Help. Is there a secret to putting on eye liner?

[Spidermama]

Everywhere I look there are women with beautifully applied eye liner.

I try. How do they make the liner join onto their eye? I have the liquid stuff with a brush, but do people put eye liner on the 'shelf' bit which is horizontal underneath the top lashes? Because I don;'t and I always have a gap. A stripe of pink underneath my liner.

Any tips would be appreciated.

Does anyone know anyone who's had semi-permanenet make up done? Apparently you can have eyeliner 'done', lasts 2 years and makes you eyelashes look thicker/darker by optical illusion.
On a less dramatic note I've dyed my own lashes with a kit before but it was pretty ineffective, might get them done in a salon one day.

Is barbara cartland still alive??

thanks all. I am now wearing almost perfect eyeliner. i bought liquid stuff a few weeks ago, and tried to apply it to disastrous effect. with a bit of advice and a steady hand i have succeeded! I am no longer an eye liner virgin!

coughs politely. was feeding dd2 actually!

I am 34. but v dodgy crows feet due to v sensitive skin and eye lurgy for ages similar to cods current dilemma. the combo inc steroids resulted in to my eyes pretty bad crows feet which was putting me off smiling. I have no lines anywhere else (smug!)

I now have no crows feet and according to my ever patient dh look about 25. I would say 28ish.

it was 150 quid. Got it done by local dentist who has specialised in various cosmetic thingys for years. don't look weird as not frzen he is v good at it, also as eyes not brow not as obvious i think?

have been accused of looking well rested joke really i haven't had a full nights sleep for about 3 years.

all i need now is a dark shadow miracle and I will look 16 again .

i will see if i can crop photos enough to post.

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where is this dentist,anywhere in the hants/dorset region.Sounds cheap,I thought it was about £250.
I want it between my eyes,but am 10 yrs older than you.

I'd say 150 quid is very good. I thought it would be about 300. But I'm well past the point of anything preventative. Am fancying one of them acid peel things TBH, like on 10 years younger programme.

yep Ggirl.. i'm 10 years older too.

150 in scotland i'm afroad. it is 150 per area so if I had wanted the brow done too it would have been 300.

apparently the preventative one should be done from 27 .

i just look normal really but less wrinkly.

haven't seen my chum since she had hers done she is late forties. will have a look and report back. she was forehead not eyes.

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Its the frowny bit between the eyes I want doing.

me too themoon shall we go togehter?

no no no to botox!!!!!

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Scotland is a long way to go.

why why why southeastra?

Oh get a grip... tis only a bit of botulism injected into your face, what's not to like

yes all in the name of vanity!

it doesn't look right

you freeze your muscles for a few weeks, then they will sag more because they haven't been moved. it's make people look older sooner

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don't believe you ,prove it

Ive never heard of this sagging thing. well only when people lie down too soon after and it all goes to one side of the face, or when they fly long haul too soon or something.

Knowing my luck I'd end up looking like i'd had a stroke or Bells Palsy or summat!

why would people mess with their faces? it's odd