My 14yr old dd is lying to me about things, how do we resolve it - CUSTY!!!!!!??????

[Wisteria]

and it's always silly little things to try to 'get away with it' - her words. Last night she was trying to explain why she had misled me about her activities at the weekend and then, as soon as she realised that I wasn't going to allow her to go to something I'd previously agreed to (because the situation has changed from what I was told when I agreed), she tried to make out that she didn't know the full facts when she'd asked me, which was patently untrue.

I have tried to impress upon her the importance of trust and the fact that as she grows up we need to know that she is truthful so we know where she is, who with etc in case anything happens. At present I don't trust her at all and it breaks my heart.

I'm furious with myself because last night I lost my temper with her over it and shouted at her. We only had the same convo 3 weeks ago over something else and she was grounded for a week but I'm aware that grounding is not such an effective punishment in the winter as it gets dark so quickly that they don't tend to go out as much.
How can I regain the trust between us because at present I feel as though I am losing her and I'm not coping with it terribly well.

????? the thing is if you just say NO to everything she does in her teenage years then she will just be as bad when she is legal to do all the things you're scared of her doing.my mother was way too leniant with me when i was a teenager and i was horrendous.yet my auntie was way too strict with my cousin,i may have lived way too young, but i have been with my partner for nearly 7 years now, we have 2 beautiful kids age 4 and nearly 2 and i am very content with my life.on the other hande my cousin has been a complete fuck up since she was 17 through rebelling against her mum because she couldnt piss without her knowing.she is going through a very rough time which i wont delve into and has 6 weeks before she gives birth.I am going to try as my daughter gets older to find a happy medium when it comes to letting her do things.

have you heard anything?

Well I waited until 9.10, called her - she was clearly still out. I asked her why she hadn't text me/ called me to say she couldn't make it back on time and she told yet another bloody lie.

She then said they were getting the bus back as it was late; I told her she had 2 choices, she either came home now (here and forgo sleepover) or she could miss the under 18s disco in half term that I's said she could go to. She chose the disco and so I went out and picked all 6 of them up from the bus stop, dropped them back at the sleepover and have told her to enjoy tonight as she is certainly grounded again.

Yes, I made it perfectly clear she had to keep promises tonight if she wanted to regain my trust and she assured me she would.

I appreciate what you say Fawkeoff (as a very rebellious teen myself from an overbearingly strict household) but can assure you she has had a great deal of freedom but has abused it - this is the culmination of a few things ove the last year and believe me, I wish she could have more freedom. If I could trust her, she would.
Having terrible problems with this site so not posting as quickly as I would like to!

Well I waited until 9.10, called her - she was clearly still out. I asked her why she hadn't text me/ called me to say she couldn't make it back on time and she told yet another bloody lie.

She then said they were getting the bus back as it was late; I told her she had 2 choices, she either came home now (here and forgo sleepover) or she could miss the under 18s disco in half term that I's said she could go to. She chose the disco and so I went out and picked all 6 of them up from the bus stop, dropped them back at the sleepover and have told her to enjoy tonight as she is certainly grounded again.

Yes, I made it perfectly clear she had to keep promises tonight if she wanted to regain my trust and she assured me she would.

I appreciate what you say Fawkeoff (as a very rebellious teen myself from an overbearingly strict household) but can assure you she has had a reasonable amount of freedom but has abused it - this is the culmination of a few things ove the last year and believe me, I wish she could have more freedom. If I could trust her, she would.
Having terrible problems with this site so not posting as quickly as I would like to!

Well I waited until 9.10, called her - she was clearly still out. I asked her why she hadn't text me/ called me to say she couldn't make it back on time and she told yet another bloody lie.

She then said they were getting the bus back as it was late; I told her she had 2 choices, she either came home now (here and forgo sleepover) or she could miss the under 18s disco in half term that I's said she could go to. She chose the disco and so I went out and picked all 6 of them up from the bus stop, dropped them back at the sleepover and have told her to enjoy tonight as she is certainly grounded again.

Yes, I made it perfectly clear she had to keep promises tonight if she wanted to regain my trust and she assured me she would.

I appreciate what you say Fawkeoff (as a very rebellious teen myself from an overbearingly strict household) but can assure you she has had a reasonable amount of freedom but has abused it - this is the culmination of a few things ove the last year and believe me, I wish she could have more freedom. If I could trust her, she would.
Having terrible problems with this site so not posting as quickly as I would like to!

I totally understand how you feel but I have a bit of sympathy for her about still being in the park late. She was with a group and if they weren't going back at 9, what was she to do?

She was daft to promise they would be back by 9 and she only promised so you would say yes. It wasn't a situation she was really in control of.

Difficult one!

Sorry to but in - don't have teenagers (yet) but I am intrigued by this hanging around the park thing.... I never did this as a teenager - too damn cold and wet and no parks anyway where I grew up! - so don't have any idea from personal experience why they want to do this.

But I do see lots of teenagers doing it around here and it seems to be the sort of thing that annoys people (because of the vandalism, litter, broken glass, etc, etc) and gives teenagers a bad name. At the moment I can't see me wanting to allow my kids to do this - AIBU?

well in her defence at least she wasn't pissed out of her head and messing around with random boys.i do understand that you are having trust issues with her at the moment,and she obviously wouldn't have rang you,but i agree with budababe she was under peer pressure and didnt want to lose face in front of her mates.shouldn't you also be annoyed at the parents that dont give a shit that the minors they are supposed to be keeping safe fr the night are out on a park at that time of night.

I think that you were in a tricky situation but agree with Budababe about the group control thing. Can't help but think it would have been better to speak to someone in control of the sleepover beforehand.

I can't imagine that your daughter would have been able to persuade a group of 5 others to go home when they were possibly allowed out early and impossible for her to just leave and come home alone.

Of course, she should have called you to explain, as you told her (just remembered that bit ).

What has lead to all this? Am squirreling all information away for future years.

I'm with the fawkeoff on this one. Some freedom is essential to help kids grow up and face the dangers out there. How are they ever going to know how to deal with the nutters and druggies out there if they don't go on public transport. As adults we sense who's a problem straight away. If they go straight to work or uni without those experiences they are left wide open to the first manipulator who comes their way.

I would encourage her to go out with the group more and, if she feels confident that she can tell you stuff, without you overreacting, you will then be able to give your opinion. My DD (at about 14) and school friends spent a summer in West London parks - shopping centres - and she learn't a lot from the expriences. Some friends stopped being friends. She learn't who was dependable, who liked to find or make trouble. They never stole (or I certainly wasn't told) but some of them did do stuff they was dangerous and because I didn't go ballistic when told, she kept telling me. In the end I would tell her to tell them not to do it and she has become a very strong character - who will say I'm not doing... whatever... cos they fuck u up. That's my two penneth.

and the giving a lift problem. Let her go on the bus but offer to pick up. Agree somewhere safe - but not by the meeting venue for the group. After the first time - I can guarantee you will end up with a car full of others who want a lift in your direction. Its the best way to really keep in touch with what the group is doing. It also sends a message to the tough kids who are looking for an income source "this kid has family watching out for her". Like burglary - if it's too much hard work - they move on and find easier more vulnerable targets.

I just feel so sorry for the teenagers with totally disinterested parents, or the parents who still think we live in the 1950s and explode if their child tries to live in the 2000s. Kids angry with their parent, stressed out at school, or school refusing are the best targets for pushers.. or so I hear.

I think 14 yr olds do lie to theri parents full stop.Even the lovely ones it seems to be built into them!Agree mostly with what custy says apart from not going for the ingredients as I am a profiterole freak so am with her softie dh on that!

Well thanks for all your input - all valuable and was this the first time, I would feel slightly differently - the fact is that this was a test of trust after the last few months of minor skirmishes/ trouble and she agreed that she would phone me to say if she was having probs getting back for 9 - I do understand peer pressure and she knows this. She is also extremely easily led which is what worries me and I fear for her safety.

I hate them hanging around the park but unfortunately it's what they do and it would be yet another barrier between us if I didn't allow it. Yes, I should have spoken to the 'responsible' adult first and it gets worse, as I called at 11.30 to make sure they were all ok and the Dad still wasn't back, despite my dd and the sleepover girl assuring me he was going to be there. The family situation is difficult and this girl has an awful lot more freedom than your average 13-14yr old as she lives on her own with her Dad and he is quite young, they've been through a rough time and are trying to get back on their feet - I like her and thought she was a good friend for my dd, she works hard at school and is easy to get along with, quite streetwise too, very anti-smoking etc.

The fact is she could have text me at 9 as agreed and on top of that she then lied again about not being able to text as her friends had no texts either - lie.

The issue is not what she is allowed to do, it's the fact that she is lying (even when she's being allowed to do something that previously was forbidden).

Can I just add that they all promised they'd be back for 9, not just my dd. Her friends also understand that she has been in trouble and that she is having to work at regaining the trust.

I am going to have a word with the father next time I see him anyway because it is unfair to allow things like this without informing the parents first.

So, I have taken her TV out of her room and she will be grounded over half term with no internet access. Please bear in mind that this is ongoing and not the first time, I just don't know what to do next. There seems little point in talking again - we only had the 'chat' 2 days ago.

I know the situation round here wisty, Not sure i would be happy with a soft as grease 14 yo hanging round any of the parks in Mansfield area - But, the point is if you stand back a bit, do you trust that she's not going to be hanging round with boys, drinking or generally being a bloody nuisance -if you do then you've got to communicate that to her and tool her up ready for the pressure from mates whose parents don't give a monkey's. Mine are far to young thank god, but I'm 'mum next door' for my neighbour's 15 yo and they were having similar trouble, so when the going to liquid/notts/sleepover things came up it was difficult for her mum to make the leap of faith and I was in the middle of them, Mum was worrying so much she couldn't see what kind of a person her daughter was(actually very sensible,anti drink/drugs,thinks all the boys she knows are a bit stupid and absolutely won't do anything she doesn't want)and was kind of projecting the things about her mates she didn't like onto her daughter.
A still gets grounded from time to time, but she is also given the trust and freedom to cock things up a bit(as you do)and that has built more trust between them as she's risen to the expectation that she'll do what she says she's doing.
Lisa X

you are probably thinking "shut the eff up fawke" but....you seem to be using harsh disciplinary methods at the moment,which is your call but whats going to happen IF her behaviour gets worse????, will she even care in the end because it will just be the "norm" for her

Oh dear - the young laid-back dad sounds like very bad news Are there other kids in that house or just her?

I think you've handled this incident very well, Wisty You're giving her chances and being firm and sensible when she doesn't take them.

Does the half-term grounding mean no disco either or just anything else? Does she get another chance after half-term?

(IMO kids this age shouldn't be out randomly in the evening in the winter anyway - it's not healthy for them, in lots of ways. Could she have a friend or 2 round to your house some evenings after half-term or would that be boring?)

Fawkeoff - I would never tell you that! Everything which you say is useful as it gives another perspective - dothe punishments really sound that harsh? - can I remind all of you that this is not the first second or third time that she has broken the trust and that, what went on last night was already a leap of faith for me as she has never been allowed out after dark before, that's why I made it so clear she had to contact me if they were out after 9.

The irony is that I want to give her more freedom as I agree that they need to make these mistakes (it's a bit longer since I was a teenager but I was never allowed to do anything so made a career out of lying, deceit etc!) but I can't give her the freedom unless is trusted. I picked her up this morning and she admitted she'd had half a bottle of lambrini (eeeww) at the house when they got back. I said thank you for telling me (she wasn't lying as she knows I would consider that too much anyway).

I don't know how else to prove to her that the truth is always better; no matter what it is.

Half term and this week she will be housebound I'm afraid but I'll make sure we do plenty together so she's not bored, I'll probably take her down to Devon or something for a few days - it doesn't feel so hard then

She has people here all the time and apparently all her friends like me so I'm not that embarrassing!

Lisa - we're not really that near Mansfield, more Selston, Underwood way and she has been given the chances to prove herself, she just keeps cocking it up - which just tells me she's not old enough for it/ not assertive enough yet.

WW, thank you, I think I'm being fair and she has to learn (before she goes out clubbing etc for real) that I am not a complete witch and I understand the need for experimentation etc. but on the understanding that she is honest with me so I know where she is. As Custy says, I don't care if she hates me at the moment as long as she is safe, as I love her, end of.

She's only allowed to go to QI/ Liquid in the hols anyway and she was well aware that that would be at risk if she 'mucked last night up.

Anyway I'm making Christmas cake now, so even though the atmos. in this house is rubbish, at least it smells nice!

We're going to her Dad's later to discuss it all with him. I've spoken to him this morning and we'll bash out something together (hopefully not her!).

(She's very sheepish and apologetic this morning)

It's a complete minefield isn't it? DS only 6 so I have it all ahead of me!

I think maybe the punishments are a bit harsh - BUT I don't know what went on before. However, you don't want a situation where she rebels against the rules whenever she is out as she know she will be grounded for a while anyway for something.

I think keeping the dialogue open and making sure she realises why you are doing it all may help. And just keep reiterating that it is the lying she is being punished for.

Nothing more to add really. Completely with Custy.

I don't think that there's anything wrong with being strict. My mum was and I'm fine. I'm strict and my children are fine. They know where the boundaries, bash against them from time to time, get a little more freedom or discipline dependent on what they do.

I agree that trust needs to be rebuilt and allowing her to carry one simply shows her that trust isn't a big deal.

But what I actually wanted to say was, what's wrong with her being bored? Maybe she'll think a little harder next time before going against what you say. She's still a child and as such needs her parents.

I think you're doing great.

Bud - yes it would be over harsh I agree but as I say we have already had issues, that I don't want to go into, and it is only the lying she is ever punished for.

mars thanks - I think sometimes we just need to hear that someone else agrees!

She will inevitably be bored for a bit anyway - yes you're right, maybe boredom is the way to go - shall ponder it some more.

She is now fine with me and has said she wished she hadn't done it, I don't think she even knows why she lies. I just said to her again that I want her to have more freedom and when she is trusted, she will get it.

I really think you are being too strict on your daughter. I had friends when who had parents like you and ended up being the ones that really going for it when they were leagally allowed to do things.

I was drinking at 14. And my dad was buying me alcohol by the age of 15 (not large amounts) but his thought was that he knew we all drank at the w/e and he'd prefer to buy it and know what we were drinking, than us get it from other means. Which we always would. I think a curfew of 9pm at 14 is a little strict.
Your daughter will start to resent you if she is unable to do things with her friends. She will feel left out, and thats an awful feeling. If you gave her more trust then she wouldn't feel that she had to lie to you.

She will drink probably try smoking and have sex, this is what teenagers do behind there parents backs.

What i'm trying to say is let her be a teenager now so that by the time she is 18 she doesn't go off the rails start taking drugs etc. because she finally has some freedom. I got all my fast living done when i was younger so when it came to my A levels drinking was boring and i actually did some work!

BB - I can't see what you mean.

I allow her to have a drink, I know she has tried smoking, no problem. She told me.

Have you read the entire thread? This is not about what she is allowed to do, it is about the fact that she is lying to me. I want her to be allowed to do more and she will be when she stops lying.

The problem is that she is soft and very influenced by peers into doing things that she doesn't necessarily want to do, and that is the crux of the matter...I need to know (as a caring and concerned loving parent) that she can stick up for herself and use her own mind, stop lying etc before she gets her freedom back.
The arse of it all is that she seems to agree with me!

Just read your profile , would have said exactly the same as you when my dd was little!

Believe me, it changes as they get older and you worry!