Teenage chat and interraction is hard work

[Fudgecakes]

I'm aware I'm probably the last person my teen dd wants to spend time with - but ffs, how hard can it be to have some chit-chat with yr mum?

Took dd out yesterday for an eyebrow shape and a coffee. Found her so hard to talk to...it felt like being in one of those toe curling episodes of The Undatables...long awkward silences, staring into space, all one sided from me desperately scrabbling for topics that were met with one word answers, eye rolling or the common teen response of a slightly aggressive "I don't know"

We're in that phase of 'parents get lost' and it makes me so sad. I don't get anything from her apart from attitude and I resent giving her my all with no return....not even the 'pleasure' of her company for a half hr coffee. It was plain she wanted to be anywhere else....yet she's all over me when she wants something. I feel really sad .

She just shuts herself away on her phone/listening to music/messing with hair or make up all day. She meets up with mates now and again, sleepovers etc....but she's checked out of family time completely. No TV with us, won't eat with us, excuses not to visit family ....yet she's nagging for a holiday but we've told her not booking anything til she's a nicer member of the family - she's really rude, self absorbed, confrontational, selfish and we just aren't rubbing along at all.

Are your teens similar? Have they checked out of your family? Do they come back?

How sad. I actually really enjoyed time when mine were teenagers. They’d been quite challenging around the ten years of age spot but then blossomed in their teens. They had excellent senses of humour and were fun. We tended to do more active things like walking but driving to dance lessons, collecting from school or after rugger was a chance for a really good gossip in the car.

Mine wouldn’t have eaten if they refused to eat with the family. Have phone off time; we were lucky with no mobile reception near here. Get her working alongside you cooking supper and helping with hanging the clothes out. No jobs means no clean clothes etc. I’d avoid confrontation, if possible just clear rules stated unemotionally.

Then maybe some nice things. A theatre trip. A cinema trip. Your nails. Anything to give you something positive to share and talk about.

I do plan that holiday with her involvement too. That’s something to engage and converse about. I’m not sure it should be a negative thing around punishing her for not being overly communicative by not having a holiday. It should be a shared excitement.

Thanks for your advice Cherry. I've suggested an exhaustive list of things we could do together... but she's not interested in anything.....she's either too lazy or "can't be bothered" or I think she thinks it's 'not cool' eg baking, arty stuff (she's only nearly 14) ...I'm sure others this age do these things?? I feel this us half the problem....we don't bond over anything...shared experiences create things to chat about

Re the holiday.....as she's not very pleasant to be around, I'm not spending shed loads to have a difficult week. On hols last year she kicked off frequently, was rude, acted bored a lot of the time, was buried in her phone and actually told me to get thr next flight home as she hated me. I feel she needs to learn no rewards for bad behaviour so we've chosen the holiday is the thing to go

Does she pay for her own phone contract? Or are you actually paying for her to be able to "escape family life".

Are you teaching her that what she is doing is wrong. That there will be consequences if it continues, or are you enabling and tolerating the behaviour. The not-booking-a-holiday thing has no immediate effect.

Are you modelling the behaviour you want her to have? She doesn't get to check-out, she needs to be eating meals with family, helping cook it and clear up after, doing laundry, changing the bedding... whatever "chores" require a partnership help to create a conversation space.

yes, I have 2 teenage daughters (17 and 18 now), no they have not checked-out of family life, it would not occur to them that they could shirk their responsibilities and still be rewarded with phone contracts/holidays etc...

Parenting is hard, but it is teaching them how to be decent human beings, and how to become independent and take care of their surroundings. win...win...

I agree with the others that you’re enabling this lifestyle for her that you hate. She doesn’t need to be your friend, you need to be her mum. New rules and she will kick off but she can’t keep acting like this. I would involve her in the discussions and help steer her to decide the rules to an extent but she needs to consider things like; How does she earn her phone? What tasks can she take responsibility for around the house? How is her behaviour now shaping the adult she is becoming?
It sounds like you may have read some teen books- perhaps re read and check the boundary advice etc. You need to stop trying to “win” her back

Hi Beyond. All you say really resonates with me. Yes....we enable this behaviour...you are right.

It needs to change....but my mood is low and I don't want a bad relationship to worsen....so I don't stir it up by setting up chores etc....sounds so weak when written down.

She's always been spikey and difficult and there have been so many arguments between us I try to do what I can to keep the peace....but it's not right as she's sat back on her arse with everything on a plate giving nothing back....and it's probably our fault

Not eating with you? In my house that's one of the key times that I get to chat with my sons. If they aren't hungry then they are expected to sit with a drink and chat. Does your dd cook her own meals or something? I wouldn't buy extra food to enable that.

Did she pay for her own eyebrow appointment? Did you go because she needed a lift/someone to drive and pay? I wouldn't do stuff like that if she was being so antisocial tbh.

I have 3 teens and my dd is very sweet to me but my sons are much harder. Ds1 only talks to me at meal times or if we are "trapped" together - eg we were at his school together. He's also MUCH better if his siblings are out the house/out of earshot. Them being around seems to put him on edge and make him clam up. His younger brother will chat at meals, in the car and is pretty chatty if he's playing video games without the headset. There's no eye contact but he's not going to leave the room either.

Baking and arty stuff I would do with younger DC - at nearly 14 she might have grown out of that unless it is a special interest? (one of my DC loves cooking)

But re things to talk about, my DS (same age as yours) and I chat about things in the news, politics, choosing options later in the academic year, general chat about people we know/his mates, local happenings, crack jokes etc.
Watch a TV show SHE has chosen, ask about her music.

It can be hard at this age as they are on the cusp of independence really, but once you have one or two shared interests then the chat about other things flows better.

Ultimately, don't stop trying. Even if she is non-communicative at the moment, somewhere deep inside she knows you are trying and that you are there for her and therefore one day she will make her way back :)

Oh and the help make dinner is a good one too. We always chat when doing that. Even if it is just crap about nothing really.

Isadora - you mention 'teen books'. Are there any that you would recommend in particular? (Am having similar problems with my own DD to those being experienced by Fudgecakes.)

14 is a horrible age, she'll get through it. I definitely wouldn't expect a 14 year old to want to do craft projects or baking - all they're interested in is their friends, school gossip, and likely music/fashion/TV/video games.

You have to accept that she'll 'hate' you for a while, and create boundaries.

Try to ignore it and act as if she is not being arsey/ spiteful/ angry - act as if she has spoken normally. Put a brave face on, try to be cheerful.
I'm not saying I did that when mine were teens, but I wish I had.
I wish I'd acted happy and busy with my 'exciting' life, it was very humdrum really, but being down and dragging yourself through life is a bad example. And shows they have the power to get to you.
Thankfully no mobiles in my day but teens still stroppy and arguing with each other.
They grow out of it, you just have to get through it. The above suggestions are good.

Thank you all so much for your input. You have all been so helpful and loads of useful, insightful advice in every post.

I need to find some resilience and not let all this upset me too much....I'm very sensitive and truly feel that sometimes she'll hate me forever! I just want to be her friend but I need to be her mum first and foremost....put the rules in place and steel my shoulders for the fall out. Hopefully in the long run family life will be better. Thanks all

Are you ever in the car alone together? Side by side conversations are often easier.

Tell her how you feel, that you love her and care about her. That you’re feeling that she’s finding family life difficult. Then just listen if she speaks.

I agree about more boundaries though, be firmer about family time.

I used to say to my teens that we all had to put up with all sorts in the outside world but in our house we should be very careful of each other’s feelings.

Teens are supposed to pull away, you know that. And it hurts!

Give her a hug, most importantly.

Fudgecakes - I identify with you. Ours has been holed up in her room on her phone most of the holidays. I agree with R44 and am just trying to enjoy the holiday regardless. Dd will (hopefully) grow out of it, but dh and me won’t get another break til Christmas and we can’t indulge this selfish moodiness. I wish she had a local job - we are in a coastal resort crying out for staff - that tipped her out of bed but nothing competes with the phone. So we leave her there and I console myself she isn’t costing us anything. When I see elderly people pushing other elderly people in wheelchairs, that’s where my sympathies go - not self absorbed teens with no thought for others. Agree however that it does make me sad, and I have a whinge to my own mum on our daily call - it’s therapy of sorts - then move on

Just to say I feel your pain OP and am reading the responses with interest. I am clinging to the mn mantra of This too will pass .

It's tricky to navigate... I know what to do, but not sure how to explain. And it depends on individual kid. Strategy is find something they care about, they think about, and encourage a conversation about that.

Plus any time they want to talk, you make time to listen. Even if it's deathly dull or boorish or unkind what they are saying.

Try to elicit their opinions & don't edit or disagree (bite your tongue). As last resort, ask for their advice about your own life or decisions. You'd be impressed how many opinions they have on that! You don't have to agree with anything they recommend (& try to avoid making it obvious if you do disagree), just ask them what they think & to describe their reasons & values in making that choice. These may become opportunities for leveraging their values a little bit one way or another.

Hi fudge,

My daughter is 14 very soon, so a similar age? I hear you, and I don't have the answers but there are some things I insist on and that is dinner at the table, with all of us. If I'm chatting with the other two (only slightly younger) and their dad she'll sometimes join in.

As for phone usage, I limit daily usage via an app called 'our pact'. Oddly enough it works better than yelling up the stairs for her to bring down her phone and having the ensuing argument. I can shut it down remotely and dictate what apps she can and can't have (so spotify for example I leave on as she likes to listen to it while she is doing homework). Rude behaviour and it gets shut down. She hung up on me once and I warned that if she ever did it again she'd lose her phone for a week and I made good that promise and she's never done it again.

I give her lifts to where she needs to get to (not 100% of the time but quite a bit...more than many on MH would recommend I'm sure!) as time in the car is time to chat. Of course mostly she doesn't talk, but on days when the mood strikes her we do chat. I text her funny stuff that I think will be amusing to her. Not all the time, but just occasionally.

I wake her in the mornings as it's just an opportunity to have a bland but pleasant interaction "good morning darling, time to get up"

I try to walk away when she gets unpleasant. I'm not perfect at that though.

But yeah, I totally get the personality transplant.

Just read your post. Thank goodness I'm not the only one.
I've got no words of advice, just grateful someone else feels the same way as me.

My 14 year old daughter is the same to me. I'm not a push over mum by any means and I understand and sympathise with all the stuff they have going on, but it's so difficult!!!

I finally flipped last night over something relatively small, but when someone keeps pushing it's a final little push that sends you over the edge. Now I feeling guilty, sad and got tears in my eyes. Sometimes I just want my little girl back.

Hi all. Thanks for your posts.....more great advice....and hugs to those going through the same. it's ups and downs here....I've made a few 'sharing' serve yourself dinners which have meant we've had to sit at table to eat together. That's worth doing then unless they participate at the table....no dinner. We've also managed to drag her down for a game of Triv which she enjoyed and that was great interraction. I got a lot if 'unwanted' chat tonight as she came into my bed as she couldn't sleep and started a convo about the planes we could hear overhead...umm...I've been longing for a chat but not at 3 in morning!! Now she's asleep and I'm wide awake

Interaction is good (just keep repeating like a mantra.. you might get to sleep )
sounds like you are putting some good strategies in place!

Not very helpful but my mum banged on about how awful I was as a teen. Prob was quite bad but she was a dragon. She continued telling stories about how awful I was until about 5 years ago. She’s now 80+. Two years ago she said out of the blue, “i suddenly realised I was probably going through the menopause when you were a teen, which may not have helped.” Spent my adult life staying away from her and hating her on many levels, though have never felt I didn’t love her. I have a 14 yr old do now and am determined not to demonise him as a terrible teen. Not saying that you are btw op. He’s a lovely boy, sometimes surly, quiet teen but on balance he’s great considering he’s a seething bed of hormones. Sometimes I get grumpy with him about a grunting response. But I try not to and succeed 9 times out of 10. But just as with a toddler it’s my job to suck it up and show some compassion, as much and as often as I can. Maybe I’m just lucky, for now!

My 17 year old is very very uncommunicative and uninterested in family life. We do what we can but it’s hard. Those people who are smugly saying that their teenagers aren’t like that — maybe you’re just lucky. I have two difficult teenagers and one almost perfect one. If I’d only had the tricky ones I’d have thought it was all my fault. Or vice versa.

Hi, I’ve just read your post and that is my daughter all over. I feel for you and I feel sad too. I feel redundant and abused. My mental health is suffering. Me and my husband argue lots. I don’t feel like we are a family. It’s constant battling and lots of emotional outbreaks from our daughter all over something silly usually. All the best. 🙂

I didn’t like my daughter much at 14. I loved her of course. She was rude and would roll her eyes at everything. Just be there when she does want to talk. It will pass. My daughter is now 16 and we’re so close. I’m tired, our chats are often at midnight when I’m struggling to keep my eyes open but it’s worth it. I advise her and give her my opinion and sometimes she listens but she always talks. Good luck, it gets better.