What's your definition of frumpy?

[stripytees]

I don't know if this is an MN thing but I'm always seeing people saying clothes from brands like Boden and White Stuff are frumpy.

I don't understand.

My definition of frumpy is someone who dresses very plain and quite old-fashioned - like black or navy work trousers (probably badly fitting) with a plain t-shirt that was bought 10 years ago and got a bit out of shape, with a cardigan that is slightly too big and probably in an unflattering colour, worn with very sensible shoes like those from the Clarks UnStructured range.

Boden and White Stuff and other similar brands on the other hand sell short, colourful dresses and skirts, scoop neck tops, bright prints, high heels and colourful flats... the opposite of frumpy! But maybe I'm odd because I don't even consider M&S clothes frumpy although I think it's also possible to buy frumpy clothes from M&S.

FWIW I'm in my early 30's.

On the other hand, the last time I wandered in there people seemed to be buying things - just not me.

Today's fashions are a bit tricky imo.

You want to wear something longish to cover your bum/hips in their skinny jeans or tights. Then the longish top isn't warm enough on it's own and hangs down below your jacket. So I have long tops hanging in the wardrobe, waiting for warm and dry enough weather to wear on their own.

I have a nice coat to wear over the above but it rains here, a lot, I really can't wear my 200 quid coat in constant showers.

Sadly british fashion never considers british weather.

Boots are great though. But boots need the above (leggings or skinny jeans) so back to square one.

Why do you want to cover your bum or hips? Speak for yourself!
IMO many of the frumpiest styles around are the floaty type tunics or empireline tops that are made to cover a tummy or bum. They don't fool anyone and just say 'I'm trying to cover my bum'.
The answer is weight loss and exercise - or wearing a dress or skirt which may be more flattering.

I never wear tops that are long enough to cover my bum and hips. They look really bad on me. I wear skinny jeans with a normal length jumper or tuck in a shirt.

A top that covers your bum is a dress.

particularly if you are wearing it over tights.

I think Moniker is right about coats. It can look a bit odd if your hem sticks out underneath your coat or jacket, but sometimes its unavoidable unless you have lots of coats.

I don't cover my bum either - it's my muffin top that is out of place and needs to be kept under wraps - I am an hourglass and I think hips are shapely - and mine certainly are not going to budge regardless of how skinny I get.

pinkfrocks
Why do you want to cover your bum or hips

Because I have some shame, unlike too many others.

I'm over 60 and work with vulnerable people, often in hospitals/ care homes, really swanning around in uncovered leggings is a nono (or short leather jackets). Even the 20 somethings I work with don't go for that!

My hips are slim (size 12-14, 5 ft 9) - I am not out to prove anything, just look smart and stylish.

Dresses are just not warm enough at this time of year ime, prob depends if you spend your day in a heated office or not.

Yes agree on that. A significant amount of top visible beneath your coat can look fine nowadays as long as colours, style etc complement each other and the whole effect looks planned and pulled together. A little bit hanging down, not so much so.

Btw, also want to support those speaking out against ageism on this thread. MN has an anti-ageist policy yet all too often I, as one of the older posters here, see hugely ageist and stereotyping comments such as ' would be worn by a 60 year old' as a way of damning things and the assumption that frumpy = 'old'.

Not so. There are frumpy - and stylish - dressers of all ages and lots of women of my age ( including my friends) who wouldn't be seen dead in Per Una and the various other unstylish styles and brands that have been mentioned.

Moniker but leggings are meant to be worn under a dress anyway! I don't think anyone wears leggings as 'trousers' with a waist-length top- well, some people might but they look ghastly, especially if they are thin leggings showing their white knickers underneath which I've seen now and then.

I've given up on leggings because I find them too cold in winter- being made from cotton- and too hot and sweaty in summer. I wear merino wool tights under dresses or longer tunics, in winter, with boots.

I agree about the ageist comments that often crop up here.
There are 60 year olds and 60 year olds. I think some people think of a 60 year old as Les Dawson in drag, rather than say Twiggy, Lulu, Jane Asher- all 60+ and gorgeous.

The trick with coats and hems is to not show a little. If it hangs below go for a shorter coat - it's all about proportions innit?

Yes, but while I have many items of clothing, I don't have that many coats. One at last count.

Why is teal frumpy Twinkelstein? Seems avert strange comment .Irsa colour for e frumpy)ffs .And. Either wish washy or overly right .And suits most colouring(I wear it a lot and I don't think my worst enemy would call me frumpy )

Whoops above sounds a bit drunk I'm not Typing on phone....mistake

Yes Ladyb49 my DDs have strict instructions re grooming etc when I get past it ...I didn't mean to sound critical .It just makes me sad and a bit scared,if truth be told

And IMO bums need covering if you are wearing thin-ish leggings or tights .Esp if you have VPL -the epitome of frump .

And IMO bums need covering if you are wearing thin-ish leggings or tights

If you are wearing tights without covering your bum then you've clearly gone out of the house having forgotten to put your dress or skirt on!

It's not such a case of age, but of shape , and unfortunately as one ages one's shape does generally alter. Of course some people will jump up and cite someone or other who is a size 8 and 80, but for the most part one's waist thickens, boobs head south and one gets all those annoyingly unattractive features such as wrinkly neck and cleavage.

But when I think of stylish older women, I think of, for example, Honor Blackman, or Mary Berry - and they are thin . I'm not saying thin = good, but thin = looks better in clothes.

Regarding frumpiness, my no. 1 thing that makes people look terrible is hair-dos. The wildest-looking greasy mop looks ten times better than something coiffed. To my mind Mary Beard's hair looks massively trendier than, say, a primped newsreader's effort.

Frumpiness - what is it? Another stick to beat women with, that's what it is. Is there an equivalent word for men? No.

Of course, I completely support any woman's desire to dress to make herself look business-like/pretty/fun/elegant/edgy/arty/sporty/sexy - whatever she chooses. Or just to say sod all that and dress to be comfortable and warm. But the idea that there are certain things we can't wear because then we'll be 'frumpy' just smacks of sexism - and probably ageism to boot.

I always get the impression that "frumpy" is code for "middle aged", and would agree with BrendaBlackhead about shape. If you're toned, you can wear anything. Fleece looks sexy if you're fit.

I fit right into a lot of posters' Frump lists. It's really okay though. I'm getting to a point where I'd rather wear what suits me: figure-wise and comfort level-wise. I have tried and tried to wear things that are technically on-trend. But boyfriend jeans make me look fat. Same with a lot of blouses. High heels, depending on how they're built, mess up my feet. And I am far more likely to smile and give the world the best of me if I have comfy feet.

A lot of teenagers in my area like to wear black leggings with waist-length hoodies or jackets. I have no desire to dress remotely like a teenager - I am very happy to have left those years behind!

I disagree, dotty2, that being thought of as frumpy is sexist or ageist.

Mil, in her 80s, was never frumpy. She just wasn't a frumpy person. I know many, many older women and they always look very good, even if they couldn't care less and are just wearing dog-walking stuff. As I said, their one thing in common is their shape and a certain je ne sais quoi.

I would say men suffer from exacty the same "frumpism". Some men look good in their clothes - at whatever age and however much or little they've spent - and some look like - using the word pejoratively - dads .

Ha! Yes, maybe you're right and 'dad' is the male equivalent.

I think hair is the biggest factor in frumpiness along with size.
I'm afraid that when I see women queueing up to buy a dress or whatever and look at their hair, I wonder why they bother! I saw someone yesterday who must have been about 50 or older with a one-colour dyed bob, straight fringe, centre parting and the ends of the bob turned under, very stiffly, in a very 70s style. It looked like a helmet.

Maybe I am uber- critical and happy to be flamed, but I see very few older women ( by that I mean over 40 , not teenagers) who look as if they have made any effort with their hair, make up or clothes. Yes there are some exceptions but maybe 50% or more look as if they have just given up- or never tried at all.