yo ds who has been lying about certain things. I do appreciate it is probably a phase, but it does him no harm to learn that, if he lies, I am unlikely to believe him even when he's telling the truth.

You set the boundaries, bb? That's the wrong way round, you know!

And Wisty's daughter is not being honest. That's the problem.

I think i'm just seeing it more from your daughters point of view. As apposed to a parent. Because it was only 6 years ago when i was 14.

I think because i had friends with strict parents. Or maybe not strict but slightly over protective. They felt that they were always missing out when they weren't able to stay out ass late, go places etc. They would lie too.

WW- what i mean is i didn't ask if i could do things, I'd just state my plans for the night. Weekend.

I'd come home and say i'm doing this this evening, i'll be back at so and so.

Or My dad would ask what are you up to? I'd tell him and that was it really.

My dads old He wasn't a young parent, he's also a teacher so its not as if he didn't care. He just didn't feel the need to to police me. I'm very idependant for it.

Berry.
Firstly, I have not been overly strict with her in the past, and all the things that she wants to do, she is generally allowed to, or would be as long as I think she is safe and she stops the blardy lies...

The problem at the moment is that she is not even being honest when given every opportunity to be so.

I don't think your Dad was right to allow you to set the boundaries but if you were honest etc, then fair enough, his call. Your upbringing appears to be very similar to the girl who had the sleepover. I don't have an issue with them having a drink at home with parental supervision. What worries me in this instance is that there was no one there to pick up any pieces if one of them had had too much and needed medical treatment. I have seen it happen and it is not pleasant.

Like you say, you are looking at it from her point of view which is natural for you but I bet you anything you will not look at it like that when you are the parent of the teen. I don't want to stop her having fun, I just want her to be safe and know that she can look after herself. At the present time I don't think she can.

Freckle- the reason why i was honest is because i had no reason to lie as i was allowed to do things.

I can understand why Wisteria is frustrated but i think its only because her DD is pushing for more freedom.

She doesn't feel like she can be honest. She probably desperately wants to fit in with her friends and doesn't want to be the one always missing out. But by lying it holding her back further because her mum is loosing trust in her, resulting in her being further monitored etc.

I guess it has become a cycle. Maybe you should do some role reversal with DD and try and get her to see it from your side and you from hers. Ask her what she would do if she were you. What she thinks are sensible ways about gong arround arrangements etc.
You might be able to brake the cycle and the lying will stop. Punishments don't really work. Talking does.

It wasn't just my Dad friends of other parents took that view. And sure we did things we weren't ment to but our parents always knew where we were and knew they could contact us.

All i'm trying to do is offer another opinion. Because from your OP what you are doing isn't working so I thought maybe if I could offer a different view it may help.

I dont really go for the argument that teenagers should be allowed to do what they want, so that they wont lie or do worse later.

No, neither do I.

BB, what if you had done things you knew you weren't allowed to and your dad found out? Do you think he would have been as laid back and calm about your announcing your plans for the evening/weekend? No, he would have wanted chapter and verse and may even then have imposed some restrictions.

Teenagers need boundaries as much as toddlers. And they have to know what are the consequences of breaching those boundaries and how lying is unacceptable.

It isn't all black and white - as in my parents were pretty liberal and so I didn't feel the need to rebel/go off the tracks, but my friends' parents were really strict and so they did. It really depends on the individual child, knowing whether they are likely to be strong enough to resist peer pressure, will they be vulnerable, are they mature enough to come to a sensible (as in not putting themselves in danger) decision.

Some children with strict parents will not rebel simply because it's not in their nature. Others with liberal parents will because they are bolshy little so-and-sos.

You have to parent according to your child's character - what works with one child won't with another, even within the same family.

I do appreciate what you say BB, but I don't think you have grasped what the real issue is.

We do talk, all the time. She knows she can tell me anything, and I mean anything.

The freedom is there, waiting for her as soon as she is honest. I think lying is slightly endemic in teens anyway but it is the thing I have the biggest issue with.

Last night was the test and she f'ed it up. My original question is what is the next step as far as punishment goes? I certainly don't agree with what you appear to be saying which, if I understand correctly, is that my punishments haven't worked therefore don't give her any. My parents eventually 'gave up' on me and I translated that as lack of love.

She is in no doubt that we love her and are doing all this to keep her safe - she understands why she is being punished and I feel sure that we will get there but was asking other Mums which other punishments are available, or what they have found successful in their 'teen experience'.

Sorry i read it as you wanted to resolve the lying. So i just wanted to address the reason that your DD lies. And if she felt that she didn't have to lie she wouldn't.

I didn't realise you were looking for more punishments in antisipation(sp?) that she will continue to lie.

I thought a better approach would be to address the problem to stop it happening therefore there would be no need to be punished.

'How can I regain the trust between us because at present I feel as though I am losing her and I'm not coping with it terribly well'

I just feel that children/teenagers who are constantly punished resent their parents.

I'm going to shut up now because nobody agrees with me. But thats just how i feel.

Freckle- my dad new very well that most of the time i got up to no good, i was a teenager after all. He would not condone it, his approach was that teenagers like to experiment etc. and by keeping me under lock and key wasnt going to stop this, i would just resent him.
Teenagers are always going to do things there parents do not agree with. Thats life.

All i was trying to say is that because i had trust from the start i didn't abuse it.
I would party hard but also worked hard at school and had a weekend job. I had a good balance.

everyone is different and has differnt aproaches to parenting. What works for one. wont work for another. All i'm saying is that i and many of my friends are proof that more relaxed parenting works. It doesn't mean the parent doesn't care or has 'given up'.

so sorry i missed this - couldnt get onto mumsnet late last night don't know why.

its really hard to make any comment at all. just that its about management of the person. my son ( who is nearly 18) when he was late 14 nearly 15 pushed me so far i called social services and begged them to take him away - of course they told me not to be silly and everyone INC. most of mumsnet told me that smoking weed wasn't so bad - better than getting shitfaced and being in danger.

but its really hard when you see your son turn into a cockhead of supreme proportions.

so i managed it.

we had long talks which basically said - cut the shit - my priority is your safety and the continuity of the family unit. so no weed in front of bro & sis. none in house. none on weekdays.

weekend curfue was 11 or 12pm - i took him to wherever and i picked him up.

sometimes i picked him up completely wankered with his friends. once he got off train shitfaced at wrong stop - i went to get him - he called me.

he called me becuase he could. it didn't matter to me what state he was in - it was one night - and not every week - i told him not to take the piss - he didn't.

so i allowed him mega freedom occasionally. planned to the best of my ability withhis safety in mind.

I HAVE dropped him off at a park - in the dark - i have also picked him up from same park at midnight.

dont know if that translates into anything that is useful. just a chat about getting going out late is ok if you can control as much as poss the circumstances.

when he said he stayed at someones house - always drove to persons house and insisted on talking to the mum or dad. this way i know it wasn't older bro or sis on phone feeding me bullshit. the parent had met me and there was an implied "my son is your responsability for this night" - just by meeting. and son knew that i was crazy arse bitch mother who whould do horrible thing like meet the parents of his friends when he was 15 years old - thats not cool!

but i bought him alchohol. i knew how much i was buying, i knew where he was going to be, who with and for how long - NOW HOW many MUMS can actually say that? I knew he would call me - he did.

this wasn't even a weekly occurance - 2 - 3 weeks the weeks in between he babysat his 12 yo bro & sis whilst i got wankered with his dad - then when he went out - i stayed sober - didn't go out all weekend and catered for his social life. he understood that this was a big thing - work all week - get pissed at weekend twas a right! so he appreciated it and didn#t take piss.

hope that is of use? rather than some random life custy story!

Aww thanks everyone - we've been out together at a gig all afternoon and been getting on brilliantly.

BB - sorry, what I've said to you sounded patronising and it really wasn't supposed to. The thing is, she had a great deal of freedom last year, complete, utter trust and she buggered it up bigstyle. I think what you've said rings true however, she can't afford to put another step wrong.

I am worried that she still can't seem to take a stand against her friends when they try to 'lead' her astray. Had she called me as promised last night to say - oh, they're not going to be back until later than the agreed curfew mum etc - we could have sorted something out and she wouldn't be in trouble now.

I think we will work it out, but I have to punish her for lying this time as that is what the problem is - can I stress that she will be allowed out after dark and later on etc as soon as I know she will keep me informed of any changes of plan and we have an understanding.

Custy - you are great Mum - and I love your stories x

Thanks for all your viewpoints though, it is good to get a broad band perspective x

Strawberry!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Another thing wisty, she's still got a lot of growing up to do, and one day, maybe quite soon she'll get who she is sorted and all this will stop!
A went through all this right up to this summer hols, when she was 15, and over the 6 week holidays she blossomed and started reflecting on what she wanted to do - this term she is the one all her dippy mates want to be like!
A lot of A's problems were coming from her caring a great deal about her mates at about the same time as a couple of them were going off the rails a bit and she sort of took it on herself to be there so they didn't do anything dangerous. One of them has really matured this year, and is back on track, unfortunately the other is just getting worse(somewhat like your DD's friend whose dad seems happy not to know what is going on). A has realised that her mate is doing what she does for attention from her mum and dad and nothing she can do will stop that situation playing itself out, so she's decided to pull away and just be there if said mate needs her later -A year ago she wouldn't have reasoned it out like that, instead she would have covered for her and got herself into trouble.
Lisa X

Yes, I have a feeling that my dd is doing this a little, we've had some great chats this weekend and I do feel that we're getting somewhere - it helped that we met up with my friend and her daughter yesterday and they were talking about trust. Her daughter (16 this year) is regularly out until all hours at the weekend but has always let her Mum know where she is, who she's with etc. Her mum trusts that she will always keep her updated and she does so, no probs.

This is what I am aiming for over the next year or few! We'll wait and see what happens!!