DP's ex wants DD to live with her & DD says she wants to leave - DP distraught

[mistressmiggins]

DP has custody of DD (11)
exW left the country 3 yrs ago and left DD with her dad.
exW came back pretty quickly but since then has not wanted DD

since Ive known him (2yrs) his ex has had 7 boyfriends, 3 houses (renting) and only has DD every other weekend.

now since splitting from latest BF, she has suddenly decided she wants DD to live with her. She lets DD stay up late at weekends, buys her anything she wants & they stay in watching DVDs. She has never paid a penny towards her upkeep which DP is fine with.

He rang me last night & is distraught. He is concerned that his DD will be home alone after school til his exW gets in and DD will have to move schools AGAIN. He doesnt want to say no for fear of alienating his DD & exW.

Any ideas or should he just accept she wants to move & be there if it doesnt work out?
Seems so unfair cos he is a brilliant dad and we were thinking of moving in together in next 6 mths with his DD obviously moving in too. She even has her own room at my house.

MistressMiggins...
Given your DP's ex's unpredictablility and irresponsibility I feel your DP really has to think hard about whats best for his DD. Is it really a good idea to let her go live with a mum who's abandoned her for years, who has beena revolving door where boyfriends are concerned and who doesnt have suitable accomadation for a child?

He is now the primary carer for his DD and the one that has provided love and stablity for her through some very rough times. I really think he would be letting his DD down by letting her upsticks to live with someone as unrelaiable as her mother.

In family law status quo is very important. The status quo as it is now is that DD is resident with dad. If mum went to the courts trrying to get residence atm she would have a very hard time espeicially given the unsuitablity of her accomadation.

I think your DP needs to ready himself for a fight. Prepare for the worst but hope for the best.

A question...
Who has the child benefit?

I agree that there needs to be a lot of talking between you all to reassure her, you obviously care a great deal about her and your DP and i agree that she will probably want to be reassured lots, she is probably very confused with all the things that are going on especially if her mum is trying to manipulate her

would you all be able to meet up to talk, i mean with DSD's mum? would that do any good?

I've been searching for a 'nice' way to say this but can't think of one, so will just have to blurt it out:
Don't you think she might be worried about moving in with you and sees moving to her mum's as a way to avoid that?
Looking from her perspective, she's had her dad to herself for all these years and now she's having to share him with a woman who thinks she's spoilt. Might she feel threatened?

I'd say let her go for 3 weeks over the summer but then she is to come home and if in 6mths she still wants to go I'd say let her go, she'll soon come back when she finds it isn't a bed of roses.

I begged my mum to let me live with my dad from the age of 14, when i was almost 16 she let me go by then I was determined to make it work, I came back to live with my mum when I was 17 and pregnant (not what my mum had in mind) my dad found it harder to cope with me than he had anticipated as well.

I say don't make a big deal of it, she will choose to come home imo.

suggest that you both reassure her that you want her to stay with you and that you would miss her a great deal if she wasn't with you. Then at least you start from the position that she knows she is wanted and loved.

I don't think you've actually said the child wants to go permanently, just that your DP is worried? Has he discussed it with her? Has he offered compromises like staying with her mother in the holidays?

DP has child benefit & minimum working tax credit allowance.
I think what is more worrying is the changing of schools which it would entail cos they live in different towns.
We were going to move her anyway cos again, I live 50 mins away BUT it would have been a final move and so many benefits to her.

talking to DSD's mum - cant see that being an option really - not for me anyway although she is perfectly fine with me (on the surface anyway) I came along after she'd abandoned them both.

I really dont think your DP's DD future can be left to chance, at 11 she is still very much a child.

MMiggins from your information your DP's DD has been horribly let down by her mum. DP's DD for whatever reason may want to be with her mum atm...
*maybe its that she doesnt want to live with you as Sazisi said
*maybe she feels guilty about her mum leaving her before and so wants to please her
*maybe her mum is manipulating her, come to mine, you can stay up late, we can do girlie things together

or whatever.

Your partner has been the primary carer the stable parent for his DD for a number of years. The ex has never shown such commitment and stability.

Kids want to do all sort of stuff that parents say no too.

In this case I think your DP needs to explain to his DD that she of course can see mum loads but that her base is still with dad.

ATM your DP may feel distraught but legally he is in the driving seat.

Mum abandoned their DD which makes him the primary carer and he also has CB which also makes him the parent with care in the eyes of the CSA.

They will ask dad jump through the hoop of mediation, courts like dads to be seen to try talking to the ex's, even though any agreements are not admissible in court

I missed Sazisi's comment but it is a fair one.
However, she hasnt had dad to herself as such - well apart from after school for 2 hrs every week - we have been seeing each other every weekend since beginning of this yr and she has even put a name plate on her door in my house.
Last weekend she was going on about decorating "her" room in my house.
She has a bigger room than my DD (4) cos she is older so definitely cant feel 2nd best

yes I do reprimand her as I do equally my own DCS. Children I believe need boundaries. I suspect she just fancies the life of "girls together" with her mum but fear that the reality will be very different.

DP has never restricted access for exW but the truth is she has never wanted her more than once a fortnight & never asked to have her live with her. The reality is that if exW gets a new BF (no 8) she probably wont want DSD living with her.

Its a nightmare & DP is scared purely cos he is male!

DP been talking to DSD and she wants to stay with him til Xmas.....he feels she doesnt really want to go

I wonder if she is insecure about everything - we havent talked definite moving in dates and so maybe she feels talk of her decorating her room at mine is just that - talk.

I have told him to arrange for her to see the local school by me & see how near it is to home - she would be able to walk to & from school by herself in 15 mins. I would be home 4 out of 5 days and the 1 day I wont be home, I would be home within an hour, and my mother lives 5 mins away so she could go there if there was a problem. My family absolutely accept & love her - we went away with my brother's family for a week at Easter & she loved it! In fact she thinks my brother & SIL are cool! (they dont live with her

thanks so much for your support & advice today - as always over last 4 yrs I know I can rely on MN to support & offer good advice
xx

How are things today?

Do you feel ready to set a moving date yet or not? Is it possible this may help your situation both with her feeling secure and possibly legally for your DP if they see you have a stable homelife?

Sorry, I haven't read all of this thread, but felt I had to post...

Can your DP and his Ex talk? Could he request that they meet (with or without mediation) and discuss how the hand over will go?

It's possible (and again, I apologise if this has come up but I don't think it has) that his ex is desperate to keep DD in her life and therefore prepared to do anything for her to ensure that... Perhaps if your DP could talk to the ex and have her understand that this will not happen, she might calm down a bit.

This probably won't be popular on MN, but here goes: My DH acts just like this around his DDs. GIves them pretty much anything they want, lets them stay up far too late (so much so they are grumpy little shits madams the next day) eat the wrong food, no manners enforced etc.,

He does it because his time with them is so limited and he's so worried about the relationship he does have with them being sabotaged (Jammi is in a similar position) so he goes along with it.

The kids have his passwords to i-tunes and ebay etc., and just buy stuff which is then charged to him. I don't know that he even checks.

I always defer to him re. the kids, as they are my DSDs and I've had times DSD1 has had boys in her room (huge no-no for me) and also stayed up way past 11pm (I was 38 weeks PG at the time and went to bed far earlier!!)

BUT (and this is a good BUT) If they were here full time, he'd never do it. He's a really good dad. He is, he's just desperate to (i) maintain a relationship with his girls and (ii) to enjoy the (very small) amount of time he actually gets to spend with them.

It might be worth a shot (surely it has to be) for your DP and his ex to try and work something out?

Anyway, just wanted to add that, for whatever it's worth.

YCBS you are possibly one of the nicest positive optimistic people I know on mn. Sadly I am way more cynical.

Why would this woman suddenly become desperate to keep her daughter in her life?
Firstly it seems mistressmiggins DP has positively facilitated her seeing their daughter despite her dubious record
ie she is already in her daughters life.
Secondly...
She abandoned her daughter and put bf after bf before even bothering to see her DD.

The cynic in me thinks she has some other motivation as she seems to have shown scant regard for her DD's welfare in the past.

I have a daughter, no matter what the circumstance was I could never even imagine abandoning her.

ElenorRigby - I totally agree. I cannot contemplate ever leaving my DCS. DP is a good dad and when we first got together, he let her drink coke for breakfast "cos she wanted it". She now only has fruit juice or milk and NEVER asks for anything else. She is happy with the boundaries I impose (awful word) and understands that it's for her health. I think he was scared that if he didnt give her everything she wanted, she would hate him. He still feels like this but I hope I have enabled him to know that showing her boundaries makes her feel safer.

We dont think she does want to leave but I suspect she is torn between pleasing both parents. Sad but true.

We are both going with DSD to the middle school near me on Friday so she can see for herself. She will then see how near it is to my house as we will then pick my DS up from school next door.

I think partly the fact we keep talking about "when you move in" but dont put a date or action into place, that she may think it will never happen.

I do want to live as a family of 5 rather than weekend family of 5 but it is scary for me considering father of my 2 DCS left 3 yrs ago. Once bitten twice shy. Think I am reluctant to make it permanent so I dont get hurt again.

BUT DP is NOT exH and I dont think he will hurt or leave me. Week days are lonely without him or his support and living as a family would be great. My DS (6) prefers DP to pick him up from school on a friday over me! They have a "man" chat on the way home....

I hope it works out....

I cannot contemplate ever leaving my DCS.

I agree also. ANd I think my DH agrees more than his life is worth. It wasn't a decision that he took, It was one taken for him.

All he has now is the time allocated to him. He will do anything to ensure that that time is spent with his DCs and that they have everything they want (material or otherwise) while they are with him.

just wanted to update and get advice as we're struggling

DP & DSD have moved in and she settled into new school really well.
However last 2 weeks have been terrible and she has changed. She used to sit in lounge when my 2 in bed & we would chat & watch TV together or play games...now she either sits in other room watching DVDs or in her room. She is very quiet and hardly says a word.

her mother has sent letter from solicitor
DP has been to solicitor and been told that she hasnt a hope of getting custody of DSD BUT DSD says she wants to live with her mum

this will mean swapping schools AGAIN as she lives in next town

I have re-read this thread and feel it is the wrong thing to do BUT she is making us miserable in the evenings.

I want to be strong and say we'll fight but is there any point even though our gut feeling is she definitely should not move?

She's probably a little hormonal. Has dp asked her why she wants to live with her mum? I think it's quite a normal thing to want, regardless of how her mum has treated her in the past. She's approaching puberty and that is something you want your mum to support you with. She may have an excellent relationship with you, but you aren't her mum.

You may find that it is just a case of the grass being greener and, if she did move in with her mum, she may find that it's not what she imagined it to be.

Moving schools is hard at that age and yes yucky hormones. Really perhaps she needs to spend her holidays with her mum and every weekend so the novelty wears off?

I think you're right Freckle.
I am not her mum and can totally understand why she wants her mum.
Think this is why we have to resign ourselves to her leaving and hope it all works out for them both
My 2 DCs are sad about it and a little unsettled I think....

Her mum might find living with a hormonal pre-teen isn't all she imagined either. If she gave up on her daughter so easily before, I suspect she won't last the distance once puberty really kicks in.

Unfortunately both of them are adament this is what they want and she is continuing with legal advice.
DP doesnt want to go to court even though he knows he will win because he doesnt want his DD to resent him.

Can you suggest to her that she does school only with you for the rest of the year and spends Friday after school to mon morning with her Mum with a view to her moving schools next Sept?

In some ways it would be easier for her to move schools now so early in the year and then if it doesn't work out she will then be stable with you for the rest of her secondary years?

Hi, I normally would say leave it, but rereading 1st post, it seems neglectful to let her go back.

But I have no idea how you can make it happen without court. You could try bribery and pampering etc to counter balance the attraction. And you could try to drag it out, it might be a passing phase.

She has only just moved schools in Sept so that she had a fresh start.
Now the idea is she moves again at Xmas to another area & another school.
Her mum doesnt want her every weekend - DP has already offered that months ago. She doesnt even have her during the week (it is possible for her with her work)
If she moves to her mums, we will never be able to have her during the week cos of our jobs - we wouldnt be able to get her to school.

I don't think dd shoudl be given the option tbh, 11 is still very young and they still need boundaries. the ex hasn't proved herself to be responsible by the sound of it so your dp should just say no, she's not going to be allowed to live with her mother. Just because the mother demands it and the dd wants it doesnj't mean it's the right thing to do. At 11 she doesn't need to be disrupted again, I think your dp should say no and let the ex apply through the courts if shge feels so strongly about it.

Do you think the mum would go to court? Can she afford it or is she on legal aid? I have my doubts that legal aid would be granted because they don't have to consider just the financial aspects, but they also have to consider whether she has a reasonable chance of success. It doesn't sound to me as though she would.

However, although we as mums know that 11 is very young, the courts will ask dd what she wants to do and they will take it into account. Now that doesn't mean that if she says she wants to live with mum, the court will say OK. But it is a factor they will consider.