Can we talk about clothing brands and target demographics?

[CrkdLttrCrkdLttr]

Because I’m thinking about the brands that form the core of my ‘going out to meet other grown ups’ wardrobe, and laughing at the Margaret Howell mail shot I’ve just opened. (Socks and sandals photo.) Beautiful young model, and each garment will be wonderfully well made - but I know no one under fifty who wears MH. That’s fine - but I wish the marketing acknowledged the fact.

When a brand does make an effort to engage with the real buyers of its clothes I’m full of awe and gratitude - Raey at Matches is usually great at this.

Studio Nicholson hovers somewhere in between. Again, everyone I know (in the UK) who wears their clothes is older and richer than me, probably in a creative profession. Not a wispy 20 year old.

I never used to care. But I’m wondering if marketing is the reason 99% of the middle aged and older women on MN exclaim that there are no decent clothes for them. There are - but not every brand tells you so.

@Enheduanna some excellent points. I work in a (non arts) related industry which has big issues with greenwashing and sustainability. For us, there is a bit of technical understanding needed but then most consumers have some questions to interrogate brands/ products and make their own decisions.

separately- any sightings of high priestess dresses in navy blue would be appreciated. Perhaps not the same impact of black or white.

OK ladies, I have had a reply from Plümo re the dress with the chemical smell. They sent their apologies and said this:

Our warehouse have inspected our stock and this is not a common fault with the dresses. There is a slight smell coming from the dress due to the dye on the garment, however I think yours in unusual in the potency.

As the dress has already been worn and washed as a goodwill gesture we are able to accept a return and issue you with a credit note for the full amount of £229.

What do you all think, should I go ahead with this? I did soak it overnight in soda and although the smell has lessened, it's very much there still, I don't think I can ever wear it. Nor do I want to wash it to death!

A credit note means I could only buy from them again, right? So there's no guarantee I wouldn't run into that smell again!

Take the credit note.

🤓 these dresses!

Another one who’s looking for alternative dark neutrals - black and white are kryptonite for me so am always seeking warm navy or grey, chocolate brown or dark olive. Basically all the sludge colours that everyone else seems to hate.

Online shopping makes this much harder, as it’s not always easy to judge the warmth of solid colours and it makes such a difference when it’s just right. But agree with shark that the drama and impact would be reduced.

I’d take the credit note too, Crunchy.

Dark colours don't work for me online. If there is a different, lighter, colour, I'll look at those photos before deciding. I'm definitely a sludgy colours person, but I'll sometimes wear bold bright colours and prints.

Sorry, yes, take the credit note, because the dress will just linger around being beautiful and smelly.

I once bought a pair of expensive (for me) trainers from Ebay. They absolutely stank of fabric conditioner or something. Despite several washings and soaks, the smell only lessened. I've never worn them. They still stink.

I found this on a legal site:

If I return goods do I have to accept a "credit note"?
No. You can insist on the full repayment of your money. If you accept a credit note you may not be able to exchange it for cash later on if you cannot find anything else in the shop that you like. Also some credit notes last for a limited period so check this before you accept a credit note. Some companies may insist on giving you a credit note if you have held onto the goods for an unreasonable period of time before returning them.

This is what worries me, there's nothing else in that shop that I would buy, and I expect the note will expire at some point, effectively leaving me £229 out of pocket, for something that was never my fault.

Do they have anything else that you'd have considered buying in normal circumstances Crunchy? If they have then I think a credit note might be a reasonably satisfactory result all round. But if they haven't then you're effectively being pressured into buying something you don't particularly want. I'm not sure what you're legal options are though and it does depend on how much you feel up to taking them on though - there's nothing wrong with deciding you don't want the hassle.

It doesn't encourage me to risk buying from Plumo though, just in case they're reading.

Ah cross post with you both!

If they say it’s not a common problem, could you ask them to sniff-test a replacement dress? If that is still stinky, then I’d push for a cash refund rather than the credit note.

Also, if you bought with a credit card I believe you have additional options for getting a refund.

@Floisme Nope nothing else that I'd buy there, I went through again with a fine tooth comb. So effectively I'd be sitting staring at a credit note I can't use and minus £229. Which I feel isn't right at all.

@Enheduanna Yes it is under 30 days. I think you are right and will quote that act to them, thank you so much for finding it!

I'd push for a full refund too Crunchy, maybe offer to deduce the shipping cost from the amount to them as a compromise (I assume you had free shipping and returns)?

Shark well for high priestess we can always go back to Greece, this is navy from Zeus and Dione. The Row also has navy usually but is obviously very ££££.

Zara is actually worth keeping an eye out for, they usually have one or two dresses that have The Row like appeal, here's a black one.

Last time I was in the La Collection they said there would be lots of navy in their new collection but I don't see it online yet.

Shangpie, for sludge colours Belize (two ex Céline designers, it's a swimwear line originally) has loads and there's quite a bit of summer dresses of theirs on the Outnet atm, although less of the full high priestess aesthetic. I really like this lightish almos eau de nil one on their own website which has more of the feel of their former employer.

I would not trust their sniff test as they are already claiming that it's only a 'slight smell'! I did buy using a credit card, so there's that avenue, too.

Postage was £3.95, I don't mind paying that if need be.

Well, it’s progress, @CrunchyCarrot. Do they have any more of this dress in the right size? If so I’d want a telephone conversation where an actual human being locates said dress and smells it. If they could guarantee there is nothing but the faintest, if any, odour I’d be inclined to try again - with the proviso, of course, that this could also be returned if it reeks.

If not, or if you’ve had quite enough of the sight of it, now - and if you have the energy - I’d be pointing out housebound-ness and the unfairness of having to leave £229 in their coffers for the foreseeable future, thus preventing you from using the money for clothing at the point you actually need it. (21st century Law seems to rely more on heartstrings and social media than it did when I actually practised it …)

Apple - slow typing, crossed everyone.

Seriously @CrkdLttrCrkdLttr I would not trust another human from that company telling me that any other of that same dress has only a 'faint' smell. I really don't want to go through getting another one sent out only to find myself in the same situation again.

Right now, I think a credit note suits their purposes, not mine, so I will push for that refund. At 67 I am done being walked over!

The dress is not fit for purpose. It has a fault which makes it unwearable. You are entitled to a refund.

The problem with eBay or Vinted is that if the seller liked it, they’d have kept it! Children’s clothes are different; they grow out of things so items can be nearly new.

I just bought a cashmere jumper from eBay. It was a great bargain but when it turned up it was shrunken and felty. I measured the chest: 28”

I think charity shops have already had their day. When I was young, clothes 20 years old were from the 60s. Now clothes 20 years old are from the early 2000s. In 1985 60s gear was cool. Can anyone say this about 2003 Primark?

However on the subject of fast fashion, I have on now Primark leggings 10 years old. They are utterly indestructible and I have worn them about a million times. Otoh I have posh things that disintegrated almost immediately.