Harrassment from X - anyone Else Dealt With - Long Sorry!

[prettyfly1]

Hi Guys

Hope you are all well. As some of you will remember dp and dss moved out for a little while in the summer, when I was about twenty weeks pregnant to give me a break from the relentless financial pressure (dp is a student teacher so I am the breadwinner and we had dss fifty percent minimum so I had taken him on as well which was pretty tough when my contract got cut in the recession). Dss is and was also very challenging (which is to be expected when your whole life is in near constant upheaval) and we had discovered at the time that dss mother, my partners ex was off work with severe depression after breaking up with her partner, which was impacting on the lad heavily.

Since then we continued to spend at least one day or evening together "as a family" once a week to keep consistency and try to enjoy one another without the financial pressure or forced "parenting" affecting things. This worked really well and things settled enough that when I went into hospital with the pregnancy a couple of weeks ago dp moved back in.

The problem started in the summer. Dps ex seemed to get a little bit, clingy, I suppose is the right word. She started texting him for any reason, calling constantly (we will be in bed at eleven thirty and the phone will go for something totally random). At first I just warned him to be careful - she isnt in a good place and he needed to make sure that his attempts at friendship werent being interpreted as anything else. But I didnt take it too seriously - they cant divorce as parents and if they got on dss is happier which makes my life easier.

This started to escalate in October. She had started calling his mum without his knowledge and taking her out. Again he expressed his dislike of this but let it go provided his son was happy. Then she got it into her head that her impending plastic surgery was going to kill her and started to rant at dp about how he should only have fifty percent custody WHEN she dies, not if, with messages that are pages and pages long turning up in the middle of the night. This resulted in a huge argument caused by her at his mothers, in front of dss where she actually said to her six year old "when I die who do you want to live with"??? Also at about this time no matter how many times dp told her he was still with me, every time I got mentioned she would say something like "oh are you back with her - well it isnt serious is it?" - no I am just heavily pregnant with his child love.

In the last couple of weeks, since he moved back in things are blowing up really quickly and to be honest I am now a little bit frightened. I am due to give birth any day now but since she found out he had moved back in here she has seriously not stopped calling and texting constantly. It started when he asked to change his custody days. She refused at first sending abusive texts, then when we said that fine I would look after him while dp worked she went off about how I was a risk? to her son and he couldnt be on his own with me as he is uncomfortable - which is true by the way - dss has never quite settled with me as he really wants his mum and dad to get back together and she told him that because I was with daddy he didnt want her anymore.

If it was just that I could almost cope with it but its gone well beyond that. She phones to abuse me constantly. I wont take her calls, so she starts pretending to want to sort things out with dp, then within minutes the streams of ranting about me begin - crazy accusations, insisting that she is more important to him because they got married, and wierd comments about who and what I am, followed up with nasty names and insinuations that lead to dp just putting the phone down. To give you an example, I knew them both for years before dp and I got together and apparently I engineered the end of their marraige, stalked them from the day one (I lived in three hundred miles away for four years and only spoke to dp once in that time?) then not again when my son was born for three years - we didnt get back in touch AT ALL until he was already seperated. Apparently despite having NEVER been involved in anything criminal or illegal in my life I am dangerous and violent. I dont even have a parking ticket.

But the worst of it is that she is actively trying to persuade dp to leave me and has hired a solicitor to try and force it saying that custody was fine till he moved in here and my "temperemant" is the problem. So now we have legal letters slating me with no proof, no basis and no examples, turning up at the house!!!

I have my own happy balanced kids, I work really hard and she was happy to let me raise and pay for her son for nearly a year with no interruption, including his birthday and christmas day last year. Boxing day she came over and had tea with us. Their divorce was a blow to her and I understand that - she tried to stop it going through but surely I dont have to take this. The constant calls, slander and abuse in my own home are now really getting me down and I dont know how much longer i can cope for.

I have asked dp to not talk to her anymore and not to engage over it and he is calling a mediator today but it wont stop her. This seems to be nothing to do with her son, it is about me, its all she talks about - how she is a better mum and blah blah and the only way I can describe it is to liken it to the people on tv convicted of stalking who genuinly believe they have a relationship with the person they have been following around.

To make it even more worrying, we spoke to her ex partner, who contacted us as he isnt allowed to see thier son any more - she has also been following his parents around and sitting outside of his house, and tried to insist he had a twin brother noone knew about who was standing in for him whilst he went off to cheat with ALL of her friends, which is why they arent together any more. Once he left her over this(at about the same time as dp and I took some space) she banned him from seeing their child and is now trying to do the same to dp. She wont even let him talk to dss without her present and whispers what to say in his ear.

So sorry for the VERY long message, but I am just sitting here in tears wondering what has to happen to make her knock it off. This woman is showing signs of instability beyond anything I can imagine and I want it to stop - do I have to take this in my own home - last night I just told her to fxxk off and put the phone down as after twenty four hours of listening to it and trying to have some nice time putting the tree up I couldnt take anymore but today dp has said it is starting again already (he has turned his phone off). I dont want to cause more problems with access for dss but I really, really cant take any more abuse, harrasment and implied threats about making stuff up to tell social services to win the court case. The stress is keeping me up at night and dp is miserable and jumpy at the post and every time the phone rings, but for obviuous reasons desperately wants to be there for his son. I just want to have our baby in peace and enjoy what should be a special and peaceful time and I cant because of this harrassment - have any of you experienced this - how do you cope? Jammi, Elenor or surfer, I know you all had problems - any ideas at all??
Help.

Hi prettyfly,

I just read your message and really sympathise with you, I think you have been incredibly patient, much more than I would have been.

I got abuse from DH's ex in the early days of our relationship and it was hard to put up with it and I did really just for his sake and I wanted to tell her to off.

I'm sorry that I don't really have any advise for you but I just wanted to tell you that I think it is wrong what she is doing and she is clearly unstable. Your home is your safe place and you shouldn't be subjected to abuse there. Try to be strong and don't put up with it, hopefully your DP can also be strong and you guys will get through this and things get better for you.

Take care

Onion x

Hi,

I've dealt with something similar. DH's ex used to call us just to rant and rave constantly.

As we wouldn't take her calls, she'd leave bright and breezy messages saying there was something important about the kids she needed to talk about... Call back and BAM you'd get it in the neck about money (it was and is always money with that woman)

So, make it clear (write her a letter - through a solicitor if you can) - that you will deal with her only by text or e-mail. If she says she can't afford it, get her a PAYG SIM card and put £10 on each month for hre to use to contact you. Even better (if you can) get her a contract so that YOU can keep a log of the calls she makes to you.

Whatever you do, DO NOT try to reason with her. AS DH has said a million times, what is reasonable when you are as mad as a bloody hatter???!!!! She almost certainly doesn't see what she's doing as unreasonable.

other (practical) things you can do are:

1. Bar her number
2. Get choose to refuse and bar any number that abuses you (You don't even need to know the number for this... It'll bar withheld numbers too)
3. If barring her number isn't an option, get a phone that has caller ID and (even better) create a specific ring tone for her number so you are prepared for it.

and 4. and I appreciate that this is a last and final resort BUT!!... You have your own kids to worry about. If you need to, then you have to detach yourself from DSS. I am not saying you don't love him / care for him, but he has a mum, and your kids need THEIR mum.

I have two DSDs who I love dearly, but I'm not nearly so close to them as I was 3-4 years ago, because (for my own sanity) I had to detach, just let it go. We are still friends and I hope that, in years to come, they will see that I let it go for everyone's benefit.

HM x

Buy a voice recorder and tape all this. That's my advice for starters.
Maybe you could also get a non molestation order.
DP would know more about this, I will point him in this direction later.
For the moment pull the bloody phone out of the wall.
You do not need this crap when your pregnant. I am so angry on your behalf. Keep strong lovely. Will post later when not at work xx

It's harassment, you could certainly get advice from the police or go to CAB for legal advice.

Just of warning... if you don't make it clear that you are recording someone, it can actually work against you (even if the evidence is there)

If you DO record it, please state (so it's clear) that you are doing so at the start of each conversation.

I heard that you ARE actually allowed to record with the consent of ONE party ... i.e. yourself.

The judge might not allow a transcript into evidence, but that's a different matter.

Hey there

Just wanted to echo EVERYTHING haribosmummy has said. Detach detach detach is my motto.

I was shouted at in the street by my DP's ex a few weeks ago. Had never met her up to that point. It was a fluke meeting on a night out with him in town.

I reported the matter to the police and haven't taken it further for now, but DP has been left in no doubt that if she approaches me again, I will take action with the police and the general medical council - she's a doctor and she won't be able to practice if she has a criminal record.

You have more important things to focus on right now. Please focus on them. Detach from her. A fire needs oxygen to burn so don't give her any.

let us know how you get on.

good luck

xx

If you want to use recordings as evidence, then the person you are using it against MUST know that they were being recorded (does that make sense?)

Otherwise they can say that you were provocing them.

You are on very dodgy ground if they don't know (or you can't prove they knew)

Hi Guys

Thanks so much for all the support - mrsjammi I still have the same mail add so you should be able to get hold of me. Finally went on mat leave this week so would appreciate the support xx

Thanks as well Elenor - we went out for a bit of space when dp got back this affie and took ds (mine) for dinner which is probably the last time on our own b4 new baby turns up so I feel a wee bit more relaxed this evening - just really needed to escape!x.

I know you guys are absolutely right and dp agrees but its so hard when its your own home she is determined to violate. I know she is mental, I just feel for my dss. I dont love him in that maternal way yet but I am starting to understand why its so hard for him watching the way his mother has and is behaving.

Thanks again xx

Oh sweetheart, this sounds horrendous and you're so heavily pregnant too.

I agree with jammi. Change your numbers. Limit the ways in which she can get in touch.

Refuse to get into any discussion and don't get drawn into any arguments. Dsd's mum was once raging down the phone at me, having phoned dh all sweetness and light and asking to speak to me - then once I was on the phone she let rip.

Do you know what I did? I put the phone in my knicker drawer and waited for the noise to stop .

But joking aside, it's not nice at all and I used to shake if the phone rang because there was always an argument or hassle of some sort from either dsd's mum or her then partner.

What you MUST keep telling yourself is that you haven't done anything. Detaching is the way to go (easier said than done I know) - this is all about her stuff and nothing to do with you and how you are being.

The one thing I regret from the time when I was having problems was not taking it further. Especially when she phoned my elderly parents. I think contacting the police and reporting it is a good idea, even if you don't take it further. It will make you feel like you are able to do something because I bet you are feeling pretty powerless right now.

Don't worry about causing problems with the contact. It doesn't matter what you do she is going to find a way of being difficult about that by the sounds of it. Make you and the baby your priority right now.

And I do wonder whether her GP should be made aware because she sounds to me like she could be ill, especially with the story with her other ex partner.

Please, please CAT me and we can hook up via email or facebook if you'd like to. You and I are always on the same wavelength, and if there's any way I can help support you right now I'd be happy to.

Sounds horrendous, there has been some good advice so far.

You need to take care of yourself and the baby. You need the least amount of stress in your life and plenty of rest. When my DP was pregnant and my ex was kicking off (it was going through family court system) my DP actually collapsed in work through all the stress, she was signed off work through it. You don't want this to happen!

The ex sounds unhinged, she sounds seriously mentally unstable. Maybe she is seriously depressed but her actions of abuse, harassment (especially the hanging around her other ex's house!) are a serious cause for concern.

You need to take a step back and DP needs to step up and be the main barrier in all of this. This has nothing to do with you and you should not be drawn into it. Your DP needs to be very pro-active in this due to your pregnancy.

OK here are my thoughts under various action points;

Telephone calls texts etc
Keep a log of all communication by the ex.

Keep a diary - a 1 page per day A5 diary.

You already have text evidence so think about transcribing

The DP does not interact with the ex unless it is about immediate child concerns. Once any telephone calls start becoming abusive or harassing then DP needs to say something like "I do not appreciate the tone of your voice. You are becoming abusive and harassing. Can you stop otherwise I will end this conversation"

Then if it continues, say that you are ending this conversation and put the phone down. Do all of the above politely and clearly. You are defining clear boundaries and stating this behaviour is unacceptable (a bit like treating a child). This will also have the side effect of empowering you guys and making you fell a bit more in control.

Communicate only by email or writing
Request (do it by email, verbally and in writing) to the ex that she communicate only in writing / email from now.
Request that only communication that is child-focused and related to child is this way. State that you have found her communications (abusive phone calls, numerous texts, emails) to be distressing and harassing.

Telephone/conversation recording
I would record all telephone calls.

It is NOT illegal to record telephone calls. If you are recording a conversation between 2 parties (e.g. DP and the ex) then only 1 of those parties needs to give consent - and as the DP is one of those parties he gives consent!

It IS illegal to record telephone conversations between 2 parties if you are a 3rd party and you do not have consent.

Look at it this way: The ex is bombarding you with abusive, harassing calls. She has threatened to make up something to SS if it goes through family court system (this is actually domestic violence and you should consider getting it logged as such with the police domestic violence unit).

You have your word against hers. If you have INDEPENDENT AUDIO EVIDENCE then use it. The police will be compelled to act. There is a systematic campaign of abuse and harassment.

You can buy a portable digital voice recorder from argos (there are good Olympus models for around £35). It will record for around 6 hours and includes software and cabling for transfer to PC.

You can buy a telephone pic up mic from a company called ndeva;
www.ndeva.co.uk/telephone.0.html
(use the TP7 model)

There is a distinction between criminal and civil law here. In civil law then the burden of proof is 'on the balance of probabilities' e.g. who tells the most believable story, and you if you have evidence of the ex's behaviour then that can only help your case. It would be hard for the ex to say she wasn't howling down the phone when you have the recordings! If need be you can transcribe these conversations at a later date for appending to any statements later to Court, hopefully it won't be needed.

Keep a diary for a week, record the telephone calls.

If she continues in this harassment then you have a diary, you have audio evidence, texts etc. You go to the police, get it logged as harassment and domestic violence against your DP (which it is, it falls within the legal definitions of DV). Ask the police to pay her a visit and have a word with her. You need at least 2 instances of such behaviour (after you have warned her off) before you can make an application to Court for a Non Molestation Order.

If your DP is a student then he is probably eligible for legal aid so consider using this route.

Solicitors letters
Ignore them for now. They are petty and unprofessional.

The sols are just writing what the ex is saying - they are representing their client.

It would be worthwhile later on thinking about making a complaint to the senior partner of the firm about such letters and also asking if they can be disclosed to Court in regards to any later proceedings you intend to bring regarding harassment.

phew.

hope that helps

Let me know how things go - bottom line is start documenting it, warn the ex off and ask for communication only in writing/email. Record calls, visit the police and consider a non-mol.

How are you doing today prettyfly?

prettyfly how are you?

As an ex (who is both accused of harassing her ex and also accuses him of the same) the only constructive thing I can suggest is pro-activeness. Meaning that as soon as an issue comes up (or is likely to), DH should not wait for ex to call him but proactively call her (or better email/text her) himself.

This does probably not reduce the amount of communication between them (at least not initially), but at least it would be him who controls when it takes place.

Attack is the best form of defence, if you see what I mean.

Hi Guys

Sorry for not being in touch - I went into labour on tuesday and delivered wednesday night!!! Baby prettyfly weighed in at 7 pound 12 and turned up roaring So at the moment now is all about baby bedding in.

We were a bit poorly at first so they only let us out today but I wanted to thank you all for the excellent advice and support and also thanks the people who cat - I will catch up with you next week when stuff settles down a bit.

Thanks All of you and have a lovely weekend!

congrats!!!!!

Congrats!!! Is baby prettyfly a girl fly or a boy fly??? Sorry, you are the second one today with baby news, so I'm getting broody now.

Congrats. hmx

Ahhh thanks guys - absolutely shattered (he is a boy prettyfly btw) but really happy and my other ds is being amazing. DSS meeting tomorrrow so will let oyu know how it goes!!!

Awwww congratulations all you prettyflys!! Bless you xxx

Thanks Elenor. Visit with dss never happened yesterday. Apparently he was sick - ex text at seven in the morning. grrr.

What lovely news! Congratulations to you all and welcome little prettyfly x x

Oh no , I can't believe I've put kisses on mumsnet . I always end messages to friends like that and did it automatically!