My 17yr old overdosed last night.

[ToeTapN]

I will try to keep this as brief as possible. I have namechanged.

My 17yr old girl has emotional disregulation disorder (a precursor to personality disorder) & has been on and off under CAMHS since she was 13, mostly off as she won't engage with them.

Recently she has been spiralling downhill out of control again taking drugs (MDMA & Diazepam mostly) and staying out/awake all weekend. This has culminated in this weekend's climax of her overdosing last night on cold and flu tablets whilst in the grips of a comedown, she says she took 14 of them. This is not the first overdose and not the first hospital visit for self harm, she had left notes for both us (family) and the guy that she is in love with but who has little interest in her other than to use her for his own ends - eg when he needs a crash pad in the city after a party as he lives out in the sticks, which is often.

She was taken to A&E in an ambulance but as is her usual modus operandi she kicked off when they tried to take bloods (she will never allow anyone to stick her with a needle) and then discharged herself against medical advice. So now I guess there is nothing we can do other than watch, wait and hope that the overdose wasn't sufficient to send her organs into failure, which is beyond terrifying.

I have been in to see her a few times but she's under the duvet and wants to be left alone. If I attempt to sit and watch her she becomes abusive and dangerous to those around her.

She also hasn't eaten since Friday that I know of. She demanded McDs as we left the hospital at 2am but I said no - Me & my dh have been trained as parent therapists by CAMHS and one of the things we're supposed to do is to never reward the self harming behaviour by running around providing whatever she wants in the aftermath. We have a fridge/freezer full of food and offered to cook her something which was refused. She can go days without eating if we don't give in and buy fast food.

Is there anyone I can call? I am not a doctor and I'm too scared to google to see if 14 cold & flu tablets are enough to do serious possibly fatal damage to her liver. I have seen someone die of a paracetamol overdose so you can imagine how scared I am. I am shocked that the hospital allowed her to discharge herself but I can also see that if a patient is not co-operating and causing mayhem in a very busy A&E department then they have little choice.

At 17 she is in the no-mans land of medical care - paediatrics aren't particularly interested any more and most adult care isn't until 18yrs. I have little or no say in what happens to her medically as she is considered old enough to make her own choices.

I hope this doesn't read to disjointedly, I have had very little sleep.

Morning

It panned out predictably, she was discharged with a CAMHS referral at around 2am after an assessment. She was calm when she got home and is sleeping now, no idea how she'll be when she wakes up.

I hope you get further now it's not the weekend. Fingers crossed for a calm week for you.

Thank you. She woke up angry , I think because she found that all the sharp objects had been removed from her room and hidden. It was the police that did that not me but she's still angry with me and her dad because she thinks we overreacted. I don't feel safe around her today, it doesn't mean that I'm not safe but there's always an outside chance that she still has a knife of some description and so I'm making sure that I'm not within lunging distance and that she doesn't get between me and an escape route. It's impossible to know if she's a danger or not.

Not heard a peep from any professionals yet today but have spoken to one of the GPs where I work who told me that the overdose is unlikely to have been enough to close down her organs and who was as shocked as I was that the hospital allowed her to leave on saturday night after the overdose.

Unfortunately dd2 has crashed a bit today having taken it in her stride so far which isn't a surprise. She's ok but needs ice cream and cuddles, which she will get in spades after I've taken her to the orthodontist. Maybe she'll get some good news in the form of it being time to take the ruddy braces off!

Thanks again for the advice and support.

Oh god. Not the same but my eldest son is severely autistic & when he's anxious I have to keep out of bashing distance - it's very tiring & difficult & that's with the potential for him to just bruise me rather than do anything too serious. Is your DH around today/this evening?

Don't hesitate to call the police if you feel threatened. It may be the only way she gets help. I home the CAMHS appointment is soon & not a stupid wait.

Oh no ToeTap, I'm so sorry she's still causing you grief.

It's such a shitty situation all round, for her falling through the gaps, for you and the rest of the family for having to deal with the situation with so little professional support.

Be kind to yourself.

Yes dh is around thankfully, we both took the day off work. I have to go to the orthodontist appointment now and I wouldn't want to leave dd1 alone. I might take dd2 for a hot chocolate or something afterwards just for a bit of breathing space.

sorry its so difficult to get help at this age. I know.

If she is still actively suicidal and a danger to herself try to get a bed. She would also have to tell camhs she is not coping I think for them to agree to an emergency admission, but do push them. She would be discharged on her 18th birthday but until that point, camhs are responsible for her. It would give you time to get some transition sorted and keep her away from a destructive lifestyle at least . Certainly no one will bring her Mcds there and it might help her realise how unwell she is and to want to be home and get help. I am not sure where you live but I know some girls who made good progress at www.wlmht.nhs.uk/cs/cassel-hospital-services/ and I have known 17 year olds go there. Its more community than hospital. In our case, neither my DD or I agreed with diagnosis and it seemed negative and damaging to talk about BPD. Ifeel for your DD not engaging, as there are good and bad therapists, and sometimes its luck to find someone who you trust. I demanded a full assessment by a new therapist pre transition as there were so many inconsistencies in records. It was helpful to have proper psychogical tests which camhs dont always do. I think sometimes they feel a pressure to diagnose, when most teens seem to have their own unique mix of symptoms, which can change as they change. medically between 16 and 18 you can be involved if she says you can. After 18 it is practically much harder, even if your child gives permission. best of luck. I'm so sorry NHS put you in this permission. Terrible things have happened to young people we know due to lack of help around transition, and yet there are just more and more consultants paid to write reports telling us how bad it is, rather than using the money to make changes for the better.

I can't get her a bed, the beds are limited and they don't think that EDD diagnosed kids do well in hospital. I expect they're too disruptive!

Funny you should mention Cassel's, I spoke at length to a relative last night who has extensive professional experience with personality disordered people (prisoners mostly) and he mentioned it but she would have to be willing to go. She has small windows of willingness to get proper help but the moment she realised that it might curtail her partying she would shut down and refuse. Maybe at a later stage in her life.

I'm exhausted. She perked up to the point of laughing and joking for a couple of hours yesterday but she's back to staring at nothing in the dark peppered with manic, hilarious (to her) conversations with equally disordered friends today.

I don't really want to be here right now but this is mine and dh's house and I won't be driven out... sometimes I wonder if I have any other choice than to simply pack a back.

*bag

Op are you taking some time to yourself or just you and your bloke for a breather? Also is your other bairn coping ok? How is her dad coping?

Part of the problem with a diagnosis I think at that age is they now have an excuse and the manipulative part of the PD is so hard to deal with in a teen. It's hard to know where to draw a line in a moving target.

It's so important you protect your own mental health but as the years go on the harder it is. Don't hesitate to see your gp if it gets too much... I found beta blockers a massive help for the day to day stuff.

Hi gamer, I have betablockers because of my own historical anxiety issues so I'm ok there!

I went to work today to escape, it was a blessed relief to immerse myself in something else for a few hours. I've considered getting myself signed off for a few days but the atmosphere at home is so awful that I welcome a different place to go.

Oh god, the manipulation! One of the worst things about living with someone like dd is that you have to out manipulate them to achieve any kind of behaviour management. It's exhausting always attempting to stay one step ahead or beating yourself up if you miss a cue & things get out of control. It only takes missing one little flag & the next thing you know you're in abuse freefall but it sounds like I'm teaching my granny to suck eggs telling you this stuff

She went out for a couple hours tonight which gave the rest of us a nice breather but the moment I heard her return the atmosphere changed.

It's nearly 1am and I'm in bed. About an hour ago she came crashing (drunk) into my bedroom asking for money, that would be a no btw. I then heard slamming doors and her talking to her dad, who has insomnia issues so is often available at all hours. Next thing I hear is a car with thumping music outside then a whirlwind as she goes. So much for her wanting to go to college first thing tomorrow.

If I were here alone I would lock & chain the door.

My brain is racing & I can't enjoy the quiet whilst she's gone because I know that at some point before I should be getting up in the morning she is going to show up here again in a worse state than when she left and create havoc.

Christ, if dh gave her money I'm going to rip him a new one.

Toe, that is an awful situation and I really feel for you. There for the grace of God goes any parent of teenagers. I have no advice but just want you to know that someone is listening to you. Don't even think about whether or not she goes to college tomorrow, that is the least of her problems.

This may sound crazy but why not lock the door. If she comes banging call the police and tell them you are concerned about your safety. She will no doubt get a bed tonight with some of her buddies.

It isn't too clear whether the overdose she took was accidental or not. If it was accidental and she was just taking lots of recreational drugs perhaps she is more in control than you realise. I read a similar post a while ago about a parent who locked her 17 year old son out of the house because he presented a danger to herself and his younger siblings. A poster who works with teenagers provided the advice below. Maybe your DD has got to this point. You need a break and she is just not paying any heed to you. Perhaps drastic action is needed.

Please try to relax as much as possible. I have been in similar situations with my teenagers and end up worrying myself sick. Worrying is not going to change the outcome. Try to get some sleep. You will wake up when she comes home. If you can't sleep just relax your body. Read a book or watch television to take your mind off things.

ADVICE PROVIDED ON ANOTHER THREAD -

There is no legal requirements for you to provide a home for your son and over 16's can choose where they want to live.

His situation is the direct consequence of his actions.

DS should present himself at Local Authority Homelessness and they will then assess, possibly Social Services will do an assessment on him. Maybe a few nights in a hostel or emergency accommodation will do him good - and he will realise that his home situation is not so bad after all.

I work with 16-18 in college and this situation is not unusual. Parents do not have to put up with this behavior and have to consider the risk to their younger siblings and themselves.

Op have you thought about what steps to take when she hits 18 and has access to payday loans? I hate to bring it up but forwarned . Those swines are hardcore when it comes to chasing the debts and it may be a good idea to get her into supported housing at some point or if you're not at that point don't put her on the E role so you can deny she lives there.

Bugger, too late re the electoral role

I have considered the payday loan situation, she is appalling with money. She has never had any kind of job and we tend to keep her poor because we don't like what she spends money on. I don't know how she pays for drugs, not sure I want to know. She's very charming though so I daresay she manages to get by with favours.

Anyway yes, money. I have spoken to her at length about how awful payday loans are and how they are not a solution to anything, not sure how much of that will have sunk in. She had an inheritance from her grandma who died a few years back that sat in a protected account until she turned 16 when she legally had the right to do whatever she liked with it. It was a postal only account so tricky to access but eventually she opened herself a current account and transferred all the money into it, then spent the lot (we're talking around £3000) in the space of a month, on crap.

I hope with the changes in the law regarding payday loans she wouldn't be able to get one as she has no income or will possibly have an apprenticeship income of not a lot by then. Am I wrong in thinking that and would they be able to take family stuff if she defaulted?!

Thanks for posting Browsers - young people round here if they are made homeless go the the Foyer which is a hostel, it's a stop gap to getting some kind of supported or council housing I think but it's not a nice place and a lot of the young people there are problematic for obvious reasons. Dd has a friend who is there at the moment as his mum had a stroke and his stepdad kicked him out because he is gay now that his mum cannot protect him (awful!). He's a nice kid and he looks haunted - he's scared at the Foyer and literally just goes there to sleep, and he does have to sleep there otherwise he will lose him room. Dd likes to sleep out a LOT and has scant regard for any rules so wouldn't last five minutes let alone the high possibility of her hooking up with even more unsuitable and dangerous (to her and her habits) people than she already does. Believe me I've considered this option at length. Her friend at the Foyer has been told that he will probably be there for up to and probably beyond three months before he is offered something more permanent.

I considered offering dd's friend our box room as I was so sad for his predicament until I had a word with myself and decided that I really didn't need another dysfunctional youth in the house! I do feed him on a fairly regular basis whenever I get the opportunity though.

She's on an absolute high today. Amazingly she showed up at college (last thing I expected!) but there was an incident where she thought that a member of staff that she trusted had told her boyfriend that he should 'get out whilst he can' with regards to her so went to see this staff member to have a good old kick off. The staff at her college are amazing and they know all about her difficulties so managed to calm her right down very quickly so by the time I got there she was all smiles and full of the joys Not that it isn't lovely to see her looking happy but it feels very tenuous and it makes me a bit nervous.