Bloggers and brands

[homebythesea]

I love blogs, YouTube, Instagram etc but sometimes do wonder what's in it for the brands especially regarding blogger events.

Straight up reviews of things they get sent I totally get- they try things on/ use a face cream, wax lyrical about how great the thing is, people click through and buy said item. Straightforward advertising. No problem with that at all.

But when a blogger is invited to a dinner, or night away at a hotel, or a movie premiere by a brand I just don't get what is worth the expense? From the blogger perspective they get a night out and a goodie bag and maybe even paid to attend. But what does the brand get in return? A brief tag on an Instagram pic, some photos of beautiful place settings at dinner......but not necessarily sales?? These events must cost thousands to put on.

Hopefully someone with some knowledge about these things will enlighten us!

A buck toothed girl I agree.
Did you see her comments on Lizzie Insta post 1 of shit storm saying bloggers are there to educate women?
She can't seen to take on any critism or questioning.
She made herself look like an idiot closing down comments then admitting it's was all for increased traffic and she's laughing despite the amount of people she upset or annoyed in the process.

I have being manipulated and sure many followers do.
How these 2 bloggers manipulated and blew up an issue for what seems their own gain alienates the wider audience.
They must be desperate for hits and to be relevent but people looking with interest at blogs linked to Insta won't translate into extra followers as lambs blog was dull as and the whole women supporting women no matter what even if we disagree like we traitor to our gender by asking questions or being critical.

Loving the Paris thread too.
I'm so bored of fashion blogs and even instagram is annoying me.

Fake Fabulous

SUNDAY, 26 NOVEMBER 2017

Working With Brands, How to Say No... politely! #fakeituntilyoumakeit LINK UP

After an interesting post by the lovely Catherine@notdressedaslambthat discussed an event that had caused a bit of a stir... or a "shitstorm" as someone called it (charming!) I started to think about bloggers working with brands.

Working with brands is something many bloggers do, and it can be great fun!
In fact, some people start blogging with the intention of working with (big) brands, makingloadsof money and never having to buy anythingeveragain.

Hmmmm.... it's not quite that simple is it? 😛

The discussion on (and off) Catherine's blog got me thinking about the difference between changing your style (aka: mixing things up) and wearing things you don't actually like, just because you're being paid to do so.

I'm a firm believer in changing your style as you see fit.
Why be stuck in a style rut, or be put in a safe little box?

However, wearing things I don't like because I've been paid to do so is not something I want to do.
I don't think you have to either, even if you're making your living by blogging.

I've had the pleasure of working with a few brands now and have really enjoyed it.
For the most part the brands were new to me (I'd heard of them but never shopped there) and I had to look quite hard to find something that felt like my style.
I always managed it though.
Some items (like THIS maxi) just needed styled up to make it feel like 'me'.
Other items blew my mind and I became hooked on the brand....like this dressandthis cashmere wrap.

{I've just noticed, they'd look fabulous together!}

Nowadays many of the offers I receive I don't accept (the majority in fact).
This may seem a little crazy, but here's why....

Despite the fact brands offer me 'free products' (and even payment) I often don't feel like I can accept.
Unfortunately, being in the "over-40" category makes people (i.e brands) assume I am wanting to buy a certain style of clothes, or shoes.
Often these styles seem frumpy, or old fashioned looking.
Despite my open mind to new brands I sometimes can't find a single item on their site that I could work with.
The cut is not quite right.
The shoes may look dowdy and frumpy.
Often clothes don't even come in my size!

{I havepegged a top in the past but it wasn't from a brand....see that funny post HERE}

So instead of taking goods I don't really like I just say a polite "No thank you".

Usually it goes a little like this....

Dear XXX,
Thank you so much for your email and your offer of collaboration.
Unfortunately, XXX are not really my style and I don't feel I could endorse the brand in a way that my readers would find authentic.

I hope you do not mind my honesty, and I wish you every success with your campaign.

Kind regards,
XXX

So, when you read about an item on Fake Fabulous that comes with a little 'c/o' you know it's something Iactuallylike, which is something we can ALL do.
In fact, all of my favourite bloggers manage it, and some of them rely on their blogs to pay the bills.
Hats off to them!

Last week the fabulous trio atJodie's Touch of Stylemade me smile with their OTK boots, proving that age is no barrier to having fun with fashion.
See the original postHERE.

Now it's your turn.....

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SAMANTHA BLAIRATNOVEMBER 26, 2017

Catherine, Not Dressed As LambSunday, 26 November 2017 at 18:50:00 GMT

Samantha thank you so much for the mention about the shitstorm!!!! ���� I’m just having to laugh about it now, certain people have got so incensed that someone’s bad behaviour has been called out that I’m just finding it funny that all they’re doing is sending traffic and engagement my way which ultimately benefits me.

I agree with what you said about how we work with brands - we get criticised left right and centre despite staying true and honest. Thanks for such a great suggestion for how to refuse offers, if only people knew how often we have to send those sorts of emails...!

Much love to you for being open and honest yourself and for your support for Liz, it’s the least she deserves!! C x

I had never heard of this blogger until I saw in Lizzie Insta.
She's the one who's shown the worst behaviour.
Taking something off freinds Twitter that doesn't effect her and putting it on her blog.

They shutting down comments and admitting she did it for selfish reasons.
How she claims to be supportive of women after some if vile and daft comments she made I don't know.

Regarding Instagram, some brands do not want to pay a huge amount for one of those large obvious ads and let's face it we all skip over them.

How about if they place their product in a more subtle way and it doesn't have to be marked as an advertisement. What about if they 'drop' it in to a mum on the school run or a women going out for the evening. It's a win for everyone involved. Except for the viewer who have ended up feeling some what duped.

The small businesses getting a shout out from bloggers thing is interesting. You only have to look at how much stuff someone like Lisa Dawson gets sent to see how difficult it would be to get anything more than a passing mention if even that; unless you are a bigger brand like Amara that is.

I sent my product to a blogger mentioned on here. It was sent in the context of the blogger saying how stuck in a rut they were with their current . I hoped they would like it enough to give us a shout out. They liked it, and promised to (unprompted), but never did. Probably an oversight but disappointing nonetheless.

Around the same time I sent the product to a small Youtuber. She loves and uses the product and every time she mentions it on a vlog we get a small uplift in sales. She is really behind the concept of what we are doing and genuinely wants to help. And she does.

As to whois benefitting from bloggers promoting small brands if the small business owner isn't, it's hard to say really. It gives the blogger something to talk about I guess if nothing else.

I also sent an image of our product to be featured in a 30 under £30 blog post but wasn't successful. I'm glad I didn't send the actual product although I wonder if that might have made a difference. I received no correspondence from the blogger other than a blanket 'thanks to everyone else who applied' on Stories.

Like you EdinaMonsoon I'm left wondering if our product is any good. Luckily the Youtuber I mentioned questioned our pricing strategy and we were able to engage in a dialogue with them about it. Having such conversations is perhaps a way that bloggers/influencers could help small businesses.

flea there’s a blog post on Dressed as Lamb, and posts on Lizzy Loves’s Instagram. Some of the Insta comments are spot on, calling her out on it.

I love Instagram, but I think it’s totally what you make it - I only follow a couple of bloggers and brands, and otherwise it’s just ordinary people who take photos of stuff. I’ve just looked at my feed right now and the first five posts are: some jam, a man smoking a cigar, a record on a record player, a cat, and someone’s feet. I’m a daily poster with a very small following (about 350) and follow an even smaller number of people (about 150) and my posts are just things I like - often outfits and makeup, my cat, things I see out and about - and my feed kind of mirrors the stuff I post.

Wish wish I think some companies already do.

List count of how many hydrate 8 water bottles I seen on Insta or jd seasonings in meal pics.

I feel on Insta some products are placed and not listed as sponsored or gifted .

Wow this thread has been convoluted and interesting to say the least. I have followed with interest. I'm Joanna btw - previously known as Poppys-Style, but a new username proved easier than retrieving my old password!

First I will say I haven't blogged consistently for months as I now focus my energy on my other businesses, but in the interest of full disclosure I continue to make commission, from current links, and those I used years ago before there were any 'guidelines'. I also still occasionally post using RewardStyle links via all social media platforms and I know for sure I don't disclose explicitly - I rely on the #LTK @LikeToKnow to make my audience aware.

So my 2 cents (sorry I am in the US)

• some posts are incredibly misleading - and assuming readers 'know' they are gifts, or not feeling the need to mention it in every post is a crock of shite
• some bloggers have never supported each other, never mind being transparent - meaning things have been lifted, copied etc and I have confronted them in the past in 'blogging groups'
• so my point is it's cut throat - it's a business - and you're a fool to think otherwise
• hence the Lizzy NDAL posts - I was irate though feel need to clarify this as it is NOT connected with Kat. There was a discussion on a CLOSED FB group about blogger transparency (I'm a member and read it). One comment referred to Liz in a negative manner. Liz saw this and copied it from a PRIVATE group - AFTER an apology had been made - and shared it with the IG world. I was furious as many women confide in that group and feel comfortable as it is CLOSED. NDAL then took it upon herself to make it into a 'change your style post' in defence of Liz - who had asked her peers to support her.

Is it any wonder I find MLM more fun and lucrative than blogging these days!?

Always open to discussion and questions!

ToBeClear Oh! I’d just come back to this thread from Instagram to say that you’re the only one who didn’t come across as a twat in the comments! 😂 And here you are.

Completely agree with everything you said, btw. 👍

I also really like Avril at A Life To Style. She has a lot of integrity, I think.

Tobeclear thanks for your post. I always really enjoyed your blog .

I’ve followed this thread with interest. I’m on IG and have followed some of the bloggers for years - A Life to Style, DMBL40, The Fashion Lift, Poppy’s Style etc... However they are mixed in with lots of accounts, like my own, that post pictures of travel, fitness, food, cats etc... So, in effect, they are watered down in my feed and I don’t feel like I am looking at one advert after another. And I think it’s this eclectic mix that keeps me hooked on IG as opposed to other forms of social media.
I consider myself reasonably savvy and feel I can often make an educated guess about which posts are sponsored, have a collaborative approach or which items are gifted. A tell tale sign is often several bloggers all posting about the same brand/item at the same time! For me, a simple #ad or #gifted on a post is sufficient. I’ve always thought A Life To Style is spot on on her blog and very clear about whether a post is sponsored or not.
I like bloggers for fashion ideas. I’m not someone who rushes out and buys the exact item every week. The only blogger I really chat specifics with about clothes is Mission Style Uk as we are similar height/size/age.

...... and that's exactly the point BlueEyedWonder, you are relying on being savvy and the fact that you follow several blogs to know what's what, not the transparency/declaration of individual bloggers. It shouldn't be like that - if you only follow only one or two blogs, you have no comparison. Bloggers must be transparent or, ultimately, they will lose their integrity and their readers.

woah back up a second. I bought a wyse cashmere jumper on the back of KFs recommendation years ago when it was 'just' a fun to read blog. was she sent that for free??! it was presented as a 'i just found this great quality small business' chatty type line! that is clearly NOT ok, no one in their right mind would think so. it should have been made clear from the outset that was a gift and I would have mentally filed it under 'advertorial' in the same way I do when flicking through Red / Vogue. I feel very stupid - and manipulated - now.

I unfollowed someone AB a while ago as the amount of free stuff she received / unwrapped on insta stories daily was making me feel sick. conspicuous consumption at it's absolute worst, and undoubtedly encouraging people who may not be able to afford it to spend more money (when they themselves aren't parting with a penny). sickening.

I guess the best way to respond is a. unfollow and b. stop shopping with those brands who court bloggers who in turn manipulate us into spending.

(the NDAL / WLL side story - OMG. how horrifically embarrassing for them both. I have never seen their blogs / insta before now and definitely haven't missed anything if that's how they behave )

Welcome Joanna. Thanks for your post. You made complete sense in the whole Liz ndal debacle

It is annoying isn't it Foxy!

Joanna, interesting about your observations about how cut-throat the blogging business is. So not all women supporting women then

Love Joanna’s blog even though her style is nothing like mine. I’m far too tame.

Agree it’s transparency that the readers want. If you get ‘gifted’ thousands of pounds worth of stuff a day, good on you. Blogs not so much but no way would i put my life online like the vloggers do daily. No amount of free handbags or clothing would encourage me otherwise. However perhaps hypocritically I do enjoy watching them and watching a ‘haul’ or P.O. box opening.

As much as I do like dmbl40 blog I do feel that the apology has been damage limitation and a touch patronising. Also still some untruth to it.

The best apology would have been to say that going forward all gifts and discounts would be disclosed and to not try and justify previous posts or non disclosing of gifts and incentives. A blog on a daily basis would bankrupt most people especially with the higher end items featured, so once noticed by brands and agencies it makes sense to accept items and events that you genuinely would like/use.

Blueeyedwonder read your post and though 'Oh MissionStyleUK, I've not read her blog for a while' (I'm also a similar height/size to her so like to check out what she's wearing) and went back to her blog to discover a new post saying she's been really ill. Glad to hear she's on the road to recovery.

I also agree with the comment about A Life To Style. She's always clear about what she's been sent, she supports small/local businesses and I trust her opinion. She's also fairly similar to me in size/age/lifestyle, so that helps!

Nice to see Joanna, Erica and Kat on here, though. A bit of honesty and information-sharing goes a long way. I do see how hard it must be to get things right all the time if your part-time/mummy/hobby blog has transmogrified into a full-time money-spinning high profile business, an unregulated one at that!

I have also always warmed to A Life to Style and felt she has been open about stuff she has been sent - it came across as more genuine support for small businesses actually than just pumping posts out with the same boots featured in them with no gift credits.

On another note, the NDAL name is bugging me. Its seems a very inappropriate unusual choice of name for a fashion blogger, or is that just me overthinking things??

I am finding this whole thing endlessly fascinating and have been prodding around on the Hush website. Very clearly promoted is their affiliate programme offering this;

hush would like to give you the opportunity to partner with our well-respected brand, by joining our Affiliate Programme managed by Affiliate Window.
If you have a website, you can start earning money immediately by promoting hush online.
Joining as an affiliate is simple to do, free of charge and we’ll reward you with commission on every sale.

I don't really have a problem with this per se, business is business but, if bloggers are "promoting" hush products like this and not being absolutely explicit that they are doing so then I feel that it is all a bit murky.

...... should add that Hush is just the first website I looked at and am sure it is very commonplace. My issue is with this notion of "promoting"....

Wow, White Company offer 5% on all click through sales. Why didn't I know this!

I think the conclusion I have come to is that the agencies, brands and bloggers are pushing the rules (what rules there are) to the limit because this area is so poorly regulated at present. Until there is some pressure applied, either by the consumers or a regulatory body, then other than the most scrupulous ones, they will continue to try to get away with disclosing the bare minimum.

Gleam's streamline is to 'develop, monetise and protect' its digital talent, so don't tell me that they don't understand what this means. If their job is to protect their talent, they should be ensuring they don't get stung by a fine or bad press for non compliance, which could damage or ultimately off their brand as an influencer. They are doing the bare minimum to address this because there is nobody to force them otherwise (at the moment at least).

Ehm... am I the only one not glancing over the MLM mention above? I've speculated before (on another thread) that I wouldn't be surprised if the murky workings of MLM business models and the unregulated blogosphere would mesh into something further exploitive and that I wouldn't be surprised that MLM companies would be targeting SM personalities with large followings. Equally, those with already existing large followings will see opportunities in MLM land with their ready-made audience.

Someone mentioned Sali Hughes' interview with Jane Cunningham (BBB) upthread which is how I initially got to know her. I ended up rewatching it last night on the back of this thread. To me she really is a blogger who cares about being honest and knows what transparency looks like. Her relationships to PRs and brands are difficult, to say the least, as she simply prioritises her readers first. Her thoughts on how much her personality should/shouldn't be a part of her blog are also interesting. If anyone's got the time have a watch yourself:

*strapline not streamline!