How many extracurricular activities are appropriate?

[NinaBernina]

Hi all
First post so please be gentle!
My partner has 2 lovely children (age 8 and 10) who live with their Mum.
They do loads of extracurricular activities which makes it really difficult for him to plan any time to do his own activities with them during his contact time. They always have some show/event/competition/training planned every weekend which their Mum insists they go to.
Is this reasonable? He's happy to support the children with their hobbies, but when it completely dominates the time he spends with them it seems a bit unreasonable?
I'd be interested to hear others' thoughts and how they manage with activities and separated parents.

@Checkingout811

It’s hard to strike a balance isn’t it. As if dad says “oh wouldn’t you rather come on holiday with me than do x again” of course they would say yes. I think as other posters have said, it’s about how important these are to the children but also if it would have a knock on effect eg are they competing at regional/county level. For example, my daughter is in the gymnastics squad and competes for our county. From the age of 4 she’s attended 2 nights per week. Some may find this excessive but DD loves it and is good at it, and that level of commitment is required for the level she is at. She also has performing arts on Saturday mornings 9.30-12.30 and she rides on Monday evenings. None of these I would be happy for her to miss on a regular basis, but she obviously misses them for holidays or birthday teas etc pre covid.

Thanks for your input. The children are not currently competing at regional or county level - I imagine if they were obviously destined for that level it would have been spotted by now - also several of the activities are non-competitive/creative/musical, but that's not to say that that makes the activity unimportant.

On the weekend your dh has them, could you say what the timings are of these clubs? Do they also do them in the week? What are they?

You can’t avoid things like birthday parties, it’s not fair. Also if they’re good at whatever club they’re doing, they need to be supported. They’re together on the way there and back and dad is there to cheer them on. Mum also loses time to these activities. At this age, clubs are part and parcel of having so many hobbies. Once they’re teenagers, it will settle down a bit.

I'd say there's a reasonable balance to be struck.. lead by what is important to the child (not their mother). Birthday parties they should be able to attend regardless of which house they're in. Similar with other social activities (which only seem to increase as they get older!!) and sports matches I have to agree teach hugely valuable life skills. Supporting these kind of things is part of parenting no?

@traumatisednoodle

and they should be able to attend Birthday Parties if they are invited. What is it you and their Dad want to do with rhem instead ?

@traumatisednoodle thank you for sharing your views - I'll try to answer all your posts in one - I can't work out how to quote multiple ones! Firstly I'll just point out it's definitely not me driving this! I actually think it's reasonable for him to take the kids to some activities, like some PP said, it's part of life and giving them these experiences is hugely valuable, but unfortunately the way in which he's being almost blackmailed into doing it with no discussion or compromise is wrong. I also think hanging out and going to the cinema is equally important as these organised activities - as well as chilling at home, playing board games, baking, spending time with Nanny etc, very few of which they get to do due to limited time.

I think I would perhaps try to do some stuff even without the DCs. Unless you are obliged to stand on the sidelines.
I think kids time can be far too organised. I liked lazing about at home, I didn't particularly like school.

Is it swimming Sat, football Sunday or are there a myriad of things, theatre, choir, music lesson squashed in, if the latter I would hint at better things you are doing without them. So they might suggest coming along.

@ALevelhelp

I think there's a balance to be had and the child's mum certainly shouldn't be dictating what happens on your weekends!

However, I'd try and do a bit of a mix. My ex never (and I mean never) allowed DS to attend anything on his weekend as it was his time to spend with DS. Fair enough, but as DS has now got to the age that he was more say over when he sees his Dad, he now doesn't really bother - he almost prioritises all of the things he was stopped from doing over his Dad.

I certainly would never have dreamt of telling ex what to do, but I did try and gently convince him to accept that DS wants to be able to do things that all other children do - but it's a balancing act isn't it? I think the problem with my Ex was that he couldn't see the importance of DS's beloved sports etc. A real shame as DS would have been so chuffed to have his Dad watch a match . The odd thing was that DS's stepdad loves taking DS to his sports etc, I think if I was my Ex I'd be making sure I got a look in too!

So yeah, I certainly wouldn't tolerate a timetable being given to me!! But I'd err on the side of doing what you can, whilst also enjoying other things with them.

thanks ALevel. I agree - like most things in life it's always a balancing act! The children definitely have a great relationship with their Dad, they love spending time with him, and complain that they don't get enough, but I know he accepts that they will start to do their own things and make their own choices as they get older. Part of him is, I think, being stubborn as (like most of us) he doesn't like being told what to do, especially not blackmailed. We always try to fit in as much as possible on the weekends they are here - I know I go back to work on a Monday for a rest!

@SquashedTomatoesAndStew

I think if OH does speak with them, it’s important to communicate that with their mum too. You don’t want them discussing one thing with them and their mum discussing a different message with them.

thanks - yes that's definitely been an issue before now... Will suggest he treads carefully!

@Bibidy

I think their mum is out of order here, they shouldn't be doing so much that their time with their dad is controlled by it.

My SS does football, he does training during the week but he misses matches on his weekends with DP (we live far apart) - the coach knows and it's totally fine. Lots of kids must be in the same situation. The odd occasion when it's an important game, DP will go up and stay so SS can attend.

Is it possible for your DP to speak directly to the instructor of the activities that impact the most on his time and see how the ground lies for them missing every other weekend (or whatever it would be)?

Thanks Bibidy. I'm sure lots of kids are in the same situation, but if we lived further away then I think Mum would just stop them coming completely. (She did this after the divorce - as she and the children remained in the FMH and he couldn't afford anything locally so had to move in with parents over 100 miles away) I really don't know what the kids would say if someone completely neutral asked them what they actually wanted to do!

I think if it’s all day on both days then it’s too much; I would say that even taking the contact issue out it’s too much for a child to have weekends always filled like that. A morning activity would be fine in my opinion and the odd competition so that activities can still happen and weekends away would be up to the dad to decide on.

Since their dm seems quite manipulative, I think your dh should take this to court to remove some of her power. They could then discuss activities as part of mediation. I think they should be able to attend birthday parties if they want to but activities should be kept to 1 each at weekends.

I'm sure lots of kids are in the same situation, but if we lived further away then I think Mum would just stop them coming completely. (She did this after the divorce - as she and the children remained in the FMH and he couldn't afford anything locally so had to move in with parents over 100 miles away)
I really don't know what the kids would say if someone completely neutral asked them what they actually wanted to do!

Hmm yeah see that's a bit of a red flag to me, like maybe mum is on purpose booking the children up to control/limit their time with their dad.

If I were your DP I'd be very temped to call the leader/instructor just to get some info on how it would work if they were to miss a few weekends.

I think it's tricky because they're at an age where trying lots of things out is what most kids are doing.

I have similar aged dc and our weekends are a whirl of swimming, gymnastics, football etc and mine really really don't like missing something. I really think birthday parties shouldn't be missed when they restart too. You don't want the dc to feel they're missing out or not getting picked for the team or a performance because they're not at all practices etc.

This sounds much more about each parent wanting to be in control and not about what is best for the children or what they want to do. Dc shouldn't have to bear the brunt of the consequences of their parents' separation.

I guess it depends on what it is.

If it's a weekly 30 minute swimming lesson it could be done on the weekday the parent who books it has the child or a weeknight and share travel etc.

If it's that they go to football an evening a week and then matches are a weekend then that's something that is harder to separate. The weekend parent should facilitate attending the match and be there to support them. But if they also want a weekend away they can have that but they are responsible for telling the coach they cannot attend a match that day. Lots of children who live with bath parents will also have weekends they can't play.

If they swim for a club weeknight and comps are some weekends - again that weekend the parent should take them but they should also be asked first if they have other plans.

So really it needs to work for both parents and things like a 30 min swim lesson shouldn't be booked for NRP contact time, and play dates etc.

I don't understand why he can't take them camping?
He should be able to take them away and they just miss activities for that weekend.

Maybe another way of solving this is having him come over a day or so a week extra? As dsds have got older we've moved to them coming over for dinner more in the week as they have their own social lives at the weekend, or did before Covid

@KylieKoKo

Maybe another way of solving this is having him come over a day or so a week extra? As dsds have got older we've moved to them coming over for dinner more in the week as they have their own social lives at the weekend, or did before Covid

Great idea if doable

I think you’re playing with fire, if you reduce their activities their mother may well make good her threat to withhold contact, and or the children may resent you.

No one regrets the activities they did as a child but many people regret not doing enough.

Just to say they did also continue tostay here at weekends but would often be out at parties, hobbies or seeing friends in that time which we facilitated. We live pretty close to them though so its easier for which ever parent they are with to do this.

My kids did activities every weekend term time from age 8, it's normal whether parents are separated or not. It's a shame if kids can't play on a sports team or in an orchestra because one parent doesn't support their hobby. Surely the answer is to work out a child contact arrangement around the activities.

Ps attending weekly was part of the agreement, we could sign them out once or twice a year no more

@minniemomo

My kids did activities every weekend term time from age 8, it's normal whether parents are separated or not. It's a shame if kids can't play on a sports team or in an orchestra because one parent doesn't support their hobby. Surely the answer is to work out a child contact arrangement around the activities.

In this scenario it doesn't seem like there is much 'around the activities' to make plans in - sounds like every weekend is booked up with something, meaning dad can never take them out for the day or away anywhere.

Surely in a situation with separated parents, where the hobbies massively impact on the limited time one parent has with the children, signing them up should have been discussed between the parents beforehand? And an agreement should have been made - or should be made NOW - about how often things can be skipped if it falls on the time of the NRP?

My SS does football but misses every other weekend when he's with us, unless it's an important game or the only one scheduled for a few weeks. He is still able to train twice during the week and plays in matches on his weekends with his mum. He's only missing twice a month, it does him no harm and allows him to actually do things with his dad.

Btw should add that the reason he has to miss it is because we live too far away to take him (mum moved way after split). Otherwise I think my DP would take him on his weekends but would also expect some flexibility considering his time with him (and his little sister) is limited.

@paralysedbyinertia

Yeah, I can see that it's difficult to know exactly where/who the push is coming from. I can only suggest that you and/or your DH try to have some general chats with them around their activities to get an idea of what they actually feel. Which ones do they like best, what do they enjoy about them, are there any aspects that they don't like etc. If it's just general conversation, rather than a choice about whether they want to do x or y this weekend, hopefully you'll be able to get a better idea of what these activities actually mean for the children.

I think this is a good idea. General relaxed conversation with no mention of would you rather do Y. Find out how they really feel. Personally unless the activities are truly being driven by the DC and not their mum I would be trying to find some more balance between activities and time spent together. It's important they get quality time with their Dad.

Op what happens if the ex wants to take them away? Do they miss the activities then?

It seems really unfair he can't even take them camping, time like that is really special for kids with their parent/s.

Many thanks everyone for all the posts and private messages I've received - I really appreciate you all taking the time to share your experiences and suggestions for how to make things better!

I was trying to reply to all comments and suggestions but I'm sorry I just can't keep up!

I guess what this thread shows me is that there are lots of different arrangements across a whole range of situations that everyone believes are perfectly reasonable!
As suggested, I will get my partner to try to find out what the kids REALLY want to do in a non-pressured way where they are not being asked to make a decision on X or Y, and we can go from there.
Hopefully they will want a balance of planned activities, and unstructured time at home or spontaneous trips away.