Withholding Clothes

[Justalittlerose]

Need some ideas please. SD's (9) Mum is withholding her school uniform. She comes to ours on a day that isn't a uniform day and goes from ours to school in full uniform. CMA is paid. We buy a full duplicate uniform so 3 jumpers, 6 shirts, 4 trousers and school shoes, this should be enough to cover any delays if either parent forgets one week. Court Order doesn't allow us to go to each others house so her things should be left at school on drop off day for the other to pick up when they get her. We don't care about them being our clothes as they are all hers and she should be able to wear what she wants to both houses but it leaves us with the problem of running out. What can we do? Mum is HC.

Thank you for taking the time to reply and offer some great options. You know when your head gets so full of 'stuff' you don't know if there is a simple solution that you're just not seeing. I guess from all of the replies there isn't an easy fix but lots of great suggestions and I suppose reassurance that we are doing the right things.

Thank you for your kind words too. I try my hardest to just be a stable adult in her life and here when she needs me. I want her so badly to have a positive relationship with her Mum but sadly she has such a low opinion of her Mum because of this type of behaviour. If I thought grabbing a coffee with Mum would help then I would totally do it but Mum hates me. You are right in your thoughts, there are definitely narcissistic traits which is why we try to box the problems off rather than engage and give the bad stuff more attention.

I agree about going back to court to sort it out. Secondary school could be a whole other ball game if it's not sorted out by then. The primary school could help out here by having PE kit bags left at school though - most primary schools do this 🤷🏻‍♀️

OP hats off to you trying to find a solution to this. I don't see how you can without drawing the attention of your DSD as she would need to do something different to enable this.
Whilst it's a way off and hopefully you're not in quite like same place by then - my DSC asked once they were at high school to change the 50:50 so it was alternating weeks because keeping track of stuff was so much harder. So everything switched on Sunday and the kids were able to bring/leave all they needed.
We also doubled up on lots of things so we had sufficient of all clothing at both houses so they just needed to bring blazers and school shoes..

Ok if you're already in court that's good. If social services is reluctant to take action unless it's physical abuse, then bring all of this up with Cafcass during the proceedings. They absolutely do place heavy emphasis on child’s emotional wellbeing, and so any emotional harm to the child would be high on their agenda to prevent. Though as there is already a court order in place, I'm assuming you perhaps know how the UK family court system works. Gather all the evidence and remain 100% child focussed (as you are doing).

As I'm sure you know, with narcissists there's always one problem or another. If/when you get this resolved, there will be another problem. You are doing the right thing by not engaging with her excessively, and trying to keep the child out of it. It must be so hard when the other parent isn't parenting with you, but against you. For practical advice on how to deal with narcissist mothers I recommend to read Say Goodbye to Crazy.

All the best X

Thank you so much for your reply. That's really reassuring to hear regarding CAFCASS, I think we need to focus our efforts there in that case as it was a very brief chat with CAFCASS on the day. Also as Mum refused help leading up to and during the first hearing, CAFCASS actually said there were no current concerns. We were horrified because the school raise so many concerns too along with everything else we raise. I wish I could say more but that's for another day.

Thank you

Yes if you have involvement with CAFCASS as part of the proceedings they would be the right people to highlight all these issues. With CAFCASS it's very important to not slag the mother off at all (no matter how vile she is). All issues need to be framed from the perspective of the child. For example don't say "Mother isn't thinking about SD's best, she keeps withholding the clothes just to annoy OH and me", but rather say "We feel sad that DSD is having to feel embarrassed at school about the uniform situation. We have tried x, y and z to resolve it for her, but unfortunately none of the solutions are perfect and we're not sure what else to do", etc. To be honest I don't think you particularly need this advice as you're already framing everything here in very child focussed manner, so just keep at it. My point is just that CAFCASS must not be left with the impression that you have any beef with the mother, as this won't bode well and it may be seen that OH is just trying to use the court system to get back at the mother.

Family Courts are quite mother centric so don't be too surprised if OH needs to take a bit of a beating in the process. That having said, they do value the role of a committed father as well nowadays. But again as you already have an order you may know how this is. The most important thing is to try your best for DSD's sake. And with narcissist mothers court orders are usually the only thing that help - otherwise they just do as they please.

I feel your pain. We're in exactly the same boat. Fed up replacing stuff because DSDs mum won't return anything. She also finds it acceptable to send DSD to school in grubby clothes and underwear and socks from the day before. It's embarrassing sending her to school in the same clothes provided by her mum. See pic of polo shirt DSD was wearing when we picked her up from school this week. Clean vest for comparison. Photo doesn't even do it justice, it was bogging. Looked like DSD had worn the the entire week.

When DSD started school my DH asked her mum to put our uniforms straight in DSDs school bag unwashed and to hand over the unwashed uniforms at drop off or pick up, so they don't get lost in the wash like her entire nursery uniform did. She refuses to do this and denies having any of our stuff. She currently has 4 polo shirts, 3 pairs of leggings, a pair of school trousers, shorts and t-shirt set, 2 pairs of trainer and a gym bag. And that's just the school stuff. Denies all knowledge.

Thank you for this 🙏🏼 We are absolutely on the 'no negative Mum talk train' and as much as we vent to ourselves we have been completely child-focussed through this all. We've even begged for someone/anyone to tell us if we have done something/anything wrong in the hope that if that's what has led to it then it's an easy fix but we just get told we're doing everything right. It means a lot for people to notice that though as it can be wearing as I'm sure you can imagine.

Truth be told Mum will just find the next thing to cause drama over and do you know what, we can handle most things. However, when it comes to SD's school life where that's her neutral, safe, consistent space, then she shouldn't have to feel any kind of impact because of the actions or choices of adults in her life.

SD is becoming more confident as weeks go by and talking to the school safeguarding team about what is going on. If Mum keeps this up then it shows signs of heading only one way and that is really quite sad for everyone. I would love to be able to do stuff with her and her Mum but I am the enemy and have given up trying. Mum can be sweetness and light one minute and then throw accusations another. Message me asking for favours and then the next day threatening the police because I walked too close to her. I can't put myself in that position so we have chosen the grey rock method, it's been a slog but we have come a very long way.

Heartbreaking isn't it. I can't offer help but feel your pain