Help relationship with 15 year old son deteriorating!

[Tiredofsingleparenting]

It's the start of term and my son has already been late to school one day out of two, late to his basketball training, not brushed his teeth either night (only brushes them after 3/4 telling and me standing over him). I went through all his clothes and room, got him to help me, to help prepare him and only asked him to pack his pencil case and a copy book in his bag. But he didn't and went to school with an empty bag. He has to get the bus to school.

Aaaarghhh! Every single time that I do not stand over him, check him, he doesn't do it.

For example, his dentist said he was really neglecting his teeth. I spent over a month standing in the bathroom each time, every day after hauling him into the bathroom, with a timer, it takes me half an hour each time after I've cajoled him out of his room. If I ask him he lies about it. This is the same with everything, with remembering uniform, I have to hand hold everything and he gets cross with me too.

He doesn't want to do anything with me, only his friends or his Dad, I feel like the skivvy.

I just don't have the time to be doing all of this! I have a young toddler and a step child. I'm a single parent, his Dad hardly sees him. What do I do to turn this around? I've tried so many things and am sick of it.

Step back. Right back.

It's nuts to stand over a 15yo to get them to brush their teeth. He will enjoy winding you up.

If he is late, he tskes the punishmrnt. No uniform, the same. Misses basketball training, he loses.

Stop trying to micro manage him and he will come round.

Exactly what AF said.

Just to add, I know it's hard. I've been there with my three. It does get better but you have to give him space.

...... I know it's hard letting go when you know there will be negative consequences but you have to. These consequences are minor and probably short term. Let the school deal with their stuff and regarding teeth.... eventually his breath will be picked up by friends or girls etc. Boys have to make this break from their mothers..... having been so close to a female mother as a child, they have to break with you in order to develop sexually etc. It might be helpful to ask your partner to do some of the reminding. You just need to step back, you don't need to be a skivy or the teeth police.... just let it go. Decide you don't have to stress about it. Remember that this is a crucial bit of your parenting- letting them take control and to fail or to choose not to etc. By letting him do this now it enables him to learn while the stakes are fairly minor and he's safely at home. With you off his back your relationship will improve and he will feel less defensive and more in control and possibly step up. But even if not.... just remember the world is full of wonderful, successful, happy, fresh smelling loving men who were hideous, smell lazy little buggers during their youth! It all comes right in the end. Focus on the long game.... try and be more chilled and there for him at a distance and things will improve...... you will also not get so wound up. I've been there.... it's so hard but it will pass!! Big hug x

Thanks, that's the thing though. I have tried stepping back. With brushing teeth it took being taken aside by our dentist who was really worried about his teeth, and being told by him that unless I took charge and made sure it happened, he was going to be in serious difficulties with his teeth soon. I felt ashamed and cross. I stood over him for a month, then said if he didn't start doing it himself I took away privileges until I had none left to take away!

It's the same with everything else. The school I've left him get late detention, however he missed half of an important exam!

It's like every time I step back and loosen those reins, he totally drops the ball. In a two month period he lost two jackets, all his sports gear, 2 lunch boxes and his calculator. I took off his pocket money, I stopped him going to sports, I made him make back the money with odd jobs. But I had a boy then who had no money or freedom to engage with his friends, no sports to keep him active and healthy... it is a vicious cycle.

Thanks violet unfortunately his Dad just adds to the problems. He encourages my son to moan about me, indulges him totally, never gets him to brush his teeth and if he's been there a week in summer he comes back having not brushed his teeth at all. Sorry - not obsessed with teeth it just seems to be an obvious example! He tells his son that I'm not to be listened to and sends me nasty texts -he's not very nice.

...... that does sound really difficult! Have you tried asking him what he thinks? What he thinks should happen? Trying to sit tight and not say anything and really listen if he does say stuff. Asking him if he's ok etc and trying to find a way in that way. I know what you mean about the teeth and the terms work/ exam etc but just like a toddler who refusing to eat .... you simply cannot make them. At this age you can't make him do anything and without father support it's even harder. I would suggest that if his father is negative and undermining it's even more important for you to be calm and reasonable and just being there. It might be that there's no alternative but to sacrifice some stuff..... oral health/ school success etc for his general well being and relationships with you in the future. You son isn't blind, he knows what his father does in undermining you is wrong , even if it suits him at the moment. One day he will be able to look back and see who was the present and loving parent. It's a v tough situation but I can only say that often children who have gone through v difficult phases and shut a parent out, often come back in late teens for more parenting. If he screws up his exams etc he can repeat etc etc. You just have to get through with patience love and understanding and a massive helping of humour!!!! Literally it's often the only way to survive. If you want to pursue the teeth thing.... make it a joke between you. Find comedy series you can watch together ( even if you have to grit your teeth a bit?!) both myself and my sister had v difficult oldest children, both of whom have come back late teens/ early twenties back into the nest for love and advice etc. Just bide your time because there isn't a magic formula to force him to do these things! Play the long game. I totally remember how frustrating and all consuming it is. Xx

Violet, what wise and wonderful advice. Really heartening to hear for those of us with challenging teens

Thanks, I have had several chats with him. He's quite scatty but increasingly has been saying that 'he's trying' but not really wanting to engage. I think he'd rather put his head in the sand and let me and others pick up any pieces or get used to being a bit of a slob health wise.

One little bit of advice. When I had teens, I used to say: "Look, these are the facts, you are nearly adult and you can choose what you do about those facts; but I do trust you to do the right thing." Then stand back. They do have to learn by their mistakes to some degree. But I also think the knowledge that you trust and respect them is a useful one - even if you have your fingers crossed behind your back!! Standing over him and cajoling him just sends a message to him that he cannot be trusted to sort his own life out.

Your situation is compounded by a grossly unhelpful and undermining ex-spouse; and I am sorry that you have this additional burden. I still think that being quietly clear about the facts, reiterating how you love and trust him, then leaving him to make his own decisions is the way to go.

He is feeling like piggy on the middle (as well as being a teenager!) and needs you to be very clear and overt about your love for him and to hear that you are walking alongside him at this difficult time. Don't let the ex wind you up!!!

Sympathy OP. A friend told me today that 15 is in her opinion the hardest age for boys and for parents to deal with boys. I just had a go at DS2 (15) because I had asked and asked him nicely all bloody summer to tidy his room and he hadn't, so now, the day before school starts, in GCSE year, I have to stand over him like a witch and micromanage the chaos. He has ASD, so taking a step back would not help. Like your DS he's terrible with teeth and the dentist was really revolted by him and send him packing, which embarassed me, but short of standing over them, what can we do?

When I have energy I have long conversations with him, asking loads of questions (with a motive of boring him into submission) about whether he doesn't like the brush or the toothpaste etc etc, and asking him what he thinks will happen if his teeth rot and explaining about dental costs and levels of attractiveness not just to potential partners but to employers. But it's exhausting keeping that up.

Blossom I love that 'these are the facts' line. Will try that on DS.

I feel your pain OP not all children respond to stepping back if they don't give a shit about the consequences. I like you micromanaged DD , stepped back , she got detentions for forgetting kit, being late, then didn't attend her detentions , then got isolation , then didn't show for that either, eventually started getting fixed term exclusions and was eventually excluded permanently 😬. DD has ADHD so maybe that's the difference but aged 16 I'm back to micro management because if i don't she doesn't care about the consequences. I've picked my battles so things like brushing teeth I occasionally remind her but leave her to it, her room is not something I pester about. School stuff I micromanage daily as it's something she has to do but doesn't have any interest in it or the consequences of her actions there.

One thing that worked for my DS at about that age was that I asked him - would he like me to "nag" him? (About homework, or whatever else needed doing) If he said yes then I would remind him and in return he wasn't allowed to snap at me when I reminded him, otherwise I would stop. Maybe something like that could work for your DS? Along with "these are the facts" talk maybe you could ask him if he wants to be reminded to brush his teeth once or twice a day, if he'd like you to stand with him or else just give him his reminder(s) each day and then leave him to it. And after a week or so you could review it, see how it's working for him? Giving my DS that kind of choice made him feel more in control without feeling I was leaving him to it altogether.

I do think your dentist is being a bit unrealistic though, at 15 years old you can't make your DS brush his teeth.

Some great advice! It's given me a bit of a lift. I do think he has got ADHD, I asked through GP to be assessed by over a year later I'm still waiting...

That's my dilemma in a nutshell - to stand back, to not. The teeth thing, that made me think, am I not parenting by letting his teeth rot? Aren't I responsible until he's 18? Does he just need longer of 'hand holding'...

... And then... well when and how is he ever going to learn how to do it?!

I'm trying a new plan. I talked to him today and said, yet again, this isn't working! What are your thoughts... he 'shrugged' and said everything was fine. I suggested

• I take off his phone when he comes back from school, and he gets it back when he's done the stuff on his 'list' (on the fridge) - teeth, (in case it was forgotten in the morning), bag, homework.
• He gets his pocket money on the weekend - it's increased if he wasn't late/forgot anything - he gets a bit less if one or two things - none if more.

I know about the teeth thing, I love my dentist he's so sweet. He did say, if I were you I would stand over him, it's worth it, literally next to him. So I did for a month! It's amazing how long 3 minutes feels like (after the cajoling) standing next to an electronic toothbrush!

I agree that boys at 15 are at their worst. I had two. But they have come through and our relationship is great now so dont panic. Never give them the idea you are giving up on them. My ds2 has dyspraxia and l had a few years of running after him with school stuff . He used to say to me ..nag me about exams as l need nagging. He is a bit obsessed with teeth cleaning so didnt have that. Its a tricky age as one minute you are letting on and next chasing after them.
Few things that helped : start each day fresh..look after yourself so have the patience and energy not to go nuts..talk to friends who have lads as its like therapy..tell him you love him regularly even in a text as he will grump but it hits the spot..believe he will do well and give him that message.
This stage will pass so keep a bit of humour and chat going between ye. You are not alone. There are a lot of dms of 15 year olds pulling their hair out.

Running Really interesting to hear your view too. I wonder whether they are maturing later, or just not going to make that transition to maturity?

My older step son is now a drop out from Uni working 4 hours a week and a total uppity slob at his mums house. He lived with me through the teenage years and I did a lot and his dad did a lot, I bought him clothes he liked etc, but his Dad was very much let's not be too hard on him. And he's wasting his life.

I'm hoping they get there in the end, DDs school pick her up and drop her home when I'm at work or she just wouldn't go. Dd also doesn't care for rewards or sanctions everything is done at her own pace or never. I try not to nag but nothing seems to get done till I end up getting a bit shouty, then she swears storms off but does it, I'm not asking big things even "you've left the tap on can you turn it off" then the standard "in a minute" response, which turns into 40 requests and shouting before eventually 2 hours later she does it angrily. I could turn it off myself, be much easier but when will she learn if I'm just following her round making sure ovens off, taps off etc.

Do you have anyone else in the family or any friends who he looks up to or would have a chat with? I used to have massive problems and clashes with my ds when he was early to mid teens and I ended up asking my dad to step in and have a calm but firm word with him. It helped so much, didn't make things perfect and there were a fair few of these "chats" but it did make a difference hearing from someone else, as my son just thought I was nagging and hated him and was doing the exact opposite of whatever I said!

He's now a couple of years on, just done resit for English gcse and gone from a d to a b grade (5). He is still somewhat thoughtless and lazy but things are better. Removing privileges or game time never worked as a motivator and just caused more arguments between us as he thought I was massively unfair. I think 15 is a really hard time for both teen boys and their parents! Also a single parent here.

Failing that I agree with stepping back. As hard as it is to watch them make bad choices, it is very difficult and stressful to force a 15 year old (especially one who is bigger than you and thinks they know everything) to do anything unless they want to! I had to step back at gcse resit time for my own sanity. I still provided opportunities and suggestions for revision and did remind him how long was left before exams but I tried not to worry too much about it as the year before was awful.

Good luck!

Thanks clowns and running. One thing I have done was step on his revision last year. He asked me to give him the chance and I did. He didn't do well, but not so badly to give him a shock. Just well under par. All his teachers have the same expression at parent teacher meetings, resigned annoyance.

Good idea about getting a third party. I don't have family or friends near or involved, that's probably part of the problem. However, when my Dad does his 'yearly' one night visit soon, I was thinking of asking him to have a word, specifically about his Dad's undermining of me. I think he needs, for once, to hear a different take.

Funny that you mentioned ADHD, as a lot of shat you posted rang some very familiar bells for me.

If you think that is a possibility, then you should really follow it up. The approach you need with a 15 year old with ADHD, is very different to the 'stand back' approach advocated by some posters. In fact the opposite is what's required.

*What you posted, not shat you posted, sorry!

Is it wrong to have burst out laughing at that typo ?

Ha ha! That's actually cheered me up a lot!

I agree I am like a full time PA and just do it on auto pilot . I literally send 20 texts a day "don't forget to shut the front door" " you have an exam at 10 don't talk till it's finished" " don't forget your house key" etc very very boring but necessary. Obviously if I forget it's my fault she didn't know or forgot.