M&S - it's over

[Floisme]

I've been known to defend M&S on here but if this is their attitude they can fuck right off.

www.theguardian.com/business/2017/nov/05/not-just-for-over-55s-ms-chairman-says-chain-needs-younger-clothing

Because of course the over 55s just loved The Pink Dress. And all that yellow. We can't get enough of it.

No, Mr Norman, you haven't been 'buying too much for the over 55 customer'. What you've been buying, is too much shite.

... and that was a very unexpected thread derail.

But I'm quite breathtaken with the ninja-like flexibility to pounce upon the most unlikely opportunity to lighten Monday morning with a little unexpected racism.

Nope, as an quintessential English store I thought it was a bit of a weird idea to be promoting Islamic values. Thats all.

Nope, as an quintessential English store I thought it was a bit of a weird idea to be promoting Islamic values. Thats all.

I think I'm a bit of an anomaly, I'm early twenties and buy clothes from M&S, but only occasionally as it's a long process finding the good bits in amongst the crap. I got a gorgeous pink velvet suit with a belted jacket and wide leg trousers to wear at Christmas last year that I wear separately now for a more casual look and I have some real leather front panel leggings which are fantastic quality and much more wearable than full leather trousers or leggings . I often see things I like online, but they only have per una and a selection of hideous nylon tat in the one local to me and as I've found the sizing to be a bit off sometimes and I can't be arsed with the faff of returning as our shop seems to have a dearth of sales assistants and so I don't often buy things and go somewhere else if I can find a similar equivalent. There seems to be a lack of good quality staples, which are ageless, and a lot of fussy trend led crap that just doesn't hit the mark. I also find that the smaller sizes (I wear a 6-8) sell out quickly and don't come back into stock, which is annoying. They should stop with the dividing collections by target age and bring in decent quality, well cut basics in natural fabrics. Good cotton tshirts and blouses, cashmere cardigans and jumpers, silk skirts, wool trousers jackets and coats, good leather pieces that could be worn by anyone from age 20+ People don't go to M&S for clothes because they want to look trendy, they want basics backed up by the old M&S standard of quality, which they don't do much of anymore.

No need to say it twice Numbsnet. We heard you. I guess, as the op, it falls to me to point out the bleeding obvious - that many Muslims are British too.

As for M&S being quintessentially English well They ship in from the far east like the rest of them.

@Numsnet Nope, as an quintessential English store I thought it was a bit of a weird idea to be promoting Islamic values. Thats all.

Um. You know that there is a multi-cultured society out there, right?
Not all of whom are white, english roses?

And, hold on to your middle-english hat here, but M&S also has stores out foreign. I mean, it might not be open now, but certainly was an M&S in Tripoli, Libya, the last time I was there.

Yes I understand its international and they sell for all types and nationalities. I'm in Ireland and we have a few M&S shops here.
I think what alienated me was the way it was promoted.
The way they promoted it on their website would be the equivalent of have a model in the swimwear section dressed in one. It was the top of the "new in" section. If you walked into M&S and saw that on display would you not feel it was promoting a value?
I didn't realise that subjugating women had become so mainstream.

If the patronising Mr Norman thinks M and S clothes already appeal to 55s and over, his 'turnaround strategy' is doomed to failure. Cheap and nasty looking clothes, , horrible polyester materials, lack of quality basics. No thanks!

I know she's like Marmite, but M&S could do with Mary Portas to help them find their way again.

Bubbles you are so right about the best stuff going in the best seller/flagship stores.
The Leicester Fosse Park store (Flagship) is brilliant.
The Leicester city centre store is vile.
The Trafford & Meadowhall M&S's are fab too & surprisingly the M&S's in touristy places

I have never seen a burkini in an M and S store. I didn't even know they sold them.

As an aside, this is one MN thread that I think the papers should publish. Maybe someone influential at M and S would read it and take note.

I'm 53 and shop mainly in Tk Maxx and H&M for basics. My local M&S in our very small town is the preserve of the over 70's plus their husbands ( who all look a combination of forlorn and pained).I have no patience with rifling through their rails as it frequently looks like a jumble sale.But I do like ordering to the store so I can return them straight away if they're not right.Which is often. My recent purchases were the pleated metallic skirts which were brilliant.
My suggestions like many would be stick to good quality basics in natural fibres - cotton, silk, wool, cashmere and simple shapes. I can't even find a decent t shirt there at the moment. The stores are so bleak and old fashioned that I don't enjoy shopping there. The brilliant service that M&S was reknowned for has gone. I was reprimanded recently for returning a cashmere jumper without the little plastic cape even though it was still in several layers of plastic.
What M & S do brilliantly is the Beauty & Perfume area, beauty boxes, Rosie silk underwear, knickers and the famed meal deals.

I can't seem to find anything in the M&S stores I go in, one of which is a major flagship store. When you can't find a plain cream top to go under jackets without frills or flounces ... or decent t-shirts that look nice rather than something a 13 year old would buy in a discount store, they are so clunky - or plain t-shirts without embellishments ... in M&S then they really are getting something very sadly wrong.

God, awful things ahead for M&S then, they can’t get more bad quality wise, I would prefer pay a bit more for decent lasting fabrics that last....

Yes, I think what's even more depressing than his patronising attitude - and god knows, that's bad enough - is the talk of going cheaper. Their prices are already way lower, in real terms, than they were 20 years ago. There's only one way to get them down any further and we all know what it is.

Absolutely agree, Floisme. I'd prefer to see them go a little dearer in return for acceptable quality.

In a previous life I have dealt with Mr Norman and it seems he still is a patronising man now.

However there are some comments in the article I do agree with for example the reference to the rails and rails of mustard coloured jumpers and how they are selling. I am not in the over 55 category and do go in to M & S occasionally in 2 different locations. The first is a flagship store which is crammed with clothes arranged in a very haphazard fashion to the extent I give up trying to find them, trousers are over 3 floors for example and the second is a smaller store which is shrinking in size and will probably become a food store according to his pans. The layout of this one is great and due to the smaller ranges clothes seems to be laid out in category groups rather than ranges so all the trousers are together.

I agree the quality has decreased over the last few years but the last thing we need now is less quality at a lower price. If I want disposable clothes I will go to Primark which is next door to both these shops but I don't. Quality fabrics and cuts are what I want at a reasonable value for money price(not necessarily cheap!)

Agreed but we've been talking on here for years about their store layouts, stock levels and bizarre colours - and some of us are even over 55 They could have found any of that out without paying Archie Norman 600K a year.

My mum is 82 and likes M&S jeans but not much else. At 61, there's not much I would buy outside the beauty department. But my DS has a fantastic leather jacket he bought there which was so much admired that several of his friends have bought similar ones. Menswear is still okay, mostly, but the womenswear is as has been said repeatedly but correctly above either very, very dull or in garish colours. And over-embellished with tawdry details in nasty materials.

Bring back Kim Winser (who created the original Autograph) and ran knitwear in the days when M&S fine silk ribbed v-necked cardigans in great colours were my everyday staple under a suit. In the late 80s and early 90s, they got it right, but then they developed too much square footage and now they can't fill it with enough of the good stuff.

I'm in Dublin and we have a huuuge store nearby. I get tired not to say dispirited traipsing around it looking for something, anything, to buy. I still remember the excitement when they opened in Ireland first, and I was a loyal customer for years.

So out of that loyalty I still look for good quality basics there now. Couldn't say when I last bought anything though. I used to love their cotton t-shirts (now if they're cotton they are shapeless, if they're a nice shape they are see-through and they're all too damn short) and their long length trousers (hard to find any of the long length now and sometimes when I do, they are shorter than 33" - usually in nasty fabrics). As for the colours... Always just slightly the wrong shade of whatever colours are on trend. I'm late 50s and I don't want clothes aimed specifically at "over 55s" I want them aimed at women who want on-trend but not zany or cheap and raggy. And I would like a little bit of respect from wherever I do my business. My money's as good as anyone else's!

Well I’ve just been in a large store and agree they stock much nicer things now, than they do in my nearest small city store. I was really impressed with s lot of the Limited Edition collection. A lovely coat, jumpers and skirts.

I tried on quite a few things but they didn’t suit me (I’m a difficult shape- short, size 10 with large boobs). But it will encourage me to have another look when I go up to London in a couple of weeks.
There are still issues though. They had some really fab outfits on a group of manikins but I couldn’t find any of it. I asked someone to help and she had to take me from one end of the store to the other and we still couldn’t find one of the items. Why can’t they have the stock right next to the manikins? In such a large store it makes sense. It’s just stupid little things like that which make the shopping experience annoying.

Well I’m over 55 (just) but I’ve been a loyal customer most of my life- but when I stop and think about it I rarely buy clothes for myself now (other than underwear, and Rosie nightwear - I rarely wear any other brand) . I have cashmere jumpers and skinny autograph jeans from a few years back- In other words good quality basics. What I want is good quality basics possibly with a twist ( but not the twists I often see) to lift it out of the ordinary. I live close to an out of town store, so often pop Into M&S- ( I walk through to get to Sainsburys) but I buy food, tights, undies, home ware when on offer-but not clothes! value ranges yes but I don’t think going cheap is the way forward at all!

I have actually bought a short skirt in red in there recently which is a lot like the ones the used to sell in the 80s.

But whilst looking for a link I found this 'beautiful' outfit!!

.. tempting huh?...

Oi I used to have a skirt just like that

I never did double velvet though, not even in 1973.

floisime Now is your chance!!-