Exh refusing to return DD for another day

helplesshopeless · 2023-01-21T21:00:22+00:00

Posted this on the divorce board but maybe this is better placed here. My exh is threatening to keep my daughter another night tomorrow (she is at his 6/14 nights and comes back to me on Sunday nights after his weekend). He says if I come to pick her up he will call the police. What’s the best way to deal with this? I don’t want to unsettle her by turning up at his but I can’t let him just decide to change the pattern. She's expecting to come back to me for dinner tomorrow as normal. How do I go about this wisely? Do I just file for a court order if he doesn't bring her back? He has PR so the police won't be interested if I call.

Laurdo · 21/01/2023 22:03

Do you already have a court order in place? If not, you definitely need one if he's going to pull stunts like this.

Has he given you a reason why he's not returning her as expected? What age is she? Does he have a history of controlling behaviour?

My DHs ex withheld access to his DD for 8 weeks because she wanted to make a change to their verbally agreed custody agreement, he didn't agree (for good reasons) with the change so she held his daughter to ransome basically. He now has a court order in place but it does take time.

If he's only keeping her an extra night, unless you have fear for her safety just let him bring ber back the following night. Then absolutely file for a court order.

ladymacbeth · 21/01/2023 22:11

Has he said why he wants to keep her?

Original poster

helplesshopeless · 21/01/2023 22:17

@ladymacbeth he's always hated not having his 'fair share' and says he has a right to have half of her time. It's a control thing I think, as well as the status of being able to say he has 50%, plus wanting to spite me (always a bonus for him!).

@Laurdo no, we don't have a court order in place. We agreed the initial pattern through solicitors correspondence and then adjusted it through mediation when she started school. He has a history of being controlling and abusive, yes. Thankfully not towards my daughter.

OP posts:

Laurdo · 21/01/2023 22:22

helplesshopeless · 21/01/2023 22:17

@ladymacbeth he's always hated not having his 'fair share' and says he has a right to have half of her time. It's a control thing I think, as well as the status of being able to say he has 50%, plus wanting to spite me (always a bonus for him!).

@Laurdo no, we don't have a court order in place. We agreed the initial pattern through solicitors correspondence and then adjusted it through mediation when she started school. He has a history of being controlling and abusive, yes. Thankfully not towards my daughter.

Unless he mistreats your DD there's not really any reason why he shouldn't have 50%. Dads have as much right to see their kids as mums.

Deviating from an agreement however without agreeing it with you is absolutely not on.

NewNameNigel · 21/01/2023 23:58

Surely the root of this is that you haven't come to an agreement about how childcare is split that both of you are happy with. In a healthy co-parenting agreement there is room for flexibility and an extra night with dad here and there isn't an issue. Do you have any actual concerns about her safety or is it just the principle?

I feel like you are describing your daughter like a possession that you begrudgingly let your ex see for a short period of time rather than as a little girl who as a right to a relationship with her dad.

If you are your ex can't put your differences aside and come to an agreement that you are both happy with on your own perhaps you could consider mediation.

howdowedeal · 22/01/2023 03:47

"Status of having 50%".

StarsSand · 22/01/2023 04:38

Get a court order.

These situations are exactly why they exist

supersonicginandtonic · 22/01/2023 05:22

How old is your daughter? What does she want to do?
Your post is very much about what you and your ex-husband want.

Reugny · 22/01/2023 05:45

How old is your daughter? What does she want to do?

@supersonicginandtonic has raised an important point.

Is your daughter 4? 8? 12? Or 14?

As depending on her age (8+) you need to find out what she wants and she may be involved in the process.

If she is 12 then a Court may not grant you an order as she is seeing both parents regularly, while if she is 14 you definitely won't get one.

Remember if you get a Court Order you will be bound by it. So if your ex is controlling as you say, your DD is 8 and decides when she is 10 she wants to spend extra nights with you or you need to swap weekends he can cause you serious problems.

Btw when was your Parenting Plan agreed to? As before you go to Court you may have to attend mediation again.

amylou8 · 22/01/2023 06:01

My first question is also how old is she? Has she asked to stay longer? Is this a CMS thing to get out of paying if he has 50% custody.

Reugny · 22/01/2023 06:14

amylou8 · 22/01/2023 06:01

My first question is also how old is she? Has she asked to stay longer? Is this a CMS thing to get out of paying if he has 50% custody.

Firstly custody doesn't exist in the UK.

Secondly he won't necessarily get out of paying CMS or child maintenance.

lenalemonade · 22/01/2023 06:27

Does he pay child maintenance ?
A lot of men have suddenly realised that if they go for 50/50 arrangement that they don't need to pay .

Original poster

helplesshopeless · 22/01/2023 06:32

I feel like you are describing your daughter like a possession that you begrudgingly let your ex see for a short period of time rather than as a little girl who as a right to a relationship with her dad

I'm not sure how you've reached that conclusion given he has 6/14 so practically 50/50. I bend over backwards being flexible around what he wants, when he has work meetings, goes on holiday etc. however my daughter is only 5, she constantly expresses to me that when she is at his she's just waiting to come home to mine, she loves me more (I know that's just child talk but it's her way of expressing how she feels about things), she misses me etc. so until she stops saying those things so regularly I'm not going to readily agree to 3 nights away. I know it seems like a small thing as it's once a fortnight but once it happens it will snowball into the next thing that he will bully me into, and then the next, and so on. It's my only way of managing to give her some consistency in this shit all over the place pattern he bullied me into.

OP posts:

Original poster

helplesshopeless · 22/01/2023 06:33

Re maintenance, no I've never claimed it as he told me if I attempted to he'd take me to court for 50/50.

OP posts:

amylou8 · 22/01/2023 06:43

Reugny · 22/01/2023 06:14

Firstly custody doesn't exist in the UK.

Secondly he won't necessarily get out of paying CMS or child maintenance.

Show quote history

Award for the Sunday morning pedant goes to.....!

Ibouncetothebeat · 22/01/2023 06:44

50/50 is fair. She is both your child. As long as the 50/50 split is reasonable and you both get weekends and both are responsible for taking her to school ect. I think you need to consider 7/14. You are battling over 1 day, is it really necessary. It sounds like it a done in blocks rather than a whole week so it’s just 1 extra night tagged on a block.
As hard as it maybe you need to talk positively about her going to her dads and how much fun she will have. And she will start to talk positively about being there.

itsgettingweird · 22/01/2023 06:48

helplesshopeless · 21/01/2023 22:17

@ladymacbeth he's always hated not having his 'fair share' and says he has a right to have half of her time. It's a control thing I think, as well as the status of being able to say he has 50%, plus wanting to spite me (always a bonus for him!).

@Laurdo no, we don't have a court order in place. We agreed the initial pattern through solicitors correspondence and then adjusted it through mediation when she started school. He has a history of being controlling and abusive, yes. Thankfully not towards my daughter.

Is there any reason 50/50 wasn't set up at the start?

I absolutely think you need a court order but unless there's reasons why shared care shouldn't be provided it's very possible he'll get that.

Original poster

helplesshopeless · 22/01/2023 06:51

@Ibouncetothebeat thank you. And I do talk hugely positively about him. Whenever she says she doesn't want to go I'm always full of beans about how fun it'll be and how much daddy is looking forward to seeing her. When she tells me she loves me more, I just say 'that's ok, and mummy and daddy both love you lots and lots.' When she says 'daddy said that you're xyz' I just say 'oh isn't daddy funny, what a silly thing' etc etc. I couldn't be more positive and bloody overflowing with enthusiasm for him as far as she is concerned!

OP posts:

PortiasBiscuit · 22/01/2023 06:51

If he wants 50/ 50 and can genuinely manage 50/ 50 then I expect he’ll get that if you try any kind of mediation.
Not sure he shouldn’t have it if it is genuinely what he wants, he is her father.

Original poster

helplesshopeless · 22/01/2023 06:54

@itsgettingweird because she was 3, I worked part time to look after her and she was only in nursery 3 days a week. His work schedule wouldn't allow a full split when she wasn't in nursery 5 days. Outside of that, her whole life it was me looking after her and him dipping in for the fun stuff (and also giving us both the silent treatment if her toddler tantrums annoyed him). I don't even believe 50/50 is a good thing for such a young child, but that's irrelevant I suppose.

OP posts:

Sellorkeep · 22/01/2023 07:14

It’s weird to ask step-parenting for advice on this - there’s no step-parenting angle. But maybe there’s no board for parenting with an ex?
Anyhow it sounds like you need to contact your solicitor for advice. He sounds controlling and unpleasant - a court order would be the next step to formalise the frame work you originally drew up.

Reugny · 22/01/2023 07:19

amylou8 · 22/01/2023 06:43

Award for the Sunday morning pedant goes to.....!

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If the OP does decide to go to Court she would help herself by using the correct language from the beginning.

Reugny · 22/01/2023 07:21

@Sellorkeep you are they there is no step-parenting angle but the OP must have noticed there are more threads about contact arrangements in this section of MN than elsewhere.

Sellorkeep · 22/01/2023 07:49

Reugny · 22/01/2023 07:21

@Sellorkeep you are they there is no step-parenting angle but the OP must have noticed there are more threads about contact arrangements in this section of MN than elsewhere.

I know. I’ve reported my own comment to mumsnet to highlight I don’t think there’s an obvious board for ongoing parenting with an ex.
It annoys me that, as well as this place being a frequent pile-on to steps seeking a bit of support, that the shit ex stories land here too.

GoodChat · 22/01/2023 07:59

I’ve reported my own comment to mumsnet to highlight I don’t think there’s an obvious board for ongoing parenting with an ex.

There's a Parenting board and a Lone Parents board.

OP why won't you agree to 50/50 if it's only one extra night and he's a decent dad?