Step-siblings and boundaries

[ThisMustBeMyDream]

Hi,
Just need to check this with other step parents.
What do you do with young children and dressing/undressing and bathing?
I have an almost 3 year old dsd. I have two boys, 6 and 4.
We let them lead the way with what they are comfortable with. The younger two like to have a bath together, to play.
They are all naked around each other when they are getting ready as they generally still don't have inhibitions. Dsd is still very much in the strip off at every chance phase. We follow the pants rule so they all know what is off limits etc and they are generally supervised at all times other than sleep.
They all sleep in the same room, in their own beds.
They will all have suitable rooms/privacy at the right times, but for now they are little, and our set up seems quite normal for siblings. If they were direct siblings I wouldn't be doing anything different. Neither would her dad.

Mum isn't happy as you can probably guess. Dsd appears to have said about boys having willys and girls have (not sure what term she used but some term for girl bits). Mum said she shouldn't know such rude things. Obviously I don't think for one minute knowing body parts is rude. Dad doesn't either. Me and dad parent very much the same. Mum parents very differently and is very agressive when she doesn't like something. Just want to check what other step parents of young children are doing around this issue before my OH addresses this himself.

We will agree to disagree.

Sorry if that was my 3 year old daughter I wouldn't want her being naked around a 7 year old boy. It's her daughter, you need to respect her wishes even if you don't agree.

Have to say it would make me uncomfortable and the ‘what if’ is so....life-long damaging to all concerned that I am just not sure it could ever be worth the risk. You are of course right, OP, your house your rules. But maybe this is an argument you don’t need to win.

Between who?

ThisMustBeMyDream you said that your DP makes parenting decisions for his dd and you make them for your Dses.

I said that when it comes to decisions like bedrooms and bathtimes it is not a unilateral decision. You and your DP had to have decided that together.

FWIW, I don't think that dsd's dm can force you to change what you do, as your DP has parenting responsibility when she is with him.

But, your thread shows that she is not being weird or unusual in voicing her dislike.

Teaching children to keep healthy boundaries is important and there are many who see your choices as potentially confusing that especially as the children are not siblings.

You disagree. But it is not something that is an example of your DP's ex being unreasonable because it is a view shared by others.

I wondered if it had meant us or him and mum. Thanks for clarification.

OH let me know that he called social services this morning and asked if a) she had reported it as a concern (she said she had). And b) what their advice would be.

They said that they had no record of a complaint. Their advice was that it is a parenting choice, and would be left between parents to decide as it isn't of any concern to them.

OH said he rang because at drop off this morning she started to rant and was saying she would deny contact. He did manage to calm the situation and actually get to the crux of the issue. Turns out dsd was running around saying she had a willy. Mum said she shouldn't know boys and girls have different parts at her age. She said if she had a boy that she would never let them see each other naked. From birth.

OH is clearly not going to change on his opinion. I mean, what can you say to that?

So we will continue to educate the children, and offer privacy when they show signs of wanting it, or we think it is time to change arrangements.

Sorry but mum's opinion on this trumps dad's and should be respected. Perhaps if it was dsd's dad supervising and not you it would be a different issue but why does Mom have more say? Because its a daughter not a son? Would Dads opinion win if it was boys bathing with girls?

Whilst I agree the situation you describe is not a safeguarding issue per se (and no one on the thread has suggested they thought it was right now), I'm confused as to why bathing the children together is such an important thing to you and your DP.

Your DP is co parenting in what you tell us are very difficult circumstances. Insisting on bathing his DD with your DS seems an odd issue to dig your heels in about, when you know it is having negative repercussions for dsd at home with her dm.

He isn't insisting - the children are. They want to bath together as we have a shit tonne of bath toys, and it is one of their favourite things to do.

Pop a pair of swimming bottoms on each so they can still have a fun splash around.

No one loses out in the fun and you have boundaries that no one could challenge .

Boys and girls won't be naked with each other at school. You are going to have to explain such things soon, so why not now as part of growing up etc. It might be earlier than you'd thought but why would it be problematic?

God i really hope my ex gets with a woman who respects my wishes about my DD. You didn't need to post on here OP, i see you wont be budged. I think if the mother has anything to say in future you'll get your back up and argue black is white. Also, it wont be long before the accusations come out, safeguard your sons from them and put bathers on them if they insist on bathing together. Im sure this will go straight over your head though...

I see you didn't read the thread. I have nothing to do with the situation other than being fine with them bathing together. OH does the baths. He does all the care for his own child. His decision for his child.

My three kids shared a room until they were 12-11-8 we didn’t have a choice as we didn’t have any extra rooms till eldest was 12. They all shared a bath until they said they wanted a bath by themselves I think the eldest was about 8. They didn’t abuse each other it was just normal. They are grown up now and have never said they thought it was strange. When they finally all got their own rooms i regularly found the youngest in one of the other kids beds. Apparently it was lonely not having anyone with them.

How long have you two been together?

I've already answered that question upthread. 2.5 years.

I don’t think it’s particularly weird that the 3&4 year old share - my brother is my half brother although we grew up together and we bathed together, can’t remember when that stopped but maybe around 5ish? We also slept in the same room until 8 or 9 and when my cousins stayed (similar ages) they shared the same room too and we never thought it was weird.

You say mum parents very differently - what do you mean?

There is no doubt that my EX and I parent differently - but I do enforce some of his rules in my house ( and he does the same for me) There is nothing inherently wrong with either of our view points but we do aim fro some consistency.

Has she been coming 4 nights per fortnight for 2.5 years or is this a new set up.

my brother is my half brother although we grew up together and we bathed together,

The difference here is that the children are not related. Your (half) brother will always be your (half) brother AllTheGlitter

These 2 children could be bathing naked (for the time being) and sharing a room for the next few years, then the parents split and they go back to being unconnected. But, they could still be at the same school, or go to the same after school activities etc ....

I simply think its prudent, to take that into account. Parents may treat them as siblings but the reality is they are not. There are very few things that this would effect, but it just seems sensible to respect those boundaries.

I can give examples of how our parenting differs I suppose. Not sure how helpful it is though as it isn't going to change anything other than acknowledging the very different ways we do things.

She smacks the children. We don't.
She has told her step daughter to hit her other daughter to "teach her a lesson" when her own daughter hit her stepdaughter.
She moved her new partner in when dsd was 1 month old and did the whole calling him daddy thing, photos on facebook from him calling his daughter and her 2 daughters "his girls". They split up recently. Now dsd wonders where daddy has gone. She has always been confused over who daddy is.
She considers dsd to have a healthy diet, but it is the opposite. Full of salt and refined sugars. Dsd is overweight unfortunately according to the HV. She says it is a load of crap.

There are lots of ways we differ. It is hard to get a flavour of someone from some snippets though. These are just off the top of my head things that we haven't or won't do.

No, the contact isn't new. Court gave him increasing contact 3 times a week building up to overnights. He has been having her overnight since she was 18 months. He had to go to court as sorting it between them didn't work. Mediation failed. She cancelled contact all the time for spurious reasons as well as some genuine ones. The first court hearing was when she was 11 months old. I met her when she was 22 months old.

She has arrived this evening. First thing she has said to me is "my mummy say I not have bath with those naughty boys".

And yes, her mum has called my children "those naughty boys" to my OH. So it is definitely a repeat of what her mother has said.

Look,you need to stop bathing her with her brothers. It is really that simple. Just stop.

@GertiMJN These 2 children could be bathing naked (for the time being) and sharing a room for the next few years, then the parents split and they go back to being unconnected. But, they could still be at the same school, or go to the same after school activities etc ...

Very true, never thought of it that way!

I wouldn't want my 3 YO DD bathing with another boy. She has a make cousin the same age and I wouldn't have bathed them together at that age when he slept over.

She is not alone in being uncomfortable about this.

These 2 children could be bathing naked (for the time being) and sharing a room for the next few years, then the parents split and they go back to being unconnected. But, they could still be at the same school, or go to the same after school activities etc

Even if the family don’t split, for step siblings living in the same community, attending the same school or with mutual friends from out of school activities, things potentially get very murky the older they get. Imagine the taunting, name calling and outright bullying that could result from ‘we used to play in the bath together’ as they move through the teenage years.

Not the case here. 19 miles between mum and us. Child will go to school there. OH isn't from round here. He came 250 miles north for uni and has moved around towns since. He would probably live in the next town to his daughter if we hadn't met (won't live in the same town due to mums previous behaviour and he doesn't need the stress of being local to her for professional reasons).

You need to stop bathing then together.