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Original poster

A last a more considered approach to sunscreen use!

85 replies

brightbrightsun · 19/04/2023 19:32

Every year I have a meltdown over sunscreen. Ingredients, consistency, application all being considerations.

Some ingredients break down (both chemical and mineral) within a couple of hours and actually cause more skin damage. Some cause hormonal disruption, some environmental damage. Some sunscreens are sticky, messy, sweat off easily, get over everything.

The most readily available forms of Vitamin D comes from sunlight. Deficiencies have been linked to circulatory diseases and cancer.

The sunscreen industry is massive and increasing.

But skin cancer!

My Eureka moment! A calculator I have found that calculates burn time for different skin types at different UV levels with no sunscreen/ sunscreen factor level. This coupled with the hourly UV forecast has allowed me to see how risky it is to forgo sunscreen depending on the time of day I am going out and how long for.🙂

www.metoffice.gov.uk/weather/forecast/gcpvj0v07#?date=2023-04-19

www.wolframalpha.com/input?i=time+to+sunburn&assumption=%7B%22FS%22%7D+-%3E+%7B%7B%22TimeToSunburn%22%2C+%22tb%22%7D%7D&assumption=%7B%22FP%22%2C+%22TimeToSunburn%22%2C+%22SST%22%7D+-%3E+%22ST1%22&assumption=%7B%22F%22%2C+%22TimeToSunburn%22%2C+%22UVI%22%7D+-%3E%223%22

Hope this helps people. I'd be interested to know what others think.

OP posts:
Noln · 19/04/2023 20:52

Thanks OP this is really useful

Original poster
brightbrightsun · 19/04/2023 20:54

@Mustnot, yes, it's not uncommon from what I have read. A lot of the ingredients can irritate skin and some actually can cause skin damage. But it's not an easy choice to forgo sunscreen altogether if you are even remotely fair skinned. I found the information (posted earlier) really empowering in the context of concerns over some of the ingredients in and advice concerning copious and frequent use sunscreen.

OP posts:
Original poster
brightbrightsun · 19/04/2023 20:54

You're welcome @Noln. 🙂

OP posts:
undergroundstation · 19/04/2023 20:56

friend who works professionally in this world (pharm chemist) hardly wears sun cream ever for all the reasons you say - but takes care to keep out of the sun/covered up.

also says (some, flavoured) vaping may yet turn out to be worst than smoking…

ancientgran · 19/04/2023 20:57

I'm a freckled red head, I don't need any help about wearing sunscreen, if there is a sun in the sky I need sun screen, if it is mid summer I need factor 50.

Original poster
brightbrightsun · 19/04/2023 21:07

@nevermindtime, thank you. That is interesting, I appreciate we don't need much midday sun to get the Vit D requirement in summer but practically was wondering how to meet the requirements in this way.

An application of suncream happens on dressing with reapplication throughout the day. The breakdown of sunscreen ingredients causing more skin damage requires frequent application means a lunchtime unprotected ' blast' in the sun is unlikely to happen with this type of usage. If I've a normal suncream on it will need reapplying due to ingredient breakdown and a long lasting one will still be active. Whereas if I know when and how long I'll be out for and the UV forecast I might decide to forgo sunscreen.

OP posts:
Original poster
brightbrightsun · 19/04/2023 21:11

@ancientgran, according to the calculator (fairest skin level 'Celtic' type) you could be in sun @ a UV level of 5 (see tomorrow's forecast) for approx 27 minutes with no sunscreen.

OP posts:
Original poster
brightbrightsun · 19/04/2023 21:14

@undergroundstation, I can totally appreciate that.

OP posts:
Original poster
brightbrightsun · 19/04/2023 21:21

@nevermindtime, and what the government general advice regarding sunscreen and uv levels doesn't include is any differentiation between skin types or how long a period of time is spent in full sun.

OP posts:
FrenchFancie · 19/04/2023 21:40

Lol as a skin cancer survivor I think I’ll take a pass on your research and follow my dermatologist’s advice…..

seriously people, wear sunscreen. Damage is cumulative and UV forecasts aren’t perfect. Do not risk your health.

Lastnamedidntstick · 19/04/2023 21:51

brightbrightsun · 19/04/2023 20:42

@Lastnamedidntstick, what about my face and arms? It still gets hot here and I don't cover my face, neck or arms and they can burn and I have been caught out in the past. I do like to go outside. I run typically 10k everyday and like walking.

peaked cap for running. Long sleeves.

walking I take a loose chiffon cover and/or a parasol.

Plenty athletic clothing designed to cover while keeping you cool.

Original poster
brightbrightsun · 19/04/2023 21:55

@FrenchFancie 0

As a breast cancer survivor I do worry about the wider implications of some of the ingredients in sunscreen.

www.breastcancer.org/risk/risk-factors/exposure-to-chemicals-in-sunscreen

And I do use sunscreen! Pretty much all summer. I appreciate the advice may be different for someone who has actually had skin cancer, though.

All I am talking about is calculated risk. Which no one can escape. Using sunscreen and not using sunscreen both involves risks.

All I have done is provide links to more detailed information. Let's face it some people have (in some cases life threatening anaphylactic shock inducing) allergies to some popular sunscreen ingredients so cannot use them.

One size doesn't fit all in advice. More information can really help.

OP posts:
Original poster
brightbrightsun · 19/04/2023 21:56

@Lastnamedidntstick, do you think the peaked cap shades the face and neck enough? Don't you get hot?

OP posts:
doadeer · 19/04/2023 22:11

I don't think I would trust that site. The US has totally different laws and regulations regarding pharmaceuticals. Also doesn't it just recommend a mineral sunscreen? There are tons of those.

If you want someone who is science based on Sun screen, Lab Muffin on instagram is absolutely excellent.

I love Spf and find it no chore to wear. The smell of it is blissful for me and I wear some fab facial ones like Dr Sam.

Original poster
brightbrightsun · 19/04/2023 22:26

@doadeer why would you trust an influencer over a registered non profit cancer organisation?

OP posts:
Original poster
brightbrightsun · 19/04/2023 22:32

And mineral sunscreens are not without health concerns either. Nano particles can cross the skin barrier and zinc can break down after time and leave the skin more susceptible to damage.

I do use sunscreen but would rather weigh up the risks taking into consideration how likely it is I will burn according to my skin type and the uv level. Hence liking the calculator I linked to.

OP posts:
Original poster
brightbrightsun · 19/04/2023 22:35

@doadeer, how do you manage reapplication, over makeup if you wear it, assuming this isn't a long lasting sunscreen? Do you reapply every 1 and a half to 2 hours, throughout the day? Is this a broad spectrum sunscreen?

OP posts:
AgapanthusandAcers · 19/04/2023 22:35

I had an appointment with a dermatologist over a concerning mark on my face, she said to go out in the sun without sun screen in the morning for a short while to get vitamin D as the chances of illnesses linked to vit D deficiency, such as heart disease and cancer were high where I live. So if I can I have a cup of tea and a little quite time in the garden during summer mornings.

AgapanthusandAcers · 19/04/2023 22:37

Obviously I slather in factor 50, wear a hat and cover up for the rest of the day and she also recommended that.

Original poster
brightbrightsun · 19/04/2023 22:37

@AgapanthusandAcers...yes, that's the sort of thing I am talking about here. Limited exposure within certain parameters.

OP posts:
Original poster
brightbrightsun · 19/04/2023 22:38

The UV generally decreases dramatically by 4.00pm.

OP posts:
AgapanthusandAcers · 19/04/2023 22:43

@brightbrightsun sorry I took so long to type the reply that the thread had moved on.

MrsPelligrinoPetrichor · 19/04/2023 22:47

Lastnamedidntstick · 19/04/2023 20:39

I don’t like sunscreen. I don't like the faff of application, the sticky feeling etc. I also burn very easily and have a lot of moles so in bright sun my skin damages very quickly.

so I cover up and stick to the shade. But I am seen as very strange as most people in this country like to strip of and tans are seen as “healthy”

if you’re worried about your skin, keep it covered. You only really need to use sunscreen if you want to expose your bare skin. So instead of googling “research” into sun cream, Don’t use it and cover up. Your choice 🤷‍♀️

I'm the same, I've tried them all and they irritate my face so I wear a hat and stay in the shade and avoid going out when the sun is really strong.

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