AITA? Splitting costs

[nora46]

Hello lovely ladies! This one needs a bit of context, but I'd be interested in your thoughts please.

DH and I have been married for three years, together for around seven. SD is now 10 years old. DH was in debt when we met despite a decent salary as he significantly overpaid his ex due to his paranoia about being seen as a 'bad dad' and her threats of taking SD away/taking him to court etc. He had some other previous debts too as they had taken out a loan to go to Disney and he had historic debt from a failed business venture.

Of course with the giant overpayments he was making to BM (now stopped and he is making CSA calculated payments) it took him a long time to get clear of debt and now he has 'usual' monthly credit card debt but not major, and is starting to get savings.

Throughout all of this I used my own savings to put down the deposit on our house, to pay for house repairs and for our wedding. He went through a period of self employment which I supported by paying more of the bills, for which he was very grateful, and he has been back in FT employment for nearly two years at his previous salary rate. He is gradually 'paying me back' (I put it in the savings acc I use for house things so it's really just going back into the joint pot which is in dire need of replenishment).

Our accounts are separate, because of his debt. We pay equally into a joint account for mortgage, bills and groceries.

So we are pretty much OK now though as we have a bigger mortgage I don't have the savings power that I used to, and my money pot is severely depleted.

When DH first moved in with me, we agreed that we would pay half each of bills and expenses and that DH would cover any additional costs for SD- days out etc.

Clearly this was a while ago, but it had continued ever since. I would sometimes pay 50/50 at meals etc if they weren't very expensive.

A few weeks ago, MIL wanted us to all go out for delayed birthday celebrations, which we did. I was on a tight budget so ordered pretty frugally and my meal came to about £20 all in. DH said SD could eat from the main menu rather than the (actually decent) kids menu, which is about £5 (which I had suggested). They spent around £70 between them.

MIL kindly paid for most of the overall bill so we only had £60 to pay her, which DH covered at the time. He then asked if I could transfer some money to him for the food. I said sure, I'd transfer £20 for mine, leaving the £40 for DH and SD.

DH got really angry about that. According to him that meant we weren't acting "as a family" and I am making SD to be his "problem" (his word, not mine!) and nothing to me etc. He really went off about it and has a short and fairly nasty temper when he does lose it so I didn't really weigh in at that time. He mentioned that I have paid for some things 50/50 which is why he was expecting it there. He also said that "other people" pay half. He didn't have specific examples, but that's partly why I'm coming here to ask.

So, I let it cool down and he apologised, though he wasn't clear what for. I put it down to stress around finances in general, but am pissed off that he a.) never ASKED for me to help out with this, just expected it b.) spent WAY more than I did c.) if he has been expecting me to pay too, my opinion on the kids menu should have been taken into account.

However, it's clear that he still somehow thinks that I should be paying for things like that. When SD had a friend over the following weekend, DH asked what the situation would be re paying for her and her friends' activities etc. At that point I just said we'd go to the splash park (free) then they could play at the house and I'll make a picnic. But the reality is I will definitely not be contributing to any days out, unless it's for my own ticket. I am, however, more than happy to help with the organisation of things, pack up picnics etc.

Clearly this needs addressing, especially as we're out for food on Saturday with SD, but before that I just wondered if I am actually BTA for not wanting to do this. I had considered whether we'd be better off pooling all of our money, but I'm not entirely comfortable that our spending goals are or will be the same, I'd say we have different money 'personas': his is affection, mine is security.

At this point I should say that DH earns a lot more than I do. He earns over £1.1k more than me every month (take home). His maintenance payments are just under £400 so he still has around £700 pm more than me. THIS is what gets me. I pay half of all bills, my savings have supported us for years and yet if I don't pay for half of SD's meals etc, despite having no say over what she spends, I'm "not being family".

I have a good relationship with SD. I do suspect that DH is sometimes secretly upset that we aren't a 'real' family and that I don't love her as if she was my own, but we just aren't. She has a mum and it's not me. SD and I are both OK with this and I take care of her just the same. She was really upset at something last week and DH didn't know what to do, so I dealt with it and he was immensely grateful.

So... and sorry for such a long post...
If you're in a similar situation do you split your money this way?
AITA ???

Long chat about what you have contributed financially to your lives.. And what he hasn't. He kept his ex happy and you paid the price literally for that
I have dc that aren't my dh's. He doesn't pay for frivalties for them. We have separate finances at my request..

Nothing about your current set up is at all okay. He is taking the piss big time.

You're totally in the right Op - he's well out of order. You need to speak to him frankly about this and tell him that clearly. I actually think its unfair given how much more he's earning each month that he's not paying more of the bills or putting more into your joint savings as 50-50 doesn't sound right because of that. Sounds to me like he's taken you for a mug, sorry!

If you ignore what you have paid in passed then 50:50 still doesn’t work as SD expenses will only go up and like the meal be another adult price. Is there reason why when he has £700 more a month than you that he needs you to cover extra £20. But late to demand we are a family after you paid thousands out. It makes him look really tight

Surely he should be utterly grateful to you for paying more than your share of everything since you met him. To me you’re over-committed. Given the disparity in salaries.

He’s a CF.

Ask him if this is really about money or something else?

And ask yourself if this financial set up is actually fair?

Cocklodger alert.

The fact that your savings are now depleted while his debt is paid off is ringing huge alarm bells for me. I am all for couples helping each other out but it seems that you have indirectly used your savings to pay off his debt and he now expects you to use what money you have left to supplement his costs for you children despite the fact he earns more.
In situations where the balance of spending has got a bit unfair then I would normally suggest having chat and gauging your partners reaction as they might be unaware of the difference but it seems unlikely that your husband is unaware given the magnitude of the discrepancy. I think he knows full well what he is doing.

If you're in a similar situation do you split your money this way?

No.
We rarely transfer cash to each other to cover things.

DP earns a lot more than me and has two children and also has far more assets / savings.

I live in DP's house so he pays the mortgage (it is simpler that way - I save "rent" which I will put towards a place we both own when we ready) and he already had gas + elec set up. I pay for other regular expenses (small things like netflix, coffee subscription and a couple of bigger things). I buy pretty much all the food including takeaways, meals out. I will also pay for holidays / weekends away / tickets for festivals and gigs and most other incidental expenses .Essentially he pay for us to live and I pay for us to enjoy our lives.

Obviously if I am buying food or a takeaway and DSCs are coming then I get enough for them. I also treat them to other things sometimes but this is always on my terms and not expected and my way of making up for the fact that he pays more expenses.

We have both saved more money since moving in together as both of our expenses went down. If one of us ended up worse off while the other benefitted we would talk about it and redress the balance. Why has this not happened with you and your DH.

😮 you’re being shafted here big time!

Honestly I don’t know what to say!

"And ask yourself if this financial set up is actually fair?"
I am OK with 50/50 on bills, and as he will be responsible for overpayment on mortgage etc, and covers extra expenses like the cleaner and building works. We have a spreadsheet of who spends what so we can see what each has contributed. If we split, I know how prepared he was to pay off his debts to BM, so I would expect the same.

I am not OK with paying extra for his child and will not start doing so (I did not send him extra for the meal).

"Ask him if this is really about money or something else?"

If he kicks off at this I will have to. I suspect that if it is about money it's that he feels he's still not fully in control of his finances and savings.

If it isn't, it could be that he sees financial contribution as being "family" and he specifically equates that to treats and trips- guilt parenting.

He sounds like one life's takers.

You've done nothing wrong. Apart from bailing him out for too long and now being taken for granted.

Are planning on having kids with him?

@TeapotCollection

😮 you’re being shafted here big time!

Honestly I don’t know what to say!

This! You need to lay it all out for him, exactly what you posted. You helped him get get out of debt, you've paid more than your fair share for years and he treats you like that! Losing his temper over a meal, one that you ordered a cheap one for yourself as you couldn't afford a dearer meal and his DD gets to eat what she like and you have to cough up half. I'd be launching that fucker out the door. Tell him op, he's taking the piss

I think you need to pick a time when you can say to him, coolly and calmly, how hurtful these wild accusations of 'not acting like family' have been when you've done the opposite. Give him a summary of what you said here in your first post. Tell him you need to think this over and that lashing out at you has actually made you question a number of things.

FWIW I think you're still getting a bad deal on 50/50. Me and DH earn the same now so we do this, but for ages when he earned twice what I did, he paid twice as much as me towards house costs and bills. At his own suggestion. This is the model I think you should have. And excluding money on the kids, which is absolutely his responsibility.

I'd also urge you to put his 'repayments' into your own personal savings to rebuild these, at least until you have the same amount he does saved.

Are you planning children together?

I think money is a tough area in step families. I find it a tricky area to navigate too. But try to speak about it openly so we know what to expect.

We split all house costs 50/50.

When it comes to the kids it varies. We split any ‘joint’ costs 50/50. We have decided to split birthdays 50/50, and things like school uniform. We have 2 DC each so generally this works out, though not always immediately.

However if his or my kids have extra costs we pay them ourselves. Any additional activities or treats we pay for our own DC. Because they are a choice and I don’t think that either 1. We should have to commit to paying the other parents choice or 2. Be limited on what we spend having to take the other persons view into account.

There might be times I want to treat my kids to something (dinner with friends/a nice meal out) that his wouldn’t want or enjoy or he wouldn’t want to pay. That’s his choice; so I will pay it, if I want to do it.

This is one of those situations I think. His choice and so he pays. You are paying your fair share of everything so he has no right to complain, you have also significantly helped him financially.

@excelledyourself

He sounds like one life's takers.

You've done nothing wrong. Apart from bailing him out for too long and now being taken for granted.

Are planning on having kids with him?

It's weird because he's not really, it's like he's told himself some narrative that made it OK for him to give so much to BM. I actually think he feels bad about it and then tries to justify why he did it, with the parent guilt coming into play. It's a really sensitive topic for him, possibly also because he had PTSD when I met him, from the relationship which was abusive. I had told him since that had he not changed the monthly payments (or seriously tried to) I would have walked as it was untenable. He is repaying my capital, and it remains in my control- it's not in a joint acc, but I still put it in and am gobsmacked he thinks I should pay any more. I think taken for granted, definitely.

No, I don't really want kids, though he is keen. For me it's a combination of things, but money is part of it. We'd have to sell the house as it's a bit of a money pit.

You already are subsidising by 50:50 of household costs especially when he has so much more disposable income than you.

His behaviour was horrible.

@Blendiful

I think money is a tough area in step families. I find it a tricky area to navigate too. But try to speak about it openly so we know what to expect.

We split all house costs 50/50.

When it comes to the kids it varies. We split any ‘joint’ costs 50/50. We have decided to split birthdays 50/50, and things like school uniform. We have 2 DC each so generally this works out, though not always immediately.

However if his or my kids have extra costs we pay them ourselves. Any additional activities or treats we pay for our own DC. Because they are a choice and I don’t think that either 1. We should have to commit to paying the other parents choice or 2. Be limited on what we spend having to take the other persons view into account.

There might be times I want to treat my kids to something (dinner with friends/a nice meal out) that his wouldn’t want or enjoy or he wouldn’t want to pay. That’s his choice; so I will pay it, if I want to do it.

This is one of those situations I think. His choice and so he pays. You are paying your fair share of everything so he has no right to complain, you have also significantly helped him financially.

Yes, it's definitely trickier. I definitely agree with the 'his choice' point. I know he would want to spend more on SD than I would- more meals out than my parents took me on at that age! Also if he can't afford to pay for SD's friends to do things, they can do something for free. After all, SD just wants to hang out with her friends, she doesn't have to go to the zoo for it.

He just gets so defensive sometimes I hate raising it, but I'm not going to spend more just to avoid conflict. The fact that there even is conflict makes me even less likely to consider doing anything more.

Paying jointly into a household account if fine, but I would suggest that you pay according to your income. If he earns twice what you eat, then he contributes £2 for every £1 you contribute.

Otherwise you are being shafted, even before you consider his child and your depleted savings.

Time for a reset.

Also not good to read that you are beginning to tip toe around his defensiveness. Bet he wasn't so defensive when you were subbing him so he could pay off debt.

He is well out of order. Anything you offer to pay towards his child should be recieved with gratitude not demands for more.

At 10 though she is a bit old for yhe children's menu (not the point I know)

And if he wants to be acting like a family he can start by paying more towards costs than you if his income is higher

I think there's two seperate issues here.

50/50 isn't fair for the bills when he earns more.

50/50 for meals - my H either pays for me and my two plus his when we're out or we go 50/50 even though mine are teens and his is 8. Honestly would hate to be with someone tight around meals out. But I don't think you're being tight when he isn't covering his share of the house. Me and H go 50/50 on bills but I buy more of the food as I have two teens. I think it will work out fair if we manage to make it to where my two have moved out and we still have his son at home for a good few years after (big age gap). When it will be me, H and dss we'll still go 50/50 if we don't decide to get divorced this weekend.

First off what does AITA and BTA stand for? They are new ones to me. And what's a 'money persona' ?

@StarryNight468

I think there's two seperate issues here.

50/50 isn't fair for the bills when he earns more.

50/50 for meals - my H either pays for me and my two plus his when we're out or we go 50/50 even though mine are teens and his is 8. Honestly would hate to be with someone tight around meals out. But I don't think you're being tight when he isn't covering his share of the house. Me and H go 50/50 on bills but I buy more of the food as I have two teens. I think it will work out fair if we manage to make it to where my two have moved out and we still have his son at home for a good few years after (big age gap). When it will be me, H and dss we'll still go 50/50 if we don't decide to get divorced this weekend.

The rest aside, do you think it would be that tight for me to not pay for SD when she has an adult price meal?

I assume your DH pays for meals for you and your two because he earns more than you? If DH paid for meals for me/SD more often I would probably be more more inclined to go 50/50 on family meals... He only buys me dinner on my birthday.

We split if it's just us two, though DH can be a little more spendy than me, I'm sure that probably evens out.

I don’t think you’re being unreasonable at all.

I have two step children. I’ll happily pay for groceries and the occasional day out (although being honest I usually choose something free, or that I can afford), a toy or book I thought they’d like but if DP chose to book dinner for us all, I would expect him to pay for the kids and so would he. He does not expect I would pay for his kids.

But I also don’t have any kids. And I think that makes a big difference to perspective - DP pays slightly more bills/mortgage because he earns more and because we have to have a much bigger house to accommodate his kids.

The key thing is choice. I can choose the shopping, I can choose where I take them and what that costs when I pay. DP can also do the same.

You didn’t offer to take them out for dinner. There was no expectation there that you’d pay. If I went out with my MIL, DP would more likely pay than me as it’s at his family’s request.

I do think you need to push a bit more and find out what the actual issue is, and to be certain he isn’t in trouble with money still because…it sort of sounds like he might be.

YANBU.
Bottom line if he doesn’t want to pay the adult price for his child, he should have told her to order from the child’s menu.
I hate this attitude. You were careful as you know you have to pay for yourself. Reminds me of going out for meals when others expect you to split the bill, err no thanks I’m not subsidising your lavish tastes.
As for not being a family and loving her like you would your own dd of course you don’t.
He sounds a bit dense. She is his daughter and already has a mum.

@nora46 no I don't think you're tight, especially when he only pays for you on your birthday! Me and H earn roughly the same amount - he earns a couple of hundred more but not every month (he's self employed) and I only pay for tickets to places or the odd takeaway when I've suggested it. We usually have a weekly nandos that he pays for and a date or weekend away on our eow off from all dc. Personally I think your dp is taking you for a mug with money the more you write! It's not normal for a dp to go 50/50 on meals out, he should want to treat you!